Buddist views on being trans ?

[Jess42]

I might be able to shed a little light on this subject too even though it's a little older thread.

I was stationed in Korea for 2 years and for 18 months learned a little about Buddhism. Don't even know what sect and didn't even ask or want to know and not really important in my eyes. Spent a lot of time on the weekends talking to the monks in the temple about a mile or so outside of the gates. Started learning how to meditate. Learned how even the lowest lifeform among us serves a purpose and is important even the vermin and pests. It's not a 1,2,3 experience learning to meditate and actually, for lack of a better word, find your innerself. I have been doing it for almost twenty years now and still have a hard time. Trying to fully empty your mind is the hardest to overcome. Enlightenment comes in steps unless your spirit is much higher than what most, if not all are on this planet. How many people in this world would give up a kingdom to beg for food in order to seek enlightenment like the first Buddha? I wouldn't.

As for worldly attachments. Cars, homes, bank accounts and yes food and your body are and can be attachments. Anything can be an attachment, even the search for enlightenment. Food is meant to sustain the body. You can be attached to foods if you are eating for pleasure instead of sustanance. Transsexualism also can be an attachment if it's for gratifying the physical self. Same goes with homosexuality and heterosexuality. If you truly feel the opposite gender inside than what you are outside change it , because we have evolved to the point to where we can actually change the physical gender of the human body. Having technology and not using it doesn't make sense unless it is something used negatively. Or just embrace it and transcend the social gender roles. We are supposed to see ourselves as Spirits occupying and using a physical body instead of a bag of meat and bones that is conscious of itself. The whole thing in a nutshell is that we are supposed to let what is within project outward to the world. Sadly it is just the opposite, too many people let what is outward project in and taint the Spirit with materialism and that gets projected back out.

Karma is the idea of what you put out comes back to you. It can be in this incarnation, the next or later down the line but you will have to experience it unless you truly learn the Karmic lesson in this incarnation in which case you learned and don't have to experience it. Karma is not punishment but rather a learning lesson. If you cause pain then you have to suffer the same sort unless you change spirtually. I've since moved from Buddhism and into I don't know what to call it.

Enlightenment isn't a guarantee of supreme happiness, the end of pain and suffering and all the other bad things in this world but rather to accept all the ailments, pain and so on and use them to learn from. Like someone else said, you still have to chop wood and carry water. Even after enlightenment the first Buddha still begged for food and wondered the world but was teaching others about enlightenment. Enlightenment will however take away the fear of death and what is beyond even though we can't really comprehend it. It will let you see others as unique Souls too on differing paths. That you can face discrimination and hate but not hate and discriminate back. 

Since this is the Buddhism thread and the dynamics of reincarnation is such a big part of it. What I have learned from pastlife regressions, not mine because I choose not to know but in reading of others and my own meditation is that our Souls have aspects of both genders. Spiritually we are not male or female but both. Over time we become comfortable incarnating as one gender. Even spiritually we choose one gender's attributes but use the aspects of both. But after a while we have to incarnate into the opposite gender physically in order to get the whole experience of a physical existance. Does this mean that you shouldn't transition or embrace who you are inside? I don't know but pretty much believe, like all other spiritual matters, it is up to the individual Spirit. It could be a Karmic lesson for those of us to face discrimination. Could be to face your fears and apprehensions and present your innerself to the world. Could also be that we are a part of the lesson so that others can experience lessons about discrimination. It truly does show how the whole of human existance is tied together though. A good book to read on the subject of reincarnation is The Journey of Souls. I forgot the psychologist's name who worte it but it is enlightening (pun not intended).

[Anatta]

I might be able to shed a little light on this subject too even though it's a little older thread.

I was stationed in Korea for 2 years and for 18 months learned a little about Buddhism. Don't even know what sect and didn't even ask or want to know and not really important in my eyes. Spent a lot of time on the weekends talking to the monks in the temple about a mile or so outside of the gates. Started learning how to meditate. Learned how even the lowest lifeform among us serves a purpose and is important even the vermin and pests. It's not a 1,2,3 experience learning to meditate and actually, for lack of a better word, find your innerself. I have been doing it for almost twenty years now and still have a hard time. Trying to fully empty your mind is the hardest to overcome. Enlightenment comes in steps unless your spirit is much higher than what most, if not all are on this planet. How many people in this world would give up a kingdom to beg for food in order to seek enlightenment like the first Buddha? I wouldn't.

As for worldly attachments. Cars, homes, bank accounts and yes food and your body are and can be attachments. Anything can be an attachment, even the search for enlightenment. Food is meant to sustain the body. You can be attached to foods if you are eating for pleasure instead of sustanance. Transsexualism also can be an attachment if it's for gratifying the physical self. Same goes with homosexuality and heterosexuality. If you truly feel the opposite gender inside than what you are outside change it , because we have evolved to the point to where we can actually change the physical gender of the human body. Having technology and not using it doesn't make sense unless it is something used negatively. Or just embrace it and transcend the social gender roles. We are supposed to see ourselves as Spirits occupying and using a physical body instead of a bag of meat and bones that is conscious of itself. The whole thing in a nutshell is that we are supposed to let what is within project outward to the world. Sadly it is just the opposite, too many people let what is outward project in and taint the Spirit with materialism and that gets projected back out.

Karma is the idea of what you put out comes back to you. It can be in this incarnation, the next or later down the line but you will have to experience it unless you truly learn the Karmic lesson in this incarnation in which case you learned and don't have to experience it. Karma is not punishment but rather a learning lesson. If you cause pain then you have to suffer the same sort unless you change spirtually. I've since moved from Buddhism and into I don't know what to call it.

Enlightenment isn't a guarantee of supreme happiness, the end of pain and suffering and all the other bad things in this world but rather to accept all the ailments, pain and so on and use them to learn from. Like someone else said, you still have to chop wood and carry water. Even after enlightenment the first Buddha still begged for food and wondered the world but was teaching others about enlightenment. Enlightenment will however take away the fear of death and what is beyond even though we can't really comprehend it. It will let you see others as unique Souls too on differing paths. That you can face discrimination and hate but not hate and discriminate back. 

Since this is the Buddhism thread and the dynamics of reincarnation is such a big part of it. What I have learned from pastlife regressions, not mine because I choose not to know but in reading of others and my own meditation is that our Souls have aspects of both genders. Spiritually we are not male or female but both. Over time we become comfortable incarnating as one gender. Even spiritually we choose one gender's attributes but use the aspects of both. But after a while we have to incarnate into the opposite gender physically in order to get the whole experience of a physical existance. Does this mean that you shouldn't transition or embrace who you are inside? I don't know but pretty much believe, like all other spiritual matters, it is up to the individual Spirit. It could be a Karmic lesson for those of us to face discrimination. Could be to face your fears and apprehensions and present your innerself to the world. Could also be that we are a part of the lesson so that others can experience lessons about discrimination. It truly does show how the whole of human existance is tied together though. A good book to read on the subject of reincarnation is The Journey of Souls. I forgot the psychologist's name who worte it but it is enlightening (pun not intended).

Kia Ora Jess42,

That's an interesting take on what the Buddha taught...

Enlightenment can be liken to this ...The Buddha taught "The Middle Way"  enlightenment is the peaceful 'space' between  two extremes...

In a sense Buddhism does not hold any views on being 'trans' but it does on just 'being' 

Metta Zenda

[Jess42]

Thank you Kuan Yen. But I must clarify. Most of what I wrote aren't neccisarily the teachings of Buddha. I used Buddhism in the beggining because I really wanted to learn how to meditate and be able to shut all those random thoughts that run through you head off. I tend to shun organized religions because I don't want to be mired down by doctrines and such. It just so happens that my views fall into the same of Buddism. But they also fall into a lot of what Christ taught if you delve into and look for the actual teachings. Whole books were left out of the Bible because they didn't fall into the whole using Christianity as a means of controlling the masses. In other words eternal damnation or eternal bliss couldn't be held over your head if you know the Truth. The Book of Mary and the Book of Judah are two of them. There are others but I can't remember the titles. They're called the Gnostic Books and hint upon so much more than what the accepted books of the New Testament do pertaining to Spirituality. I believe just as much that Christ walked the earth as I do the prince that became the first Buddha. I view them as teachers and more advanced Spirits that come to us from time to time to prod our Spiritual evolution. There were others before Buddha. After Buddha came Yeshua or Christ and soon to be another. Seems to follow rough cycles of every 1800 to 2800 years when religions start dictating what Spirituality is and should be. When man has corrupted Spirituality to a point of a balloon about to bust through religious and governmental establishments. The Spirit starts longing for it's true identity and changes it's perceptions then comes somone to show us the direction to go. It's not a spontanious event though. It takes many years for a spirituality shift.

Total enlightenment is unachievable for us because our Spirits just aren't that advanced yet. If we were, we wouldn't be in an earthly existance, we would have long since moved on. To whatever what, I don't know but willing to bet that it is to advance Spiritually under different circumstances.

My path started as questioning why I was born a male when I longed to be female. Is this a curse or a tool to use? This gave me hints of human duality in which we are Spiritual and physical in nature. I was supposed to go to Germany but at the last minute the military changed it to Korea. Coincidence or not? Then being stationed at a post in which to have a lot of freetime and no field time with a Buddhist temple within walking distance with a monk who spoke and understood my native language good enough to communicate. Another coincidence? I am really starting to get the feeling in later years in my life that there are no coincidences but only choices we have made and are/or presented to us either incarnate or Spiritually before our incarnation. But what is right for me is not right for everyone. For me, I don't think I am supposed to transition. Even though I would love to. Back in the early nineties I even thought about moving to Trinidad CO. because of an article written in GQ, of all magazines, about SRS, a surgeon there and the trans folks in that town. For others, transitioning is what they are supposed to do.

Sorry for the long post but it's hard to say something without a little background as to how I have come to the thought processes that I have.

[Q]

[...]Enlightenment can be liken to this ...The Buddha taught "The Middle Way"  enlightenment is the peaceful 'space' between  two extremes...[...]

Hello,

I'm not a Buddhist. However, I do think there is some value to be derived from some concepts in Buddhism. The idea of a 'middle way', i.e. not going to extremes, doing things in moderation, etc, being one which I think sounds like a reasonable philosophy.

A thought that I have had, is that, if one viewed two extremes of dealing with 'gender dysphoria' as complete self repression and 'full' medical transition. Then, one might perhaps consider a 'middle way' to be some variation on 'cross-dressing'. Although I suppose you could also separate bodily change aspects, from role aspects and so on and make interpretation of where 'middle' is much more complicated.

I was just wondering what your thoughts were on the concept of 'middle way' and the ways in which people deal with gender dysphoria?

Also, totally unrelated, but I am just dying to mention that I didn't know 'Kia Ora' was a greeting. Each time I see it in your posts it makes me smile and think of orange juice and this rather cheery old advert, lol!:

[Anatta]

Hello,

I'm not a Buddhist. However, I do think there is some value to be derived from some concepts in Buddhism. The idea of a 'middle way', i.e. not going to extremes, doing things in moderation, etc, being one which I think sounds like a reasonable philosophy.

A thought that I have had, is that, if one viewed two extremes of dealing with 'gender dysphoria' as complete self repression and 'full' medical transition. Then, one might perhaps consider a 'middle way' to be some variation on 'cross-dressing'. Although I suppose you could also separate bodily change aspects, from role aspects and so on and make interpretation of where 'middle' is much more complicated.

I was just wondering what your thoughts were on the concept of 'middle way' and the ways in which people deal with gender dysphoria?

Also, totally unrelated, but I am just dying to mention that I didn't know 'Kia Ora' was a greeting. Each time I see it in your posts it makes me smile and think of orange juice and this rather cheery old advert, lol!:

Kia Ora Q,

I'm just off to the beach for a swim , so I'll be back later to discuss the "Middle Way"...However in the  meantime [if you are reading this] you might want to look into the Buddhist concept of "Impermanence" ie the impermanent nature of 'all' component things, and "Acceptance of what is" ie, Going with the flow of the situation"...

Some food for thought to chew over...

Bye for now...

Metta Zenda

[Anatta]

Kia Ora Q,

I've had my swim, soak in the sun and a relaxing read....

So "The Middle Way" out of gender dysphoria :.BTW Sandra. M. Lopes has written quite a bit on this so you might want to check out some of her posts...

The Buddha taught "The Middle Way" which is also known as "The EightFold Path" as a way out of/to end all suffering...
[You can find info on "The Four Noble Truths" and The EightFold Path" elsewhere in the Buddhist section or just google it]

Well first things first, what one really 'needs' to understand/know is Nothing is Permanent !

The whole universe [including our physical form and mental processes] is/are in a constant state of flux, never remaining the same for one moment...

The reason we suffer is because we attempt to 'cling' to what is impermanent-be it ideas or material things...

Think about this for a moment...If gender dysphoria was a "permanent" mental fixture then there would be no relief...

The Buddha taught that there is no permanent abiding self/I that dwells within

What we perceive as "I" 'Me' 'My' 'Self" is just a psycho-physical phenomena which in Buddhism is called the Five Aggregates which consist of Body/Form-Consciousness-Sensation-Perception-Mental Formation[or the karmic activities of the mind].. Each of which is in a constant state of flux, never fixed, always changing from moment to moment...{If one 'thinks' about it, what is 'thinking'?...In a simplistic sense, it's just movement/action confined to the brain] ...Our physical form is made up of cells that are constantly regenerating= birth-death-birth-death and so forth...

Attachment to these Aggregates creates a false sense of 'self' which eventually becomes "self-generating" ...So the trick is to become aware of what's happening in the mind and through this awareness gradually begin to change how one perceives things ...

Awareness does not need a 'self' to operate, it can do its job without a subject.
Meditation will [if done right] help one understand and experience this phenomena at work...

The more we cling to a false sense of 'self' the more we reinforce the concept of a permanent "self" which will eventually lead to the slippery slop of  suffering...That's not to say one can't have  a sense of self but one needs to be aware that it is constantly changing and one needs to go with the flow of change ....

In Buddhism there a lot of talk about renunciation and most people panic when they come across this term, however it just means to give up what is making one suffer, which [along with clinging] is "IGNORANCE" but not the real negative kind of ignorance that is commonly associated when used in English, in Buddhism it just means "NOT KNOWING"...

If one doesn't know what they 'need' to know, then they are prone to make mistakes...

Practice makes perfect, but don't practice to become enlighten-Make enlightenment the expression of your practice...
Q there's much one needs to learn in order to navigate ones way through the Buddha's Dharma, and I'm not a teacher of the Dharma-I'm just a very enthusiastic lay-student who has greatly benefited from the experience...

The Buddha did say "Don't take my word for it-Experience it for your'self'

I hope at least part of what I've written makes some sense....

Metta Zenda    

[Q]

Kia Ora Q,

I've had my swim, soak in the sun and a relaxing read....

So "The Middle Way" out of gender dysphoria :.BTW Sandra. M. Lopes has written quite a bit on this so you might want to check out some of her posts...

The Buddha taught "The Middle Way" which is also known as "The EightFold Path" as a way out of/to end all suffering...
[You can find info on "The Four Noble Truths" and The EightFold Path" elsewhere in the Buddhist section or just google it]

Well first things first, what one really 'needs' to understand/know is Nothing is Permanent !

The whole universe [including our physical form and mental processes] is/are in a constant state of flux, never remaining the same for one moment...

The reason we suffer is because we attempt to 'cling' to what is impermanent-be it ideas or material things...

Think about this for a moment...If gender dysphoria was a "permanent" mental fixture then there would be no relief...

The Buddha taught that there is no permanent abiding self/I that dwells within

What we perceive as "I" 'Me' 'My' 'Self" is just a psycho-physical phenomena which in Buddhism is called the Five Aggregates which consist of Body/Form-Consciousness-Sensation-Perception-Mental Formation[or the karmic activities of the mind].. Each of which is in a constant state of flux, never fixed, always changing from moment to moment...{If one 'thinks' about it, what is 'thinking'?...In a simplistic sense, it's just movement/action confined to the brain] ...Our physical form is made up of cells that are constantly regenerating= birth-death-birth-death and so forth...

Attachment to these Aggregates creates a false sense of 'self' which eventually becomes "self-generating" ...So the trick is to become aware of what's happening in the mind and through this awareness gradually begin to change how one perceives things ...

Awareness does not need a 'self' to operate, it can do its job without a subject.
Meditation will [if done right] help one understand and experience this phenomena at work...

The more we cling to a false sense of 'self' the more we reinforce the concept of a permanent "self" which will eventually lead to the slippery slop of  suffering...That's not to say one can't have  a sense of self but one needs to be aware that it is constantly changing and one needs to go with the flow of change ....

In Buddhism there a lot of talk about renunciation and most people panic when they come across this term, however it just means to give up what is making one suffer, which [along with clinging] is "IGNORANCE" but not the real negative kind of ignorance that is commonly associated when used in English, in Buddhism it just means "NOT KNOWING"...

If one doesn't know what they 'need' to know, then they are prone to make mistakes...

Practice makes perfect, but don't practice to become enlighten-Make enlightenment the expression of your practice...
Q there's much one needs to learn in order to navigate ones way through the Buddha's Dharma, and I'm not a teacher of the Dharma-I'm just a very enthusiastic lay-student who has greatly benefited from the experience...

The Buddha did say "Don't take my word for it-Experience it for your'self'

I hope at least part of what I've written makes some sense....

Metta Zenda

Thank you for taking the time to write. I will think about what you've written today and look up Sandra's posts.  ...and swimming! Nice!

[Anatta]

Thank you for taking the time to write. I will think about what you've written today and look up Sandra's posts.  ...and swimming! Nice!

Kia Ora Q,

In a nutshell it boils down to this " By changing the way you look at things- The things you look at change !"

Metta Zenda

[Sandra M. Lopes]

Total enlightenment is unachievable for us because our Spirits just aren't that advanced yet. If we were, we wouldn't be in an earthly existance, we would have long since moved on. To whatever what, I don't know but willing to bet that it is to advance Spiritually under different circumstances.

I just wished to add that total enlightenment is, indeed, achievable by anyone, it just requires absolute diligence to reach the end of the process However, I agree that few are willing to give up their kingdoms to become enlightened. Why? Because, in fact, we're not truly convinced that enlightenment is really a priority in our lives. Those that truly realized that couldn't care less about their kingdoms — even if it's just your apartment, a TV set, and a wardrobe full of nice clothes to wear — and just focused all their time and effort to become enlightened.

Oh yes, it's tough work. You mentioned you lived in Korea, so very likely the teachings you heard were Ch'an (the same kind of Mahayana teachings also popularized in Japan under the name of Zen). To show how hard it is, they teach that the time of achieving enlightenment is at least 3 eons (maybe 7 or 33, depending on your chosen path). An "eon" is loosely defined as "the time from the beginning of an universe to its end", which according to modern science would be something like 10 to the power of 100 years (Buddhism tends to be a bit more helpful and consider them to be "only" a few trillion years long). The whole point is to explain that it really takes a long time. On the other hand, we don't know at which stage we are — we might be at the "last" life when enlightenment is achieved. That it can be, indeed, achieved in a single lifetime is more than documentally proved — great teachers get regularly enlightened, and it's such a common event among Tibetans that they often feel frustrated when a teacher does not become enlightened!

How do they know? Well, think about Christ. We have the Turin Shroud to show what happens to people achieving a certain level of enlightenment: at the moment of death, the atoms of their bodies lose coherence, emit gamma and X-rays, and all that remains is a "nuclear shadow", not unlike what was seen to happen in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. These effects are still visible on the Shroud after almost 2000 years. Certain Buddhist teachers pretty much achieve similar effects when dying, and this can be captured on video cameras and pictures. With luck, being at the right place at the right time, you can even see it for yourself; I didn't, but I have two teachers who certainly saw that with their own eyes. They were not overwhelmingly surprised — after all, it's what they have expected that would happen all along.

So we know it's possible. The bad news is that we also know it's extremely hard work. The good news is that a) it only depends on your level of commitment (so, no, you don't need to be "special" in any way...); b) even if you never reach that stage, at least you will enjoy a peaceful life and a peaceful death — and what more can anyone hope for in this life?

[Jess42]

I really can't say what sect of Buddhism it was Sandra, but it probably was. I'm sort of a religious rebel in being that I am not interested too much in getting bogged down by secular thinking and so on. I just used Buddhism as a means of getting an overall picture of the beliefs and to learn the art of meditation. It's also the same with Christianity. If I had to identify with a Christian group, it would probably be the Gnostics, try finding a Gnostic church today. Not just religions but science too. Science can be just as unbending when it comes to expanding our understanding of our world. A lot of theories and hypotheses are taken as facts and when something comes along to blow those theories out of the water, it's hard to give up the mental convictions. Investigating the paranormal and parapsychology is one field that is not very acceptable to the scientific crowd but I have disembodied voices on recorders and seemingly intellegent manipulations of energies on visual recorders. Don't get me wrong, I am a huge skeptic and can debunk about 98% of what I supposedly capture but the other 2% percent defies all logical perceptions. By the way, I was doing paranormal invetigating before all the TV shows about it were made. I remember using casette tapes and suitcase sized VCR cameras.

I caught my mistake in in my quote. Enlightenment is achievable but once enlightened enough, I believe you go onto whatever else there is after this existance to still advance the Spirit. What I call total enlightenment is when we become one with the Source again but individual at the same time ( at the end of the eons? ). A paradox, I know. I believe there are more enlightened beings that inhabit this existance from time to time but more to teach us and prod us along Spiritually. Anyway, what's a few trillion years compared to infinity?

My life isn't as peaceful as I would hope for, due to a modern world concreted in materiality, but I have no fear of death. I am a little apprehensive about the dying part though.