Does it hurt us to be in stealth?

[Sheila]

Steph, what you said is what I have been trying to say. I'm just not that good with words  and they always come back to haunt me. I also live in a medium size town I guess, 200,000 people. I got involved in the politics of the city and I have been out since day one. The mayor sent me a card when I went to Thailand for surgery and so did a reporter from the newspaper. I got a card from the city council wishing me good luck and other get well cards from others. It wasn't a party but hey we should have had one. I do get respect from everyone and I don't ever get harassed. People remember me and at times I get put at the head of the line when waiting to go eat on a Friday evening without reservations. Never had that before or maybe they are hiding me?
Sheila

[cindianna_jones]

Sheila.... it's because you are friendly and very kind.  Some people just can't resist returning the favor. 

Cindi

[cindybc]

Hi Cindi that is a really nice way to put it. Yes if you go out with an upbeat attitude, I can personally vouch that it works quite well.

Cindy

[Alison]

Going to ask a potentially stupid question but I am really curious:

What does 'stealth' entail?  I realize the obvious "no one knows".  But your parents know, your siblings.  You are members of a trans support website, aren't these all forms of being out?

Do you move away from your family? or does your family just not tell anyone?

I'm just curious and I really don't mean any offense at all.

[Rachael]

i have it easy, my parents wouldnt be seen dead telling anyone... and i dont see them anyway... so no danger, im simply dead to them.

as for internet forums? well, the internet is serious business as we all know... One could quite safely be stealth, and use a trans forum. Afterall, its nicknames, and possibly a photo or two, but without someone specifically knowing, its as pot luck as a background search, nobody is perfectly invisible, stealth is to me, and most, nobody knowing, or having reason to wonder in your day to day life. In my life, i have very little contact between the internet and my real life friends. My only google hit, is my name on an airsoft site forum, where you put your name in a thread to book in for events... this place doesnt even apear or any hint...
So stealth has flavours, true, if someone doesnt suspect, they wont look. A fed background check is sure as hell gonna turn something up or any govornmental. but that depends.

heres a theory, im moving to the us in 2 years time once i graduate, ill ahve been ft 2 years, so can get a new birth certificate here, and emigrate to the US... all things good, ill come in as a random british citizen, a female, and its unlikely any check in the us will turn up much unless govornmental and quite extensive. so is that stealth?
yeah maybe

then again, stealth can just be nobody knowing in your day to day life. My classmates dont know, my coleges at work dont, sure some friends do, but they never bring it up, its something from the past, that stealth? well i dont know, i like to think it is. but hey,
stealth is what you make it imo.
R

[tekla]

You do realize that the process requires a full physical from a USCIS approved doctor?

[Rachael]

imigration? meh, hurdle when i come to it,
R >

[joannatsf]

heres a theory, im moving to the us in 2 years time once i graduate, ill ahve been ft 2 years, so can get a new birth certificate here, and emigrate to the US... all things good, ill come in as a random british citizen, a female, and its unlikely any check in the us will turn up much unless govornmental and quite extensive. so is that stealth?
yeah maybe

then again, stealth can just be nobody knowing in your day to day life. My classmates dont know, my coleges at work dont, sure some friends do, but they never bring it up, its something from the past, that stealth? well i dont know, i like to think it is. but hey,
stealth is what you make it imo.
R

Why on Earth would you want to come to the USA?  I would trade places with you in a heartbeat!  When the Berlin Wall came down and Germany was repatriating Germans in Russia I was hoping they'd consider taking the American grand children of them.  Alas, it was not to be.  Before you rush to turn in your UK passport I'd spend some significant time here to learn just how wacky we are!

[Steph]

imigration? meh, hurdle when i come to it,
R >

There's lots of room here in Canada

Steph

[tekla]

I would imagine that its a lot easier to get into Canada from England than the US.  If you think your going "in stealth" pre-SRS though the INS as a female remember this... (And you're not, the INS is Federal Police Service of the United States, under the Department of Homeland Security, they are not minor players) any lie on an official US document is a Federal Felony, one that on entry and immigration stuff can place you under some pretty harsh laws - that can not be taken to, or overruled by, a federal court.  And if all you know of the States is what you know from the media, then its like me thinking all of England is like "Are You Being Served."  You might want to visit first.

[Berliegh]

heres a theory, im moving to the us in 2 years time once i graduate, ill ahve been ft 2 years, so can get a new birth certificate here, and emigrate to the US... all things good, ill come in as a random british citizen, a female, and its unlikely any check in the us will turn up much unless govornmental and quite extensive. so is that stealth?
yeah maybe

then again, stealth can just be nobody knowing in your day to day life. My classmates dont know, my coleges at work dont, sure some friends do, but they never bring it up, its something from the past, that stealth? well i dont know, i like to think it is. but hey,
stealth is what you make it imo.
R

Why on Earth would you want to come to the USA?  I would trade places with you in a heartbeat!  When the Berlin Wall came down and Germany was repatriating Germans in Russia I was hoping they'd consider taking the American grand children of them.  Alas, it was not to be.  Before you rush to turn in your UK passport I'd spend some significant time here to learn just how wacky we are!

You obviously have no concept of how bad it is for us in the U.K, especially if you are TS. There are no real therepists or treatment programs and the NHS is a horrendous experience for all of us. I would also be out of here like a shot if I had the finances to do so...

[Rachael]

long? yes, hornendous? i dont know yet!
Ive been given hrt, i might get surgery, sod the gic...

Im coming to the US because  Nobody knows me, everyone speaks bastardised english, and i atleast know something of the culture.
plus its not a bad place to live once transitioned and if you happen to have cisgender privilage.
transitioning? id still rather be in the uk... berleigh does profess its suckishness, but ive not noticed much sucking other than the Charring cross hospital. the rest seems ok tbh...
R

[Berliegh]

long? yes, hornendous? i dont know yet!
Ive been given hrt, i might get surgery, sod the gic...

Im coming to the US because  Nobody knows me, everyone speaks bastardised english, and i atleast know something of the culture.
plus its not a bad place to live once transitioned and if you happen to have cisgender privilage.
transitioning? id still rather be in the uk... berleigh does profess its suckishness, but ive not noticed much sucking other than the Charring cross hospital. the rest seems ok tbh...
R

Yes, I agree....the real bad apple is Charring cross hospital ....although according to Danielle (Fruity) GIC Nottingham has a bad reputation as well...

[Rachael]

Berleigh: true that. but then, leeds, sheffield, and calderdale are supposedly alright, as are most, and remember, you never hear the good stories, only the loud wronged people...
for whatever reason, i choose to see balence over one loud bad opinion.

Redfish: yeah, i know, pity i pick up accepts stupidly easily ><
R >

[joannatsf]

heres a theory, im moving to the us in 2 years time once i graduate, ill ahve been ft 2 years, so can get a new birth certificate here, and emigrate to the US... all things good, ill come in as a random british citizen, a female, and its unlikely any check in the us will turn up much unless govornmental and quite extensive. so is that stealth?
yeah maybe

then again, stealth can just be nobody knowing in your day to day life. My classmates dont know, my coleges at work dont, sure some friends do, but they never bring it up, its something from the past, that stealth? well i dont know, i like to think it is. but hey,
stealth is what you make it imo.
R

Why on Earth would you want to come to the USA?  I would trade places with you in a heartbeat!  When the Berlin Wall came down and Germany was repatriating Germans in Russia I was hoping they'd consider taking the American grand children of them.  Alas, it was not to be.  Before you rush to turn in your UK passport I'd spend some significant time here to learn just how wacky we are!

You obviously have no concept of how bad it is for us in the U.K, especially if you are TS. There are no real therepists or treatment programs and the NHS is a horrendous experience for all of us. I would also be out of here like a shot if I had the finances to do so...

You have no concept of how bad it is in the USA.  Yes, you can get therapists and such - if you have the money.  If you lack insurance you have no place to turn for the normal health problems and emergencies that crop up in life.  If you're insured or wealthy and lose a leg you can get the latest high tech prosthesis.  If you're not either of those things, you get crutches!  You do have private doctors and therapists you can see if you pay out of pocket don't you?  That's what you'll be doing here.

I'd listen to Tekla and Steph.  Canada is a better option.  If you live in the right province your transition needs will be handled.  I thought of moving there myself but I knew I couldn't take the winters (I'm a California girl) or distance from my kid.  They're not nearly as whacky as their neighbors to the south and kill each other far less frequently.  Oh, Canada!

[Berliegh]

Berleigh: true that. but then, leeds, sheffield, and calderdale are supposedly alright, as are most, and remember, you never hear the good stories, only the loud wronged people...
for whatever reason, i choose to see balence over one loud bad opinion.

Redfish: yeah, i know, pity i pick up accepts stupidly easily ><
R >

.....and I thought I was a very quiet, softly spoken and humble person .....some of the NHS Clinics you mention may be ok but it's very hard to get referred to one of those when you live near London. PCT's choose not to refer you out of their area so you never get to go where you might get some help.....

I think you don't get to hear the good stories because they are so rare and the bad stories are more likely.....I always heard good things said about private consultants like Richard Curtis and Russell Reid and bad one's about the NHS psychiatrists....but these were not just stories but real experiences from people who I have met in person.....plus my own experiences..

I have now realised there are ways round the NHS without ever getting involved in gender clinics. They are certainly not needed. What's needed are timescales and treatment programs and surgical technicians you can arrange appointments with........in the U.K there is too much emphasis on mental health issue's and psychiatry rather than the issue's of treatment...

[Rachael]

heres a theory, im moving to the us in 2 years time once i graduate, ill ahve been ft 2 years, so can get a new birth certificate here, and emigrate to the US... all things good, ill come in as a random british citizen, a female, and its unlikely any check in the us will turn up much unless govornmental and quite extensive. so is that stealth?
yeah maybe

then again, stealth can just be nobody knowing in your day to day life. My classmates dont know, my coleges at work dont, sure some friends do, but they never bring it up, its something from the past, that stealth? well i dont know, i like to think it is. but hey,
stealth is what you make it imo.
R

Why on Earth would you want to come to the USA?  I would trade places with you in a heartbeat!  When the Berlin Wall came down and Germany was repatriating Germans in Russia I was hoping they'd consider taking the American grand children of them.  Alas, it was not to be.  Before you rush to turn in your UK passport I'd spend some significant time here to learn just how wacky we are!

You obviously have no concept of how bad it is for us in the U.K, especially if you are TS. There are no real therepists or treatment programs and the NHS is a horrendous experience for all of us. I would also be out of here like a shot if I had the finances to do so...

You have no concept of how bad it is in the USA.  Yes, you can get therapists and such - if you have the money.  If you lack insurance you have no place to turn for the normal health problems and emergencies that crop up in life.  If you're insured or wealthy and lose a leg you can get the latest high tech prosthesis.  If you're not either of those things, you get crutches!  You do have private doctors and therapists you can see if you pay out of pocket don't you?  That's what you'll be doing here.

I'd listen to Tekla and Steph.  Canada is a better option.  If you live in the right province your transition needs will be handled.  I thought of moving there myself but I knew I couldn't take the winters (I'm a California girl) or distance from my kid.  They're not nearly as whacky as their neighbors to the south and kill each other far less frequently.  Oh, Canada!

That might matter if i had 'transition needs'

dunt need therapists
dunt need support groups
dunt need ffs/ba/stuff
dunt need to get diagniosed, as i have a script i can transfter according to my gp. if not, tinternet!
all i need is grs, which im probably going to thailand for anyway... cant hurt to be closer can it?
plus canada is too bloody cold
full of canadians
and cold...
R >

[Berliegh]

That might matter if i had 'transition needs'

dunt need therapists
dunt need support groups
dunt need ffs/ba/stuff
dunt need to get diagniosed, as i have a script i can transfter according to my gp. if not, tinternet!
all i need is grs, which im probably going to thailand for anyway... cant hurt to be closer can it?
plus canada is too bloody cold
full of canadians
and cold...
R >

I like it......and totally agree.....

If a hetrosexual woman wants a boob job or Facial surgery ...she doesn't have to go and see dozens of psychiatrists to get granted permission.......one day in the far distant future.... the psychiatry, psychotherapy and time wasting bit will be thrown out as the complete nonsense that it is.....

[Keira]

Berleigh, its already possibly to get FFS and a boob job without
a psychiatrist in the US and Canada and plenty of
other places (and if not in the UK,
which I'm not certain about, surely
on the mainland places like the netherland do it for sure).

[Berliegh]

Do the therapists in Britain (specifically the NHS ones) tend to take a more psychoanalytic/Freudish approach to therapy? I remember hearing something about Europe using a lot of psychoanalysis and Freudish stuff in my Psychology course, but I suppose that could have been a very ethnocentric view.

Over here, from what I've experienced, we seem to mostly have Behaviorist/Skinner types, Humanistic types, and most commonly combinations of the two. Just wondering if maybe the differences in therapy styles could possibly be one of the factors involved in the health system there.

Freudish approach? I've no idea....but the NHS psychiatrists over here in the U.K don't believe in transsexualism and have the 'beat it out of them' approach...towards patients....they have no targets or structured approach and will later write to your GP (doctor) about what clothes you were wearing at the appointment , rather than a constructed anylisis of the situation......they seem to have a lack of experience or knowledge and dislike anyone who may be well read in gender dysphoria...

If you mention the HBSOC or the physical proceedure's needed for a gender change they come back at you and say 'So you don't need us then' in order to pass the buck of their responsability towards your treatment....

basically it's true and they are not needed in our journey through transition...and are merely put there as a brick wall ...to block the way ahead..