Angst about passing

[regan]

http://www.tallwomen.org/clothes/#uk

That is such an awesome website - a totally positive place for tall girls/women.

[CaitJ]

That is such an awesome website - a totally positive place for tall girls/women.

Isn't it just! I feel practically tiny compared to some of the women on there! 

[sweetie87]

Another tall girl joining here ('6"0)    totally agree with Vexing. Height isn't an issue with regard to passing in MtF's. As you stand out people will only notice you, but any tall girl is going to be noticed so no difference there. I love being tall and I know plenty of girls who are just as tall or even taller..

[CaitJ]

I love being tall and I know plenty of girls who are just as tall or even taller..

Yarly! I met a fellow tall woman (taller than me in fact) in a club one night and started bitching about my height. She was like "Are you kidding me? Being tall RULES! I'd hate to be shorter than this!"

[sweetie87]

Yarly! I met a fellow tall woman (taller than me in fact) in a club one night and started bitching about my height. She was like "Are you kidding me? Being tall RULES! I'd hate to be shorter than this!"

And have you quit bitching about your height since then?

[CaitJ]

And have you quit bitching about your height since then?

Yarly! 
Well, except when I smack my head on something. Then some bitching is allowed.

[Rock_chick]

...I love being tall!

Tall girls are sexy

[toxicblue]

I'm tall, 6'1'', MtF, and I've always had long hair, so even before I finally accepted being trans, people from behind would still think I'm a girl.  I've thought about it being a problem and all, but I don't worry much over it.  As long as I can pull everything else off, then I'm sure height won't be an issue.  But no, I haven't been full time girl in public yet, so who knows how this will go.

[regan]

I'm tall, 6'1'', MtF, and I've always had long hair, so even before I finally accepted being trans, people from behind would still think I'm a girl.  I've thought about it being a problem and all, but I don't worry much over it.  As long as I can pull everything else off, then I'm sure height won't be an issue.  But no, I haven't been full time girl in public yet, so who knows how this will go.

Passing seems to revolve around being thin, short and young.  And yet thin, short and young MtFs end up not passing all the time.  Confidence goes a long way towards passing.  Wearing clothes appropriate to the situation (my classic Donna Reed example) is much the same.  Height can work against you, so can a deeper voice but (someone's elses thought, not mine) if Bea Arthur can pass so can you. 

I wish there was some sort of formula to measure passing, you know where you either gain or lose points on different aspects and if your final score is over a certain number you "pass".  That way it was a level playing field for all of us.

[Rock_chick]

I wish there was some sort of formula to measure passing, you know where you either gain or lose points on different aspects and if your final score is over a certain number you "pass".  That way it was a level playing field for all of us.

It's not a test hun...at least I don't think it is. Has anyone noticed that they're being followed around by someone with a clip board all the time?

[regan]

It's not a test hun...at least I don't think it is. Has anyone noticed that they're being followed around by someone with a clip board all the time?

I know that's what I said, but its not what I meant.    I'm thinking more in terms of how different elements play into passing or not passing and helping people understand that being anything but short, thin and pretty does not mean not being able to pass.  That sort of thing.

I think its more I hate the self imposed old wive's tales that we allow ourselves to suffer under.  Starting with the early transitioner vs late transitioner.  The new early is age six anyways so we're all late transitioners by that measure anyways.  Its never too late to transition, unless your dead so that doesn't make sense either.  The magical belief that some how hormones+youth = flawless, which it doesn't, discounts the significant numbers of people that have transitioned at any age over the arbitrary age of 25 (why 25, I have yet to find valid scientific evidence) and are in fact quite passable naturally.  The fact that being tall makes passing difficult disregards the fact that the tallest woman is 7 ft 9 in.  That "natural" women don't have broad shoulders, deep voices, large hands or Adam's Apples.

Maybe I'm just having a rough day, but I'm sick of how divisive we come off against ourselves most of the time.  No wonder we're still fighting for acceptance, we can't even seem to accept memebers of our own community without putting some sort of bizarre qualification on them.

[E]

Maybe I'm just having a rough day, but I'm sick of how divisive we come off against ourselves most of the time.  No wonder we're still fighting for acceptance, we can't even seem to accept memebers of our own community without putting some sort of bizarre qualification on them.

That's true, but it's also hardly unique to our own little minority. Every single minority I've ever gotten a close look at has done the same thing. Heck, every single subculture I've gotten a good look at has been the same. Humans are just naturally divisive - you may have heard the old saying, "Me versus my brother; me and my brother versus my cousin; me and my cousin versus the world." It's more true than we'd like.

For what it's worth, I've seen arguments of "[band X] is/isn't real [genre Y]" get just as heated and nasty as any trans-related subject discussed in our own little community.

[regan]

During my Abnormal Psych class, we split up into groups and taught several chapters out of the book.  During the presentation on transsexualism the group presenting showed several pictures of cis and trans women (side by side) and used that to see if we could pick out which was which.  As I recall, the class was wrong most of the time.

[CaitJ]

During my Abnormal Psych class, we split up into groups and taught several chapters out of the book.  During the presentation on transsexualism the group presenting showed several pictures of cis and trans women (side by side) and used that to see if we could pick out which was which.  As I recall, the class was wrong most of the time.

I love doing this to people - except I don't use any trans women, all the images are of cis women. People normally pick around half of the women as trans.

[Just Shelly]

I love doing this to people - except I don't use any trans women, all the images are of cis women. People normally pick around half of the women as trans.

Oh yes, I totally believe this. It just goes to show how humans perceived perceptions of others is.

This is my biggest fear. I or anyone could pass 110% to the general public with no knowledge of who I or they are.

But people that knew you before transition or someone that just finds out. There perception of me or them, as anything other then female changes. I'm not saying they dislike me or that it is done intentionally, it's just human nature.

The only way to avoid this is stealth. I can't do that.

It would be interesting to do that same test, and instead of asking who is cis and who is trans. Just ask "of all these woman, who looks the most intelligent" throw off there perception right off the bat.

[regan]

But people that knew you before transition or someone that just finds out. There perception of me or them, as anything other then female changes. I'm not saying they dislike me or that it is done intentionally, it's just human nature.

I'm fairly sure I could transition with my current employer with few problems, but the real question is do I want to?  I mean do I want to be known for being someone who used to be someone else, that sort of thing.  Like there would always be that hanging over my head.  Am I better off working somewhere else as just Regan and not this person I once was?

[Rock_chick]

I'm fairly sure I could transition with my current employer with few problems, but the real question is do I want to?  I mean do I want to be known for being someone who used to be someone else, that sort of thing.  Like there would always be that hanging over my head.  Am I better off working somewhere else as just Regan and not this person I once was?

Depends...among the reasons I stayed where I was was the fact I've been there nearly 4 years now, and now that i've transitioned my HR records are in my new name...most companies in the UK ask for a 5 yeah work history...I basically have a year to go until my employment record is all in the name of helena.

[melissa42013]

The discussion of height got me thinking about a picture I saw one at "People of Walmart .com" of a supermodel, I think it was Elle Macpherson towering over the security they had escorting her. (I couldn't find the pict again and I may be wrong on the model.) This got me thinking about super model heights and I got this list of super model heights goggling it. So maybe the stares are because they think you are a model *grin*

Oluchi Onweagba
6 foot 2

Anna Hickmann
6 foot 1 and a half

Adriana Sklenaríková 
6 foot 1

Elle Macpherson
6 Foot

Jodie Kidd
6 foot

Stella Tennant
6 Foot

Kimberley Stewart
6 foot

Sophie Dahl
6 foot

Elle Macpherson
6 foot

Victoria Silvstedt 
5 foot 11

Ana Beatriz Barros
5 foot 11

Alec Wec or Alex
5 foot 1

Daniela Peštová
5 foot 11

Karolína Kurková
5 foot 11 Look 

[TinFoilIdiot]

Im 5'6" maybe 7" and if I see a guy walking towards me who is taller than me or a girl i guess it intimidates me and makes me feel less of myself. Also when Im walking with my brother who is 5'11 i feel small, because i think if i had been born male i wouldve been as tall if not taller than him so that drags me down a bit.

Do you think Im short for a guy? Tom Cruise is only a couple of inches taller than me and he wears heels n stuff which makes me feel crap about this.

[regan]

Im 5'6" maybe 7" and if I see a guy walking towards me who is taller than me or a girl i guess it intimidates me and makes me feel less of myself. Also when Im walking with my brother who is 5'11 i feel small, because i think if i had been born male i wouldve been as tall if not taller than him so that drags me down a bit.

Do you think Im short for a guy? Tom Cruise is only a couple of inches taller than me and he wears heels n stuff which makes me feel crap about this.

My brother is about 5ft 9 in (I'm being generous), I'm 6ft 2in (just under)...anything is possible.