Could Transsexuality be a form of Intersexed?

[Janet_Girl]

Many people know that being intersexed is a physical or chromosomal condition.  But is not the brain part of the body?  Is not the synapse of the brain just as important to the make up of the body?

Thoughts?  Comments?

[Hikari]

I consider it one, there is a fair bit of emerging research that suggests it, and I don't feel that I got some purely mental complex so young, for no apparent reason. Personally I consider us just as much as intersexed as women with CAIS are, and I would bet in the next 50 years science will prove that, and the only reason it will take so long is we aren't a priority to research.

[Vincent E.S.]

I've always thought of it as one also. It seems to me that with transsexuality, something caused the genitals to be so screwed up, they turned into the opposite of what they were supposed to be.

[Venus-Castina]

I use the term "Neurologically intersex".

[Cindy]

Hi Sis,

Not by the classic definitions but we (humans) all start female in utero and then our brains and bodies respond to T to convert us into male, well some of us, present group excluded. There have been a number of publications noting that brain changes in gay people look more female than male, particularly in the hypothalamus. Which as you know is the 'conductor' of the endocrine system. There hasn't to my knowledge been studies on TG people, as getting hold of TG brains for post mortem analysis is probably difficult. And I occasionally use mine so they cannot borrow it.

But I think it is quite clear that we are a form of inter-sexed. There is no good work demonstrating that we have psychiatric problems leading to a 'belief' that we are the wrong gender. There is no evidence that our up bringing has had anything to do with it. Proven in fact by Susan's site, there are TG boys and girls who have brothers and sisters who have been brought up in exactly the same environment and who do not have TG problems. I'm aware of one set of identical twins who went from MtF, which is strong evidence for a genetic link.

There will always be the pretenders and the fetish people who cloud the waters, but in general I think TG is a truly a form of inter-sex, just a bit too difficult to demonstrate at birth. 

Do you get inter-sexed ferrets?

Cindy

[tekla]

I'm aware of one set of identical twins who went from MtF, which is strong evidence for a genetic link.

Really, a single occurrence is now considered strong evidence.  Couldn't it just as easily be a statistical fluke?

[FairyGirl]

Hi Cindy,

Actually I posted an extensive list of links to study on transsexual brains.  AFAIK studies on homosexuals have shown their brains to be more similar to heterosexual brains of the same gender than they are to the opposite gender.

Here is the list, some good reading here:

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,100182.msg748665.html#msg748665

[Amazon D]

Hi Sis,

Not by the classic definitions but we (humans) all start female in utero and then our brains and bodies respond to T to convert us into male, well some of us, present group excluded. There have been a number of publications noting that brain changes in gay people look more female than male, particularly in the hypothalamus. Which as you know is the 'conductor' of the endocrine system. There hasn't to my knowledge been studies on TG people, as getting hold of TG brains for post mortem analysis is probably difficult. And I occasionally use mine so they cannot borrow it.

But I think it is quite clear that we are a form of inter-sexed. There is no good work demonstrating that we have psychiatric problems leading to a 'belief' that we are the wrong gender. There is no evidence that our up bringing has had anything to do with it. Proven in fact by Susan's site, there are TG boys and girls who have brothers and sisters who have been brought up in exactly the same environment and who do not have TG problems. I'm aware of one set of identical twins who went from MtF, which is strong evidence for a genetic link.
There will always be the pretenders and the fetish people who cloud the waters, but in general I think TG is a truly a form of inter-sex, just a bit too difficult to demonstrate at birth. 

Do you get inter-sexed ferrets?

Cindy

Are they the lesbian pilots from the USA ? If not i know another set who went MTF i met at michigan womyns music festival in 99

[caitlin_adams]

It is my lay opinion that gender incongruence is a result of being, as Venus Castina puts it, neurologically intersexed.

As Chloe noted there seems to be a consensus gathering around this theory. There are a lot of studies that show the brains of homosexual men fall within typical male ranges when it comes to structure as opposed to pre and post HRT MTFs, thus ruling out the idea that the change in structure is a result of neurological plasticity and the effects of HRT.

I think this is important to recognize as it validates the use of medical intervention to achieve gender congruence between mind and body.

Imagine if at age 11 a young male bodied person with a 'female typical' gender identity presented to a GP or psychiatrist and their response was "Mr and Mrs Smith, commonly when one experiences gender incongruity it is because they have a brain structure more closely resembling the opposite of their biological sex. If your child wishes to transition into a female typical gender role we can do x, y and z after which they can live a happy, well adjusted normal life."

By understanding it you demystify and destigmatise it.

I believe the more widely known and understood the above information is, the less stigmatized treatment for gender incongruence becomes.

[Cindy]

I'm aware of one set of identical twins who went from MtF, which is strong evidence for a genetic link.

Really, a single occurrence is now considered strong evidence.  Couldn't it just as easily be a statistical fluke?

Kat, I spend weeks to set you up
You didn't even ask for the reference.

Cindy

[Cindy]

Thank you, I 'll read them. Cindy

[Sarah B]

There is a wiki section called Etiology of Transsexualism.  On Susan's Wikipedia pages.

If you find similar papers then please add them to the wiki.  Then everyone can benifit from this knowledge.

Warmest regards
Sareah B

[tekla]

Are they the lesbian pilots from the USA ? If not i know another set who went MTF i met at michigan womyns music festival in 99

Sexuality is not gender.