Low estrogen doses normalize testosterone and estradiol levels?

[Linde]

I prefer organic uranium!   

That's another thing that annoys me, people misusing the word "organic".  It means carbon based, but somehow got hijacked into meaning healthier.  Well, just about everything we eat or drink, other than water, is organic as it's all carbon based.

http://projects.thestar.com/organic-milk/

I am so with you on this!  Clever marketers hijack a word, and change it into a buzz word, and the masses fall for it!

[Paige]

That's another thing that annoys me, people misusing the word "organic".  It means carbon based, but somehow got hijacked into meaning healthier.  Well, just about everything we eat or drink, other than water, is organic as it's all carbon based.

http://projects.thestar.com/organic-milk/

Hi Anne,

There are lots of words in the English language that have more than one meaning.  Organic is one of them. 

As for the Star piece, I remember when it came out.  Their testing was anecdotal at best.  They tested one sample of organic milk and one sample of normal.  I also noticed they didn't test for glyphosate which is probably the most widely used pesticide right now.  Also passing a pesticide test doesn't guarantee a healthy product.  There's a  lot more to milk than being pesticide free.

All that aside, if I was going to develop a test to discredit organic agriculture, I would sure pick this example.  Canadian dairy cows are treated like gold whether organic or not.  Dairy farmers in Canada make a lot of money because of the supply management system.  They have the money to spend on improving their farms.  They're much less likely to cut corners than struggling dairy farmers in other countries.

It's funny they didn't do the expose on apples or strawberries.  If you want to get a good dose of pesticides that's where you should start.

Take care,
Paige

[AnneK]

If you want to get a good dose of pesticides that's where you should start.

Well, as long as they're organic pesticides.   

Closer to the original topic, I've finally got my endocrinologist appointment booked for April.  I'm looking forward to seeing what effect hormones have on me.

[Joelene9]

A study was done in the early 1980's concerning men and heart disease. A group of older men was given low doses of E with another group, with placebo, to see if that would decrease the chance of heart disease as women in that age group has less of a chance. The result was the opposite. No mention in the article back then of mood swings, just a heart disease study.

Joelene

[JanePlain]

I disagree that words don't (always) have meaning.  Yes however to the misuse of "natural"   Such as Natural Uranium versus what?  Supernatural?  Uranium is indeed natural but never a good choice for adding to breakfast foods.  How you make Uranium supernatural is?  Satanic magic uranium? 

That said I prefer human identical hormones over equine (Horse urine) based types.  I thought the results of the study that told women not to use HRT after menopause was flawed because all they tried were equine hormones.   If the study had half of the women using human bio identical hormones and half using equine (horse) Hormones I think the study would have been more useful..  I think it was also an error to take much older women (Far from going into menopause) large doses of equine hormones and assuming that age was not a factor.   

Stating it more simply.  Women who have been in menopause for 20+ years given large doses of oral equine hormones had increased health problems.  Really?  Well Duh!  If the study was taking 80 year old men and injecting them with teenager levels of testosterone caused health problems it would have been laughed at but do this study with horse urine testosterone?  Doctors would pass out laughing.  The people doing these "tests" that change the way care is given need more supervision or oversight.  Or possibly just education on how a test should be conducted?

Show results using a specific age range.  Such as women who have been in menopause for 1 year or less.
Use more then one form of estrogen.  *And insist one be bio/human identical. 
Use more then one form of delivery.   Maybe not bother with forms already not considered safe.

I'm tempted to suggest that no one wants to study bio identical (Human) estrogen because you can't patent something that God invented. 

Oh, and I didn't bother to mention it because I'm not 100% sure it was done this way but I believe oral forms of equine hormones were not tested versus transdermal forms.  Since its common knowledge that this route (which hammers the liver) is not healthy so...  why limit the study in this way?   

And then waving this thing around like its not highly flawed and freaking out doctors and patients?  All that test proved to me is that I don't want to take oral equine hormones.

I have read also that men taking estrogen have seen health improvements as odd as that might sound.

[Linde]

As a medical professional who was/is a study object (National Lung Study,  Global Human Genome Mapping), and a person who initiated studies (preoperative shaving vs clipping, slow release iodophor for the reduction of surgical infections), i can only say that it is important to know, who initiated a study, who financed it, what was the purpose/expected outcome of a study, was the study peer reviewed, and how was the study/results published.

If those identifiers are unknown, the results are nothing but "nice to know", and I have to take a look at this in the future.

The scientific value, and any recommendation based on his, would be close to zero!

[Devlyn]

As a medical professional who was/is a study object (National Lung Study,  Global Human Genome Mapping), and a person who initiated studies (preoperative shaving vs clipping, slow release iodophor for the reduction of surgical infections), i can only say that it is important to know, who initiated a study, who financed it, what was the purpose/expected outcome of a study, was the study peer reviewed, and how was the study/results published.

If those identifiers are unknown, the results are nothing but "nice to know", and I have to take a look at this in the future.

The scientific value, and any recommendation based on his, would be close to zero!

Yup. You can get a study to prove anything you want it to...and no one does a study without being paid, by someone, to do it. Here's a prime example.

Study 'Proves' Parachutes Don't Save People Who Fall Out of Airplanes

Added bonus, this study is all natural and organic. 

[AnneK]

Our groundbreaking study

The test subjects must have landed really hard!   

[JanePlain]

Well, as long as they're organic pesticides.   

Closer to the original topic, I've finally got my endocrinologist appointment booked for April.  I'm looking forward to seeing what effect hormones have on me.

Congrats! 

[JanePlain]

As a medical professional who was/is a study object (National Lung Study,  Global Human Genome Mapping), and a person who initiated studies (preoperative shaving vs clipping, slow release iodophor for the reduction of surgical infections), i can only say that it is important to know, who initiated a study, who financed it, what was the purpose/expected outcome of a study, was the study peer reviewed, and how was the study/results published.

If those identifiers are unknown, the results are nothing but "nice to know", and I have to take a look at this in the future.

The scientific value, and any recommendation based on his, would be close to zero!

Another study that seems (to me) to have been done so badly is the one that says the PSA (Prostate Cancer test) is of no value because most prostate cancer grows slowly.  Really?  Too bad for the people I know that didn't get the nice kind of cancer.   

[Linde]

Another study that seems (to me) to have been done so badly is the one that says the PSA (Prostate Cancer test) is of no value because most prostate cancer grows slowly.  Really?  Too bad for the people I know that didn't get the nice kind of cancer.

I know some of them, too.  And once they found out (like my brother in law) it had already advanced into bone caner and killed them shortly thereafter!
I am getting my annual PSA test, and don't want to end up with the horrible bone cancer others got!
Us girls, who were born as males, still have to deal with the male stuff, but on the positive side, most of us do not get ovarian cancer!

[JanePlain]

I know some of them, too.  And once they found out (like my brother in law) it had already advanced into bone caner and killed them shortly thereafter!
I am getting my annual PSA test, and don't want to end up with the horrible bone cancer others got!
Us girls, who were born as males, still have to deal with the male stuff, but on the positive side, most of us do not get ovarian cancer!

Of the people I know that had prostate cancer none of them died from something else first.  It might be me being paranoid but things that cost money seem to more and more be suddenly no longer needed.

[Linde]

Of the people I know that had prostate cancer none of them died from something else first.  It might be me being paranoid but things that cost money seem to more and more be suddenly no longer needed.

Don't forget, the US health insurance system is a for profit system!  If the shareholders don't see a return on their investment, they pull out and the CEO's are sitting there without money to pay their salaries!

Not spending money means increased profitability!

If you would have come to me with the request to do a study for XY, and you would have waved with a big bundle of money, I would have asked you what your desired outcome is, and I would have delivered this outcome, bundled in a nice scientific report!  Money talks, scientist need to feed their families, too!

[JanePlain]

The corruption involved in US insurance or just the totally bad science is an abomination.   

[Linde]

The corruption involved in US insurance or just the totally bad science is an abomination.

I think you have this kind of corruption in those businesses all over the world.  I worked for many years in Europe, and did not see a lot of difference, once the top cover up layer was pulled away!

[Paige]

Of the people I know that had prostate cancer none of them died from something else first.  It might be me being paranoid but things that cost money seem to more and more be suddenly no longer needed.

Hi JanePlain,

This is anecdotal as well but I've had a different experience.  My father had prostate cancer in the 1990s, he died last year of old age / heart failure at 86.  I had a friend who got prostrate cancer in the late 90s, he was 51.  Lucky for him the new radioactive seed technology had just been developed.  He's still alive.

I believe both found out originally by high PSA tests.  They would probably have died earlier without this.  It's a tricky thing though, the test isn't that accurate.  If there are too many false positives you can cost the medical system a lot in biopsies.   I think the same problem exists with mammograms. 

I thought the general rule of thumb was to worry much more if the person was younger.  For older men (70s+) their's isn't usually as aggressive and many die from other things first.

There's a lot of nuance to this.
Take care,
Paige

[Linde]

Hi JanePlain,

This is anecdotal as well but I've had a different experience.  My father had prostate cancer in the 1990s, he died last year of old age / heart failure at 86.  I had a friend who got prostrate cancer in the late 90s, he was 51.  Lucky for him the new radioactive seed technology had just been developed.  He's still alive.

I believe both found out originally by high PSA tests.  They would probably have died earlier without this.  It's a tricky thing though, the test isn't that accurate.  If there are too many false positives you can cost the medical system a lot in biopsies.   I think the same problem exists with mammograms. 

I thought the general rule of thumb was to worry much more if the person was younger.  For older men (70s+) their's isn't usually as aggressive and many die from other things first.

There's a lot of nuance to this.
Take care,
Paige

The first line of defense for guys (and for us ladies) should be the friendly palpating finger of your physician in our rear end. And for us ladies it should be self examination of our breasts that we are so proud of.

Hardly any of the cis women I know, do it.  I wonder how many trans girls do it? 
We are really scre***, we can get the prostate thingy and the breast stuff!  Life can be fun sometimes!

[Paige]

The first line of defense for guys (and for us ladies) should be the friendly palpating finger of your physician in our rear end. And for us ladies it should be self examination of our breasts that we are so proud of.

Hardly any of the cis women I know, do it.  I wonder how many trans girls do it? 
We are really scre***, we can get the prostate thingy and the breast stuff!  Life can be fun sometimes!

I wonder if there's been any research on trans-females likelihood of getting prostate or breast cancer.  I would suspect the HRT would reduce the likelihood of prostate. 

I would also wonder if the new development of breast tissue in older transitioners would mean that breasts would be less likely to develop cancer?  And would young transitioners' cancer risk be the same as cis-women of the same age? 

Interesting topic I wish there was research on this.
Paige

[Devlyn]

I wonder if there's been any research on trans-females likelihood of getting prostate or breast cancer.  I would suspect the HRT would reduce the likelihood of prostate.

I would also wonder if the new development of breast tissue in older transitioners would mean that breasts would be less likely to develop cancer?  And would young transitioners' cancer risk be the same as cis-women of the same age? 

Interesting topic I wish there was research on this.
Paige

I've had this discussion with my doctor. No idea if it lessens the chance of cancer, but it doesn't lower the chances of getting the exam.   

She said that after five years of HRT, I'll start getting mammograms, too.

[mm]

Best when we still have the organs to get tested, trans girls need to get their prostrate and breasts checks and guys their ovaries if they still have them and breasts if there is any breast tissue left after top surgery