Author Topic: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?  (Read 49271 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Jenna Marie

  • *****
  • Posts: 2,988
  • Reputation: +33/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #60 on: July 04, 2015, 11:39:03 am »
Aimee : I'm so sorry that happened to you!

Well, sigmoid colon probably is the best choice for adding depth, if that's what you decide you want (and would solve the hair problem neatly at the same time). If you choose not to have depth, since you've been making do along those lines so far, you could probably get it revised to be hair-free and slightly shallower but more aesthetically pleasing to you. There are cis women who are born without much vaginal cavity, and it's likely to be unusual but not out you to lesbian partners if you chose to explain it that way.

As for the external genitalia, the good news is that a secondary labiaplasty probably would tidy up almost everything. Surgeons who specialize in revisions can work miracles with making the labia more defined and anatomically correct, etc. (The recessed clit is another feature common in cis women, so if it's functional you might well be able to leave it be.) Meltzer apparently does a lot of surgeries like that, and Brassard as well, depending on which is closer to you - not sure where you are, but 4000 miles isn't likely to be required. You might need a skin graft to supplement what you already have, but both surgeons are good at taking one that's discreet and small.

Offline AnonyMs

  • *****
  • Posts: 3,952
  • Reputation: +38/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #61 on: July 04, 2015, 01:42:32 pm »
I can't recall the details, but I there's a TV show in the USA called Botched, and one recent episode featured the porn star Kimber James having SRS revision with Gary Alter.

Offline FrancisAnn

  • *
  • Posts: 2,089
  • Reputation: +6/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #62 on: July 04, 2015, 01:59:56 pm »
I sure hope there are no detail signs after healing up. I'm hopeful for a normal life as a complete hetrosexual woman. I'm discussing surgery with a Dr. KeeLee MacPhee of Raleigh NC. She seems very experienced however not as well known as some of the other names.
mtF, mid 50's, always a girl since childhood, HRT (Spiro, E & Fin.) since 8-13. Hormone levels are t at 12 & estrogen at 186. Face lift & eye lid surgery in 2014. Abdominoplasty/tummy tuck & some facial surgery May, 2015. Life is good for me. Love long nails & handsome men! Hopeful for my GRS & a nice normal depth vagina maybe by late summer. 5' 8", 180 pounds, 14 dress size, size 9.5 shoes. I'm kind of an elegant woman & like everything pink, nice & neet. Love my nails & classic Revlon Red. Moving back to Florida, so excited but so much work moving

Aimee

Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #63 on: July 05, 2015, 05:50:38 am »
I really don't want to go through the risk and what I would assume to be, traumatic process of the sigmoid colon revision.  That really frightens me.  I've really come to accept that I won't be able to have sexual relations with men and I'm ok with that, I've had a lot of time to reflect upon that and I've decided that men just aren't what I'm interested in. 

When I first started HRT I went through my second puberty and as my brain was being rewired by estrogen I took notice of them just like teenage girls do.  I experimented a little but I've lost interest in them for many reasons.

I've concluded that I will choose the course of soft butch interested in femme cis-females.  So lesbian sex if any sex.
Some butch women chose not to be on the receiving end of sex, IE a "Stone Butch".  So I would be like a combo of soft and stone.


Anyway...

My clitoris does work despite being way up inside of me.  I just had to figure out how to work it.  The mood strikes me about twice a year to um, have a little tension relief.

If I ever do go back for revision I am going to go for repairing the appearance so it looks more natural.

As for the hair, it's not internal inside my vaginal canal, it's in the opening before that.

It's hard to describe my results without being graphic but think of it like a funnel.  There's a large open where I guess the um, evil twins used to reside.  And inside that initial opening, the wider part of that imaginary "funnel" is where the hair is.  So it's like a hair funnel with three holes deeper into it rather than just one.

I made an extremely basic & crude (I have no talent for art) drawing to sort of illustrate how it is.



One of the things that I was told was that I have a pelvis deformity from an old, severe injury and that would restrict the potential diameter of my vaginal canal.  At the time they were sending us home with a set of four dilators in a lavender cloth wrap case.  They left out the largest, they told me that there was no way I would ever be able to accommodate it.  They told me that even the others would be a problem.  And they were.  I was never able to graduate beyond the smallest one and that was extremely painful.  Eventually I ended up buying my own set of much smaller dilators from a place that helps women with vaginismus.  Of those, I can only use the two smallest ones and those are painful.  It's been over four years now and I've given up hope of having a functional, useful vagina.  Now I just want it to look normal and be left with the ability to orgasm.  Penetration is not a big deal for me.  I would imagine that it would be expensive and painful to have both a functional and normal appearing vagina.  Bowers told me during my intake, like 10 minutes before I went into surgery that she could give me more depth with cadaver skin.  I was freaked out by that and didn't have the time to contemplate it fully so I said no way to that.  I was put off by it because there had recently been a huge nationwide bust of funeral homes selling bootleg cadaver parts to hospitals and a lot of it was contaminated and diseased, some people ended up with HIV and other horrible diseases because of that.  That instantly came to mind because it was fresh in the news at that time and it scared me.  In retrospect I wish I had been given more time to think it through.  I don't know if I would have chosen differently given the circumstances and what all had been happening.
I did tell her that if she needed to take skin from another part of me to do a graft I was OK with that.  She said she would try to avoid doing that if at all possible.  She ended up not taking a graft or using cadaver skin in me.

Another issue is that I'm a sufferer of extreme, chronic pain and being laid up in bed for a week is a no go.  I can't lay in any bed, I have a hospital type bed and even that is miserable.  Consequently I don't sleep much.  I take lots of short naps in my chair which is uncomfortable but less so than my bed is.


I can't really blame Bowers for doing a bad job, I know she's done great things for many other women, I think in my case it was just that there wasn't really enough donor material to work with.  How in the world anyone could fix what I have to look normal is beyond me considering there's nothing there to work with.  Unless they can grow some new flesh from my own stem cells in a petri dish I don't know.  I read somewhere they are growing vaginal canals in petri dishes now.  Maybe they can do labia and the canal from my own cells?  If they can do that I would think that would be the best bet since there would be no rejection issues.  Using cadaver flesh I would imagine could be a problem with necrosis so you would have to take lots of antibiotics and antirejection drugs.  Sounds too problematic to me.

Well I'm almost 55 and not attractive so men aren't interested in me anyway and there aren't any men in my age range I would ever be attracted to anyway.  Adam Levine is not going to be interested in me nor would David Tennant so, no men, no worries.  After spending close to $50k ($22k-GRS, $8k-BA, $10k-shrinks, $4k-legal, $2k-travel/lodging and $2k misc) I think I've about reached my spending limits on all this.  I have no idea how much revisions would cost.


Mod Edit- Links require prior permission. TOS 1

« Last Edit: July 09, 2015, 11:13:25 am by Mariah2014 »

Offline FrancisAnn

  • *
  • Posts: 2,089
  • Reputation: +6/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #64 on: July 05, 2015, 06:46:29 am »
Oh me, you poor dear. My best to you.
mtF, mid 50's, always a girl since childhood, HRT (Spiro, E & Fin.) since 8-13. Hormone levels are t at 12 & estrogen at 186. Face lift & eye lid surgery in 2014. Abdominoplasty/tummy tuck & some facial surgery May, 2015. Life is good for me. Love long nails & handsome men! Hopeful for my GRS & a nice normal depth vagina maybe by late summer. 5' 8", 180 pounds, 14 dress size, size 9.5 shoes. I'm kind of an elegant woman & like everything pink, nice & neet. Love my nails & classic Revlon Red. Moving back to Florida, so excited but so much work moving

Offline Laura_7

  • *****
  • Posts: 4,712
  • Reputation: +47/-0
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #65 on: July 05, 2015, 07:08:04 am »
Well outer revisions like revisions of labia and of clit position are fairly common.
And there is really a huge variance in cis vaginas.
You might simply take a photo ( maybe careful if you feel its triggering ) and send it to a few surgeons, asking for their advice.
If necessary they might take skin grafts from you, from different places.

Yes, concerning new methods there is hope for the future.

Concerning penetration and stimulation, you might consider anal play.
There is supposed to be a p/gspot which many people, cis and tg, say its very pleasurable to be stimulated via anal play.
Some even say better than vaginally.
Many people use a dildo with a bent tip. Use only toys designed for that purpose, with a flange or handle... so nothing gets lost in there... and best good silicone...
And if with a partner going slow and using enough lube, and communication afterwards which spots feel best, and which techniques... deeply pressed, or rhythmical stimulation... etc... can lead to really pleasurable experiences. 
Many men prefer anally because its really tight in there.

*hugs*

Offline Jenna Marie

  • *****
  • Posts: 2,988
  • Reputation: +33/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #66 on: July 05, 2015, 10:59:31 am »
Aimee : Yikes, that's a hell of a price tag. I think revisions are generally cheaper than the full surgery, but it depends on the doctor (Meltzer is very good but relatively expensive, for example). However, if it helps, based on this description you have hair in places that unlucky cis women have hair - it's not *desirable,* but it's not out of normal variation. (I have just one long hair that grows from outside the entrance and curls INSIDE... drives me batty). That means that your main issues are aesthetic, and that's the sort of secondary labiaplasty revision that surgeons specialize in. It might require a skin graft, but if you ever do decide you're interested, it should absolutely be doable.

I have never before heard of using cadaver skin, for exactly the reasons you cite here - rejection, infection, and disease - so I think you made the right decision there. Most surgeons use a skin graft that comes from the patient, and some are quite good at disguising the source so there's no huge scar left at the graft site.

Offline januarysunshine

  • Neighbor
  • ***
  • Posts: 87
  • Reputation: +2/-0
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #67 on: July 06, 2015, 10:54:58 pm »
Hi Aimee,
I'm so sorry your SRS turned out badly:(
Did the doc offer the colon SRS before deciding on this technique? Reading about your medical issues, that might have been a better choice despite the longer recovery time.
As far as hair goes, in good news, it goes away in time. I never even knew about electroloysis down there or anything...so imagine my surprise when after my inversion with scrotal graft--viola, there's hair inside the vag-cave:( lol I was a bit upset immediately after the packing came out and I could inspect things with a mirror--but I was so hell-bent on getting SRS, I could care less if I had a bear trap inside there.lol Anyways, with continued use of oral estrogen and vaginal premarin cream, the hair disappeared and the inside became exactly like au-naturelle vag. So don't dispair--there's hope:)
As far as revisions go, get a few opinions before deciding. You don't have to be stuck with a botched surgery. I know a few years ago that Menard/Brassard were doing botched surgical revisions (from other surgeons) at a drastically reduced rate...Dr Menard had a real passion for helping people and was really caring--I think Brassard took on his qualities when Menard retired. Might be a surgeon to investigate if you want to consider a reconstruction.
Sending hugs,
JS

Offline Evolving Beauty

  • *
  • Posts: 487
  • Reputation: +5/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #68 on: July 09, 2015, 10:50:28 am »
OK I'm now 1 year post-op and replying to this thread. My vagina was NEVER clocked not a single time and is aesthetically perfect, showers of compliments always and not to mention how men love eating it, LOL! Clitoral sensation perfect. The only epic fail was depth. Overall, NO-CLOCKING on my neo-vagina. I'm speaking for myself as a Chettawut girl, other girls' and surgeons may vary.

Offline Nicole

  • Family
  • *****
  • Posts: 802
  • Reputation: +37/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #69 on: July 09, 2015, 08:33:54 pm »
OK I'm now 1 year post-op and replying to this thread. My vagina was NEVER clocked not a single time and is aesthetically perfect, showers of compliments always and not to mention how men love eating it, LOL! Clitoral sensation perfect. The only epic fail was depth. Overall, NO-CLOCKING on my neo-vagina. I'm speaking for myself as a Chettawut girl, other girls' and surgeons may vary.

On depth.
I've read many times, not just on trans info sites that the avg. penis length is only 5 inches.
In my life with the guys I've slept with, I've never come across any much bigger than 5 inches (from guessing), many would be around the 4 to 6 at the most.
So unless you're 3 inches or less there shouldn't be a problem, unless you're trying positions that are made for deep sex, (doggy style, girl on top).


As for botched results, I was reading a <not allowed> on Kimber James, who I had no idea who she was, turned out she is a porn actor and I took a look, that was a shocking result
Yes! I'm single
And you'll have to be pretty f'ing amazing to change that

Offline Evolving Beauty

  • *
  • Posts: 487
  • Reputation: +5/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #70 on: July 10, 2015, 04:39:16 am »
On depth.
I've read many times, not just on trans info sites that the avg. penis length is only 5 inches.
In my life with the guys I've slept with, I've never come across any much bigger than 5 inches (from guessing), many would be around the 4 to 6 at the most.
So unless you're 3 inches or less there shouldn't be a problem, unless you're trying positions that are made for deep sex, (doggy style, girl on top).


As for botched results, I was reading a <not allowed> on Kimber James, who I had no idea who she was, turned out she is a porn actor and I took a look, that was a shocking result

I'm now a luxury escort and I need to accomodate all sizes and believe me the country where I am right now in Europe have really big stuff as average 6. But thanks god fortunately I know how to handle things.  ::)

Offline FrancisAnn

  • *
  • Posts: 2,089
  • Reputation: +6/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #71 on: July 10, 2015, 07:37:09 am »
OK I'm now 1 year post-op and replying to this thread. My vagina was NEVER clocked not a single time and is aesthetically perfect, showers of compliments always and not to mention how men love eating it, LOL! Clitoral sensation perfect. The only epic fail was depth. Overall, NO-CLOCKING on my neo-vagina. I'm speaking for myself as a Chettawut girl, other girls' and surgeons may vary.
That's sure nice to see. I so hope for a normal life after GRS & I so enjoy being with men.
mtF, mid 50's, always a girl since childhood, HRT (Spiro, E & Fin.) since 8-13. Hormone levels are t at 12 & estrogen at 186. Face lift & eye lid surgery in 2014. Abdominoplasty/tummy tuck & some facial surgery May, 2015. Life is good for me. Love long nails & handsome men! Hopeful for my GRS & a nice normal depth vagina maybe by late summer. 5' 8", 180 pounds, 14 dress size, size 9.5 shoes. I'm kind of an elegant woman & like everything pink, nice & neet. Love my nails & classic Revlon Red. Moving back to Florida, so excited but so much work moving

Offline Lara1969

  • Friend
  • ****
  • Posts: 421
  • Reputation: +4/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #72 on: July 16, 2015, 06:01:52 am »
I'm now a luxury escort and I need to accomodate all sizes and believe me the country where I am right now in Europe have really big stuff as average 6. But thanks god fortunately I know how to handle things.  ::)

I think I had sex with approx 35 men since grs Last summer and maybe only one was 6 inches, many were 4 or 5 inches. I do not know the Name of him but I would meet him again for sex. Because I really enjoyed it.I am really sure he enjoyed too :p Size does matter.

Maybe I just become a escort girl too? But I am not beautiful enough :-(
Happy girl from queer capital Berlin

Rejennyrated

Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #73 on: July 16, 2015, 09:32:06 am »
I think I had sex with approx 35 men since grs Last summer ...
:o Hells Bells I must be a serious lightweight then... I've been postop for the best part of 31 years and I've had sex with only 6 people in my entire LIFE!  :P

Not implying any criticism by the way. In some ways I wish I was more experienced, but as it happens all of my sex has been in serious monogamous relationships which have lasted anything from months to decades so there just hasn't been time for more.

In some way this is a silly debate anyway. There is no doubt that there are differences that could be spotted if someone really wanted to, but generally speaking most people will have their minds on other things so in practice its unlikely to be a big issue.

Offline Michelle02327

  • Visitor
  • *
  • Posts: 6
  • Reputation: +2/-0
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #74 on: July 20, 2015, 09:33:52 pm »
I early was diagnosed a Tg by four. I lived as a girl. and took puberty delaying meds at 12, and lived as the and I lived as the girls I was -even before that. Iichelle'm female now at 24.

Michelle
My relationship with my Mother is strange. She was born in 'priviledge' and got pregnant with me at 17, and ran away. I was born in New Orleans. After trying to survive on other jobs, she became a dancer. I always felt, very young, I was a girl. I was babysat with daughters of other dancers and allowed to dress and play with other girls. I was diagnosed TG and at 12 began GnRH. Happily I'm now fem

Offline OCAnne

  • Friend
  • ****
  • Posts: 268
  • Reputation: +5/-0
  • Gender: Female
  • Live from Los Angeles, CA
    • Anne on Twitter!
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #75 on: July 21, 2015, 08:01:24 am »
I think I had sex with approx 35 men since grs Last summer and maybe only one was 6 inches, many were 4 or 5 inches...

Hello Lara1969, 35 men since GRS last year?  Wow, can you start a new tread and tell us how it all works?  How long after GCS did you try out the new parts?  Where do you find guys?  I am on OK Cupid but men there stop messaging after notifying them of my post-op status.

Thank you,
Anne
'My Music, Much Money, Many Moons'
YTMV (Your Transsexualism May Vary)

Offline Lara1969

  • Friend
  • ****
  • Posts: 421
  • Reputation: +4/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #76 on: July 21, 2015, 02:36:28 pm »
Hello Lara1969, 35 men since GRS last year?  Wow, can you start a new tread and tell us how it all works?  How long after GCS did you try out the new parts?  Where do you find guys?  I am on OK Cupid but men there stop messaging after notifying them of my post-op status.

Thank you,
Anne

That was not difficult. I also had no sex with men from Okcupid. Online dating does not work for me.

We have lots of Clubs and Bars here where you can dance and drink a beer and have sex if you like (it is okay not to have sex there or if you say no to a man it is always respected). That works great :-) I just go there for party with a CIS friend. And sometime I meet a nice guy and maybe.... Condoms are provided for free. I do not have a boy friend.

Happy girl from queer capital Berlin

Offline OCAnne

  • Friend
  • ****
  • Posts: 268
  • Reputation: +5/-0
  • Gender: Female
  • Live from Los Angeles, CA
    • Anne on Twitter!
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #77 on: July 21, 2015, 06:46:01 pm »
That was not difficult. I also had no sex with men from Okcupid. Online dating does not work for me.

We have lots of Clubs and Bars here where you can dance and drink a beer and have sex if you like (it is okay not to have sex there or if you say no to a man it is always respected). That works great :-) I just go there for party with a CIS friend. And sometime I meet a nice guy and maybe.... Condoms are provided for free. I do not have a boy friend.

OMG I need to move!!  Where on earth do they have those kind of clubs?  I think our age is close.  Born in 1968.
When does the pain subside enough to allow for sexual intercourse after GCS?  Do these guys care you are a trans. woman?
'My Music, Much Money, Many Moons'
YTMV (Your Transsexualism May Vary)

Offline Lara1969

  • Friend
  • ****
  • Posts: 421
  • Reputation: +4/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #78 on: July 21, 2015, 11:43:15 pm »
Quote from: OOAnne link=topic=149304.msg1717k415#msg1717415 date=1437522361
OMG I need to move!!  Where on earth do they have those kind of clubs?  I think our age is close.  Born in 1968.
When does the pain subside enough to allow for sexual intercourse after GCS?  Do these guys care you are a trans. woman?

I has one who rejected me after knowing that I am a trans girl. But he was very polite. Most did not care but I do not tell everyone. Most were surprised but did not care.

I live in Berlin, Germany. You can google Kit Kat Club or Insomnia if you would like to get an impression where I often spent Friday night. It is great to have fun and build up experience because I feel very safe there. But on the downside there are a lot of other people looking at you. I can ignore that but I do not like it if others looking at me when I have sex.

I meet guys from the US, Italy, Sweden....there.
Happy girl from queer capital Berlin

Offline judithlynn

  • *****
  • *
  • Posts: 964
  • Reputation: +13/-0
  • Gender: Female
  • Transgender Woman
Re: Can a mtf vagina be really 'clocked'?
« Reply #79 on: July 23, 2015, 03:07:01 am »
Hi OOAnne

I was recently in Berlin for a weekend (and was supposed to meet up with another TG Woman that weekend, but mysteriously she disappeared despite originally arranging to meet up. However I had a great weekend. I also went to Insomnia - The Club is described as:

Insomnia is a beautiful and elegant combination of lasciviousness, sophistication, and passion. It's the perfect haven for fetishists, fantasists, hedonists, and those who wish to celebrate sensuality in frivolous style.

This cathedral-like club is a special treat with its ornate gold and red furnishings and powerful splashes of colour, costume, and light. Dominique is the personality responsible for creating Insomnia; she's well-known on the erotic, fetish, and SM scene in Berlin, particularly for her fabulous parties at the KitKat Club.

For your pleasure, Insomnia is open Tuesday to Sunday with a whole range of special events, such as grand parties on Fridays, lots of techno trance on Saturdays, and swinging specials on Sundays.

I went there on a Saturday night and it was an amazing place, Boys with Girls, boys with boys, girls with girls and just about anything goes. I went dressed quite provocatively and ended up ... well that would be telling. Lets say I didn't get to my Hotel before Midday on Sunday! I loved the place. It was only a pity that other TG woman that had originally agreed to meet didn't come. I also visited the Serene Bar  in Kreuzberg (quite close to Insomnia) The Serene Bar in Kreuzberg, near the old Tempelhof Airport, is a reliable weekend spot. Every Saturday sees a full house, a great atmosphere and lots of lesbians who enjoy dancing and talking. Fads are not the main focus here. Anything goes, but is more classic and stylish. On Sunday I went to CafeBar Marianne. Its One of the oldest lesbian bars in Berlin, small but relaxed – older couples, people drinking beer, fun nights.Mariannenstrasse 6, 10997 Berlin
The crowd is usually between 30 and 45 years old and loves dancing to well-known chart hits.

All in all a really nice weekend, but I missed meeting up with that other TG Woman who had communicated with me over many weeks prior to me arriving there, with not a single reply from 1 week prior to my arrival till today. Very odd!
JudithLynn
:-*
Hugs




Tags: post-op