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Hair...

Started by Darrin Scott, August 17, 2011, 05:39:38 PM

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Darrin Scott

I posted in the "do I pass" thread and I generally don't care about it, but I was told I look like a butch woman. Now, I'm not angry that someone was honest and I DO want honest feedback, but I'm upset about being perceived of as butch and want to change that. Since I'm not and never have been butch. I think my hair is an issue. And yeah, I know passing is more than just how you look and I do actually pass in public on occasion. But I was wondering about my hair.

These are the pictures I posted in the "do I pass thread".

Little blurry sorry...



and....



Here's more of a body shot with different hair.....



A close up with different hair.....



I think I made it worse. I plan on getting another haircut soon. I'm waiting for school to start. Any suggestions about hair is welcome and of course honest opinions about my current hair is also welcome. I didn't want to clog the "do I pass" thread so I made my own.






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dmx

Your hair seems fine to me. I think a big factor in not passing is your skin texture (soft) and the fat distribution of your face.... are you on T yet? If so it should change, in time.
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Wes

I truly do not think your hair is the issue. You have that widow's peak going on which makes you look like you have a men's hairline in a way. I think it's more the lips and eyes..I have that same issue..very pronounced lips that have that dip in it on the top cleft. I think though with T that that would become less pronounced.
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Darrin Scott

Thanks all!

No I am not on T yet. Working on that, though. I really wanted something like this:



I don't know if I could pull it off right now, though.





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Hayzer12

Your sides are longer than in the picture, get it buzzed down a little bit if you want that in the picture

But it isn't your hair

You pass ok, except as someone said you - like most people Pre-T - have softer features and once on T your fat will re-distribute in a more masculine way. Until then, have you considered maybe smaller framed glasses or contacts? I like your glasses, don't get me wrong, I think that because they're larger they make your face seem softer than it normally would? Idk, I suck at this ->-bleeped-<-.

Anyway, as I said if you wanna do something about the hair, make sure you put the part in your hair, as well as trim the side with clippers. I'm not sure which measurement to go with, but a local barber would.
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Wes

It looks like the top is also hella teased..so instead of just pulling it up with gel, kinda give a tease action to the top there...and yeah, like another mentioned, the sides perhaps a bit of a closer shave to it.
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Darrin Scott

Quote from: Wes on August 17, 2011, 07:36:21 PM
It looks like the top is also hella teased..so instead of just pulling it up with gel, kinda give a tease action to the top there...and yeah, like another mentioned, the sides perhaps a bit of a closer shave to it.

I'm actually not quite sure how to tease my hair as I don't usually do it. I do plan on getting the sides done about a 3 or a 4.





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Nygeel

I haave no idea. Usually when people say "you look like a butch lesbian" they can't put their finger on what exactly it is. I don't really read you as a masculine woman. I will say the one thing I am excessively nit picky about is glasses. I know that what I say about glasses isn't an end all, nor is it something you have to do but...if you're able to...eventually...at some point in time...I would change 'em. Although the rectangular shape is something that helps make a face look more angular and therefore more male the shape you have doesn't exactly fit. They should be a little more narrow/not as wide. I get my glasses sized to my head and so far they look spot on.

Okay...ending my nitpicky ness.

It could possibly maybe sort of kind of be that you have an "in between" face. Your eyes look (I SRSLY DOES NOT MEANS TO BE OFFENSIVE) older than your face. Like, your eyes could beeee 20s while your skin and face shape would be closer to a 16 year old boy. It's one of those things that you can't really change but might possibly be the cause?
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Darrin Scott

Quote from: Nygeel on August 17, 2011, 09:02:39 PM
I haave no idea. Usually when people say "you look like a butch lesbian" they can't put their finger on what exactly it is. I don't really read you as a masculine woman. I will say the one thing I am excessively nit picky about is glasses. I know that what I say about glasses isn't an end all, nor is it something you have to do but...if you're able to...eventually...at some point in time...I would change 'em. Although the rectangular shape is something that helps make a face look more angular and therefore more male the shape you have doesn't exactly fit. They should be a little more narrow/not as wide. I get my glasses sized to my head and so far they look spot on.

Okay...ending my nitpicky ness.

It could possibly maybe sort of kind of be that you have an "in between" face. Your eyes look (I SRSLY DOES NOT MEANS TO BE OFFENSIVE) older than your face. Like, your eyes could beeee 20s while your skin and face shape would be closer to a 16 year old boy. It's one of those things that you can't really change but might possibly be the cause?

Thanks. No offense taken about the nitpicky stuff. That's what I need to hear. As for my glasses, my insurance will only let me get a new pair every 2 years, but I might buy a pair anyway because these were the best out of the ones I was able to choose from. I think the rest will be left up to T. I don't think I can do anything to change my face other then to maybe lose weight? But even then, T would probably be my only chance.





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Nygeel

Quote from: darrin.scott on August 17, 2011, 09:05:57 PM
Thanks. No offense taken about the nitpicky stuff. That's what I need to hear. As for my glasses, my insurance will only let me get a new pair every 2 years, but I might buy a pair anyway because these were the best out of the ones I was able to choose from. I think the rest will be left up to T. I don't think I can do anything to change my face other then to maybe lose weight? But even then, T would probably be my only chance.
I don't recommend weight loss because I don't think it will help.
Try to see if you can get them sized to your face. If you go to one of those quick places you won't be able to get a perfect fit. I'm not sure what sort of stores have the devices to measure the different spots on your face/head in order to get the right size frames but if you can find that, doooo it!
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Da Monkey

I agree with what Nygeel said about the glasses, but I know how crazy expensive glasses can be. I think a 3 on the sides would look good.

I say you pass fine in the second picture but then I see the bracelet that looks like a pride one (I could be wrong) and then I'm not so sure.

If it helps, I was very feminine and soft looking pre-T as well and only passed maybe 50% of the time. About 6 months on T I passed so well I moved cities and went in stealth there.
The story is the same, I've just personalized the name.
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regan

Quote from: Da Monkey on August 17, 2011, 09:20:05 PM
I agree with what Nygeel said about the glasses, but I know how crazy expensive glasses can be. I think a 3 on the sides would look good.

http://www.zennioptical.com/
Our biograhies are our own and we need to accept our own diversity without being ashamed that we're somehow not trans enough.
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Da Monkey

Quote from: regan on August 17, 2011, 10:27:59 PM
http://www.zennioptical.com/

okay, well I mean the total cost.

I am limited with my choice of frames since my prescription is so bad from high myopia (-18) so mine are at least $700 altogether.

When I went from -16 to -18 I went to pick out new glasses and they didn't even have any for me so they had to order a couple of pairs just for me to try on. So yeah I know what a hassle glasses can be. I know that sounds bad but I don't like to assume everyone else has it easier because you really don't know.
The story is the same, I've just personalized the name.
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Squirrel698

I'm sorry to say that you don't pass at all to me.   :-\ 

What I would recommend is more hair, not less.  It was the same with me.  The shorter my hair is, the more emphasis is put on my face and the less I pass.  I'm not even sure why, perhaps it is because it shows the feminine shape of my head.

These pictures were taken awhile ago but it's applicable to you.  I believe I pass quite a bit less in the first one with shorter hair.





"It matters not how strait the gate, How charged with punishments the scroll, I am the master of my fate: I am the captain of my soul"
Invictus - William Ernest Henley
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Nero

Can't put my finger on it either but I also think it's something with the eyes. You kind of look like you're wearing eye makeup in the first pic and it might be the frames. Are they tinted?
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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EliNewGuy

Hey Darrin,

DISCLAIMER (for anyone who will read this and think it "harsh"):  I don't often post in the "do I pass" threads (nor do I post looking for feedback) because I find that most people are far more "Pollyanna-ish" than I would be, and I don't want to be a total downer ->-bleeped-<- for someone, nor do I want sunshine squirted up my own ass. 

But since you asked for the feedback and don't seem to take offense at bluntness, I'll give you my honest assessment, as I struggle with this one too, at least with the hair.  Luckily, I have a great hairstylist (and there's another stylist there, a gay man, who also gives advice) who's very up-front with me about what I can and can't pull off, and what says "butch lesbian" vs. "gay man." 

1.  Hair - the first two photos have all your hair oriented upward.  It seems that when I have the hair all pointing up like that, I tend to come across as a BL vs. a guy.  It's different from when I do a fauxhawk or the little "ducktail" thing that's popular right now (at least among many gay men I see).  Maybe consider side parting or something different like that?  I think the last pic is best as far as hair goes.  But you're still being held back by...

2.  Flannel/plaid shirt.  Screams "lesbian."  When I decided to really put effort into passing, I had to give up a bit of "but it's comfy!/but it's ME!" and I had my little hissy fit about it.  But right now, it matters more to me to be seen than to be all 90's grunge rocker in my comfy carpenter cords and my flannel shirt.  :/  You may have to make a similar call.  Seriously, it's part of the standard uniform.  Lose the plaid.

3.  Oversize glasses - emphasizes being too big for your face, emphasizing face, and you know where this goes...our soft, delicate features, etc.  (ugh).  People have already mentioned the glasses so I'll just add that I second the idea of smaller ones and/or different style. 

4.  You appear stocky/overweight in your photos (but the angles are tough so if you're actually not, ignore this part!).  Putting on extra fat will often accentuate facial fat for us (as SOON as I start putting on extra fat, it flies right to my chin), which will impair passing.  It also pads the hips and ass for us pre-T folks.  And, for whatever reason, it seems to be a common build for butch lesbians. I don't know why.  So if you're willing/able (I don't know how much is fat and how much is just "naturally stocky") to lose some weight, at least in fat weight, that might help.  I went from 147 to 132 when I finally realized that I wasn't appearing "big" to anyone, just fat, and it helped my passing ENORMOUSLY.

The last thing, which you can't do anything about, is that you just happen to have nice thick lips, which are generally much more common on females than males.  You're stuck with that and maybe later it'll even be an asset, but for now it doesn't help.  :/  I have the same attribute. 

Hope this helps,
Eli
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Wes

Teasing your hair..To tease your hair, put some product in it and instead of combing it out along the hair like you would normally...comb it the wrong way towards the head. Hold a bunch of your hair in your hand and do that. Some of the hair will bunch up and make teeny little knots into the hair...I'm not sure if I can post videos' for this and I am not sure I am explaining it right...but look up 'How to tease hair'...and there are a few youtube video's that show you how to do it.. =) I was a punk in high school so this kind of hair treatment was a daily thang for me hehe
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Darrin Scott

Thanks again guys!

Eli, I'm not offended by what you posted. Thanks for your input. I actually wear more T-shirts like in my avatar then I do plaid, but I do see what you're saying. As I've said before, I'll look into getting glasses, but they are expensive and more than likely I won't be able to get any until next April, but we'll see. I am a little heavy which might add to the face. I'm not wearing eye make-up I just naturally have dark circles under my eyes and I REALLY don't want to wear make-up to cover it up. It's just there....






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Darrin Scott

Just an update.

I went to the barber shop today and passed 100%. I even gave my male name. It was nice to have a real mens haircut and it was also nice that this guy was not afraid to cut it really short like all the women that I've let cut my hair do. It was a great experience.





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Da Monkey

That's awesome, I still have never been to one. Are you gonna post some new pictures of it?
The story is the same, I've just personalized the name.
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