When you've lost God, how do you fill the void?

[Anatta]

Kia Ora kind folks,

This is for those members who have lost their faith[in a god] and now embrace atheism...[or if not pure atheism, at lease atheistic agnosticism]

Quite a few members here were born into religious families, attending Church, Synagogue, Mosque, Temple,  etc, on a regular bases-praying to a god for guidance, assistance, forgiveness, etc... 

It must be very difficult to completely give up this god-centric comfort zone...

What brings you comfort, now you know/believe all your prayers have fallen upon deaf ears ?

What now fills this void ?

What do you do to cope with your apparent lose of faith ?

Does it bring you a sense of 'freedom' ?

Please try to answer the above question/s without venturing into an attack on those members who still choose to believe...Keep it all about how you are feeling now-coping with this lose...

Remember folks this is in the 'ATHEIST" section,[for obvious reasons] so if you're a theist, please keep this in mind if you feel incline to pass comment...

I would also like to add the last part of a PM message[which I found quite interesting and informative] sent to me by Sera [relating to another of my threads on atheism]  "Atheists believe in the 'non-existence' of God!" 

Metta Zenda

[Arch]

Interesting that nobody has replied yet. I wasn't going to because my experience doesn't really fit the topic. I never had any faith to begin with...

[Anatta]

Interesting that nobody has replied yet. I wasn't going to because my experience doesn't really fit the topic. I never had any faith to begin with...

Kia Ora Arch,

Just out of interest, were you born into a religious family, but grew up without faith/belief in a god?

Metta Zenda

[~RoadToTrista~]

I'm not really pure athiest, I kind of believe that I'm going to be reincarnated, I guess that sounds better than souless eternal black void. The truth is, I don't really know, or I do but I can't think right now, but I do cope somehow.

[Arch]

Just out of interest, were you born into a religious family, but grew up without faith/belief in a god?

My family seemed like very relaxed Protestants at first. At four and five, at least until my mother became very ill, I was forced to go to Sunday school while my parents and brother went to church. When I was around six, my mother had mostly recovered; we went to church a few times, and then she and my father sat down with us and asked us if we wanted to keep going. My brother and I both said, "No, thanks." I had very strong feelings about the matter but kept them hidden. I was a secretive child, not just because I was trans.

When I was eight, my mother started trying to indoctrinate me...secretly, I think, because my father seemed not to know about it. I politely resisted until she stopped. There were other pressures here and there, so I made sure that I never brought up religion. And when she pushed, I just practiced passive resistance.

I think my father was the one stopping her from going whole hog.

Somewhere in my teens, she started to become scary--heavily into a televangelist whose name I don't recall, highlighting all the passages he referred to, stuff like that. She hinted around, then started making noise about having me baptized. I did my usual thing again.

Once, when I was thirteen or fourteen, I was very desperate. My father was changing careers, so money was tight and he was never around. My brother was an adult and was making plans to move out. I hated my mother. My body was changing. I had always had my boy identity and fantasies about male bonding, but now they were turning sexual. I was ashamed. I thought I was a perv. Some friends were very into Jesus, and they seemed so happy and so sure of themselves. I tried to believe. For about three weeks, I tried with all my might. It was hollow. I'm just not wired that way.

I have never tried again.

[Keaira]

I've had God shoved down my throat since I was in school. I think Christianity might have been a pretty pure and noble faith at one time, but now, Its full of hypocrisy and has just become a cult with more members. Did I believe in god at one time? perhaps. I know as a child I prayed to not be a boy. Maybe God is out there and testing me. But I've had to fight for so much in my life that I'd almost resent God if he, or she, were to grant that wish now. So my faith now is in myself. I've put my faith in others and been hurt and let down to often.

[Cindy]

I'm a strange one (I realise no one will believe that statement )

I was born into a very religious Roman Catholic family. Very loving and very devote. My Mum and Dad were fantastic parents who sacrificed their lives so that their children could get excellent education. They both saw that education was the only way for their children to escape the appalling poverty that they grew up in and their love for their children was absolute.

I was the highly desired male child. Except I'm not. And I wasn't. When I came out the religious fabric collapsed. I could not believe in a god that created me to be told I was a sin. I would be prayed for, and when I confessed I would be forgiven.

I gave up religion at that that moment. I, as did Paul the Apostle,  had a revelation. In my case it was opposite to Paul's, I saw a crock of crap. I have from that moment lived on my belief in my self. I believe in loving and helping people. Not because they share a religion, but because they need help, and loving people is, to my mind the fundamental of life.

I'll stop there .

Cindy     

[Padma]

I grew up Jewish by race, in a family that was Jewish by faith too, but I never believed in a god. I think of myself as non-theist, rather than taking a "stance" of Atheist with a capital A - the whole "everything was made by someone" thing just seems meaningless to me, so I don't feel the need to assume a position relative to it .

No void to fill, so no void-filling needed. Meaning has always been there.

Now love, that's a different matter - it took me until two years ago to realise that the apparent void in me that needed filling by others was already full of love. I'd hidden it there until it was safe to let it out. I really enjoy loving others and being loved, but it's such a relief to realise I have a rich source of my own.

[V M]

I don't feel a need to fill a religious void of some kind either... Nor would I necessarily call myself an Atheist... I know that I am a good person who will do their best to help others when able and don't really need a particular dogma to tell me that

I hear people say that "Love is God and God is Love" but notice that few actually understand what that phrase means

The hypocrisy of organized religion exposed it'self to me at a rather young age and so it was comparable to finding out that Santa Claus and the
Easter Bunny were fictional as well

I do believe in God and that God is Love, but I do not believe that organized religion has gotten it quite right as of yet

Basically, I never lost God, I just decided to lose the hypocritical purveyors who treat God like a vending machine of sorts... IMO

[Amaranth]

I'm with Padma on this one.  My mom and grandma were always in fights about whether the latter would be allowed to indoctrinate me or not.  I'm glad my mom supported the views she did, so I was raised to believe what felt right, and the idea of an uncreated creator never sat well with me.

I still experienced a void, though, a gap in my understanding of everything.  I filled it with Buddhism, and occasional study of things like biology, cosmology, etc.  Whenever I had the apathy and loss of purpose most atheists are accused of living with constantly, I would think about what the situation of humanity is believed to be based on evidence and science. 

I've come to the conclusion that there's probably nothing after death, whether we want there to be or not.  I fill the void that desire creates by realizing that life is much more than we give it credit for.  In all the millions of years this universe has existed, we're the one known solar system with one planet in the exact position relative to the sun that supports life.  We are provided some of the most habitable conditions possible, and out of all the species who have ever existed and may ever exist, we're currently the only ones who are self-aware enough to develop true awe and appreciation of the reality around us, let alone the advancements in technology and society that have allowed us to take such interest in our own individual life spans.

That may not be enough for some, but I'd much rather take advantage of and be content with the sheer improbability and astonishing nature of our existence than spend time looking for a purpose outside of it.

[Renee_]

LOST?!?!?! Isn't the whole premise of the question rather inaccurate and insulting? I didn't "lose" god, I'm not checking super natural lost and founds hoping to recover god, or super natural bargain bins to trying to find a new deity. I was fortunate enough I was able to see past the indoctrination I grew up with and recognize the god of the Bible is just a myth. That's not a loss, that's a gain.

It must be very difficult to completely give up this god-centric comfort zone...

I never found it that comfortable. I spent many nights thinking about the billions(trillions+?) of people I believed were being tortured for eternity because they never heard or never believed. I spent plenty of nights as a child focused on the prayer instead of the belief and worrying I said something slightly wrong and would go to hell. As I got older I was uncomfortable with the idea of a heaven where my mind would be overwritten to never feel a negative emotion(what happens do you forget a ton, are you loaded up on supernatural drugs that make sad thoughts not bother you?). The simple idea of perfection bothered me. I enjoy competition, how do you compete if everyone is perfect? Christianity was never comfortable it was just what I believed.

What brings you comfort, now you know/believe all your prayers have fallen upon deaf ears ?

Friends and they actually talk back.

What now fills this void ?

Void? The only "void" is the end of existence when you die. I don't like that, I want to keep existing, but as I said heaven isn't exactly a great option either. "I" want to keep existing not have my consciousness transferred into a mindless praise machine. I was taught that if you believe in god and ask forgiveness for your sins at that point you are saved and will go to heaven. The good you do on earth will get you rewards(crowns ect) that you will then return to god and spend eternity happily praising god. Anyone you knew that died unsaved goes to hell and burns forever and you either won't know or won't care. Life doesn't matter, to quote the pastor "This life is the only hell believers will know, and it's the only heaven non-believers will know". I "lost" the rather dubious eternal "existence"(if you can call being so altered still existing) I believed I would have some day and gained a life that actually matters now. LIFE fills the void, when it's not just a way stop to heaven living is an amazing experience. It has it's ups and downs(too many downs) but the simple ability to enjoy living... I don't have a void, I quit believing in an existence where I was barely living and expecting to be even less alive when I died and GAINED a life that while too short is full of meaning.

Since I didn't lose something I want no longer believing in god did not create a void.

What do you do to cope with your apparent lose of faith ?

Cope? The only thing to cope with is the fact life will end. Cope by living, focus on today's happiness not the eventual end.

Does it bring you a sense of 'freedom' ?

YES

coping with this lose...

IT'S NOT A LOSS. It's a GAIN.

Atheists believe in the 'non-existence' of God!"

That's a load of crap. Yes, there are some atheists out there that believe there is no god as religiously as theists believe there is. Theists like to trumpet those people, but that theistic view of atheism is just a load of crap. A-theist - non-theist I don't have to believe there is no god to not believe there is one. There may well be a god, by definition a natural being can not disprove the existence of a super natural being. I know no god, I have no god, I'm not looking for a god. I do not think there is one but know I can't eliminate the possibility. You might say "oh you admit you don't know that makes you agnostic" Too me agnosticism focuses on the question. I'm not questioning I don't care enough about supernatural speculation to be comfortable calling myself agnostic. I don't know of a god, I don't "think" there is one, I don't need one. To me it's as much a settled subject as the existence of dragons.  Maybe, maybe not, who really cares? I'm an atheist not because I "believe" in non-existence but rather because I don't know of an existence and don't care enough to speculate further.

You tell us not to insult the theists in our answers. How insulting do you think I find it to be told I've "lost god" I have a "void" and I "believe in non-existence"?

[Arch]

Please tone it down, Renee. Zenda was very specific that she was addressing people who DID have faith at one time but who HAVE lost that faith and have taken a nonreligious path. She writes,

This is for those members who have lost their faith[in a god] and now embrace atheism...[or if not pure atheism, at lease atheistic agnosticism].

Also remember that "lose" has a number of meanings. Granted, Zenda seems to have meant it as a deprivation, but the word can also mean to get rid of something intentionally.

I understand exactly what you are saying, and I understand your objections. Many atheists (whether they ever had faith at one time) probably feel the same way. I, for one, never had the faith to begin with. And a few of my formerly religious friends who are now agnostics, atheists, or nontheists do not seem to feel that they have lost anything. But I haven't asked them, and I suspect that some people with nontheistic beliefs might well miss certain aspects about having that faith. Perhaps they do have a void in their life.

By all means explain your belief system. But if you already know that you don't fit into the category of one who feels that she HAS lost God/a god (regardless of what was gained), then you have no business taking someone else to task because the category does not fit you. Perhaps Zenda entered into this discussion with some preconceptions, but she did not tell YOU that you have lost your faith and now have a void. She was targeting people who have.

[Anatta]

Please tone it down, Renee. Zenda was very specific that she was addressing people who DID have faith at one time but who HAVE lost that faith and have taken a nonreligious path. She writes,
Also remember that "lose" has a number of meanings. Granted, Zenda seems to have meant it as a deprivation, but the word can also mean to get rid of something intentionally.

I understand exactly what you are saying, and I understand your objections. Many atheists (whether they ever had faith at one time) probably feel the same way. I, for one, never had the faith to begin with. And a few of my formerly religious friends who are now agnostics, atheists, or nontheists do not seem to feel that they have lost anything. But I haven't asked them, and I suspect that some people with nontheistic beliefs might well miss certain aspects about having that faith. Perhaps they do have a void in their life.

By all means explain your belief system. But if you already know that you don't fit into the category of one who feels that she HAS lost God/a god (regardless of what was gained), then you have no business taking someone else to task because the category does not fit you. Perhaps Zenda entered into this discussion with some preconceptions, but she did not tell YOU that you have lost your faith and now have a void. She was targeting people who have.

Kia Ora Arch,

I was just about to explain to Renee what this thread was all about, but it would seem you have already done this, so thanks...

Metta Zenda

[Anatta]

Kia Ora,

God [the concept of a god] had played a big part in the lives of many of those who are new comers to atheism...

So now you have 'lost' God, how do you fill the void ?

What has replaced god in your life?

Metta Zenda

[Anatta]

Kia Ora,

I had better explain my background...

I hail from a 'irreligious' background, however I did attend Sunday school as did most kids in the area where I grew up[cheap baby-sitting for our parents  ]...

Growing up [a part from Sunday school], churches were for weddings, funerals and jumble sales...I can count on one hand [with fingers to spare] the amount of times I attended church on a Sunday to worship whatever it was the other church goers were worshiping...

In my late teen and early twenties I did [like many do at this age] search for this elusive supernatural being known as god, mainly through drugs and philosophical debate with friends [as dope heads with time on their hands normally do]...For a while I was a dreadlock Rasta , but this still wasn't enough, to fully satisfy my mind...

I would say for quite a while I was agnostic-I couldn't pin down what many believed in and worshipped on a daily bases[ I had no faith whatsoever] but my mind remained open to the possibility for quite some time...

However over the years even this open mind towards the possibility of a god gradually began to close... The more I delved into the whole set up, the less likely it was becoming for a god in any shape or form could take up residence within my mind...

I guess now I would class my 'self' as an agnostic atheist, what I mean by this is, if proof of a god was handed to me on a plate, I would have no option but to believe in its existence...But I can't see this happening...

It's all in the mind...[of both the believer and non believer]...Where else could a god reside...

Metta Zenda

[Renee_]

Zenda was very specific that she was addressing people who DID have faith at one time but who HAVE lost that faith and have taken a nonreligious path.

I DID have faith at one time. I am now an atheist. That should have been fairly clear from my comments. Yes, lost can have multiple meanings but I think her meaning was clear enough. "Lost" "void" "give up...comfort zone" "cope" There is a very consistent theme through out the post that going from faith to atheism was a bad thing. I view it as an unqualified good thing. The only downside I see to atheism(non-existence after death) doesn't have a substitute I find satisfactory in Christianity. No void was created. There is no coping, There is no giving up. And yes it bothers me the way the theistic talk down to atheists especially those who used to be believers as if something went wrong and we lost something by not holding beliefs we used to hold. Theism does not intrinsically offer something atheists need but lack.

ps. My mistake in thinking Zenda was theistic. As I pointed out("Lost" "void" "give up...comfort zone" "cope") the original post puts a negative spin on the path from theism to atheism. I view it as a positive path. I grew up in a VERY conservative church. I was in church 3 times a week, went to a private school run by the church with daily bible classes 5 days a week. I was completely immersed in fundamentalist christianity from birth till HS graduation and I actually believed it. Now that I don't believe it I feel my life is better. I don't feel a sense of loss. I don't need to cope. And although I believed it I never found it to be a comfort zone.

[Anatta]

I DID have faith at one time. I am now an atheist. That should have been fairly clear from my comments. Yes, lost can have multiple meanings but I think her meaning was clear enough. "Lost" "void" "give up...comfort zone" "cope" There is a very consistent theme through out the post that going from faith to atheism was a bad thing. I view it as an unqualified good thing. The only downside I see to atheism(non-existence after death) doesn't have a substitute I find satisfactory in Christianity. No void was created. There is no coping, There is no giving up. And yes it bothers me the way the theistic talk down to atheists especially those who used to be believers as if something went wrong and we lost something by not holding beliefs we used to hold. Theism does not intrinsically offer something atheists need but lack.

ps. My mistake in thinking Zenda was theistic. As I pointed out("Lost" "void" "give up...comfort zone" "cope") the original post puts a negative spin on the path from theism to atheism. I view it as a positive path. I grew up in a VERY conservative church. I was in church 3 times a week, went to a private school run by the church with daily bible classes 5 days a week. I was completely immersed in fundamentalist christianity from birth till HS graduation and I actually believed it. Now that I don't believe it I feel my life is better. I don't feel a sense of loss. I don't need to cope. And although I believed it I never found it to be a comfort zone.

Kia Ora Renee,

Thanks for clearing this up for me....

However the reason behind this thread was to find out how a person could go from a harden 'believer' to a somewhat absolute 'disbeliever'...My mind finds it hard to grasp the change in perception of those that do...

I have an ex brother in law who became a born again Christian, ended up becoming a pastor in a fundy church...Then a few years back my sister told me he left the church, left his wife, and is now living with his 'male' life partner...I'm not sure whether or not he 'became' an atheist or just changed how he saw his god...

Metta Zenda    

[Renee_]

However the reason behind this thread was to find out how a person could go from a harden 'believer' to a somewhat absolute 'disbeliever'...My mind finds it hard to grasp the change in perception of those that do...

That is an entirely different question. I think for me the key is the definition of "faith". As I said I was immersed in very fundamentalist christian beliefs. My science classes taught creationism, 6-8000 year old earth, I was taken to seminars that existed JUST to poke holes in evolutionary theory. Sciences classes spent time poking holes in evolutionary theory. I didn't really have friends outside of church/school(the same organization). It was a truly immersive experience and I believed it... what else did I have to believe? But I think my ability to make that shift hung on "faith". I understand many believers treat faith as a way to explain away things that contradict their beliefs. I wasn't taught that. Hebrews 11:1 "faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen" Faith was taught as 1. an expectation that past experience predicts future results. The example my HS bible class teacher used. You've seen chairs hold people up, you've sat down in a chair many times and it held you up. When you sit in a chair you aren't hesitant, you have "faith" the chair will hold you up because of your experience. 2. a filler for gaps in knowledge. I was taught we don't have to know everything, what we don't know can be left to faith. Classes like science class handled arguing the evidence. I was presented with a christianity that was arguable and stood up on it's own without the need for "blind faith" to ignore "contradictions". I got online during my senior year. I used to debate w/ atheists and reasonably successfully to. Until I hit an argument I couldn't fit into my beliefs. I thought about it for months even brought it up at a Bible study(was told it was an off topic question). Since faith was never a tool for ignoring facts I finally had to yield to the argument. Once I did that the conclusions stemming from it completely unraveled christianity for me in a matter of months. It actually took me far longer to accept evolution than to quit believing god existed.

My first post covers why I don't see the change as a negative or something to cope with. This one should answer the question of how I made the complete 180 shift in my views. If you want I can spell out the question that started it and the conclusions I drew. But only if you catch me before I hit 15 posts or PM me. This is a hot button topic that can stir negative emotions, I'm hoping the ignore board options will appear at 15 posts at which point I'll ignore the entire set of religion boards. I'm happier w/ theism completely out of my life.

[Anatta]

That is an entirely different question. I think for me the key is the definition of "faith". As I said I was immersed in very fundamentalist christian beliefs. My science classes taught creationism, 6-8000 year old earth, I was taken to seminars that existed JUST to poke holes in evolutionary theory. Sciences classes spent time poking holes in evolutionary theory. I didn't really have friends outside of church/school(the same organization). It was a truly immersive experience and I believed it... what else did I have to believe? But I think my ability to make that shift hung on "faith". I understand many believers treat faith as a way to explain away things that contradict their beliefs. I wasn't taught that. Hebrews 11:1 "faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen" Faith was taught as 1. an expectation that past experience predicts future results. The example my HS bible class teacher used. You've seen chairs hold people up, you've sat down in a chair many times and it held you up. When you sit in a chair you aren't hesitant, you have "faith" the chair will hold you up because of your experience. 2. a filler for gaps in knowledge. I was taught we don't have to know everything, what we don't know can be left to faith. Classes like science class handled arguing the evidence. I was presented with a christianity that was arguable and stood up on it's own without the need for "blind faith" to ignore "contradictions". I got online during my senior year. I used to debate w/ atheists and reasonably successfully to. Until I hit an argument I couldn't fit into my beliefs. I thought about it for months even brought it up at a Bible study(was told it was an off topic question). Since faith was never a tool for ignoring facts I finally had to yield to the argument. Once I did that the conclusions stemming from it completely unraveled christianity for me in a matter of months. It actually took me far longer to accept evolution than to quit believing god existed.

My first post covers why I don't see the change as a negative or something to cope with. This one should answer the question of how I made the complete 180 shift in my views. If you want I can spell out the question that started it and the conclusions I drew. But only if you catch me before I hit 15 posts or PM me. This is a hot button topic that can stir negative emotions, I'm hoping the ignore board options will appear at 15 posts at which point I'll ignore the entire set of religion boards. I'm happier w/ theism completely out of my life.

Kia Ora Renee,

From what I gather, for some 'born again atheists' it can take years to get religion out of their system completely...

So I wish you good luck and happy atheism...

Metta Zenda

[Renee_]

I think religion is completely out of "my system". I was seriously ill 7 years ago and there were several nights where there was a chance I wouldn't make it through the night. I had to deal with the idea that I might really be having my last conscious thought. Not a pleasant thing to deal with, but I didn't run to religion. It's completely w/o a doubt something I no longer believe in. Religion is even mostly out of my day to day life inspite of living in the Bible belt w/ continued contact w/ my parents. However being raised in that religious did bad things to my life esp as a trans girl. And presenting the theistic with atheism tends to produce negative reactions in the vein of your first post. So even though my own mind is completely free I expect the religion around me and the bad memories will remain an irritant when it comes up for many years.