Spiro Resistance?

[Cirnobyl]

So I've been taking Spiro along with Estrogen since march 30th. I've tried different standard dosings but nothing seems to get rid of my body hair. In fact I ran out of Estrogen for roughly 3 weeks but continued on Spiro and what body hair had gone away came right back! Now I'm worried either I've got bad spiro or my body is somehow resistant. I know it sorta works, because at least I wasn't getting random erections BUT I was taking a high dose already and thats the most I got out of it...

So has anyone else had trouble getting their T down with Spiro? What are some good alternatives (besides castration. I just don't have the $$$ right now for any kind of surgery or doctor appointment for that matter...)? I'm tempted to use Flutamide chopped up into smaller safer doses. Any experience on this?

[Alainaluvsu]

Are you taking anything to block DHT? It only takes a little bit of DHT to ruin the effects of feminization, from what I understand...

[Cirnobyl]

I started finasteride about 2 months ago and ran out the same time I ran out of E, now I'm trying dutasteride.

[Sunnynight]

Is Androcur an option where you live?

[Cirnobyl]

Yes technically 

I already ordered a small batch to test it and make sure its safe/works for me.

[Sunnynight]

Great. Androcur is far superior to spiro as an antiandrogen. I think you'll be happy with your results.

[missF]

Yes technically 

I already ordered a small batch to test it and make sure its safe/works for me.

Don't forget to monitor your liver enzymes when on Androcur! (and yup, it does work greatly, but  I'm glad I don't i't need anymore ) And remember that hormones/anti androgens take time for full effects, so don't expect much difference in some aspects after 1 month with medication A or B

[Jacelyn]

It's not technically possible to develop resistance to spiro, but the drug's effectiveness depended on brand, you may want to check the brand and change it to another before trying other anti-androgen.

Note: Androcur is not superior to spiro as an antiandrogen due to 5 factors:

1) substantially increasing SHBG and reducing androgen levels, thereby making less estrogen bioavailable.
2) inhibit growth hormone secretion and reduce growth hormone levels.
3) exert weak to mild androgenic action thereby weakly to mildly inhibiting breast growth.
4) reduce estrogen receptor levels, thereby making cells less sensitive to estrogen.
5) reduce natural conversion of androgens into estrogens, thru androgen depletion.

[caitlin_adams]

It's not technically possible to develop resistance to spiro, but the drug's effectiveness depended on brand, you may want to check the brand and change it to another before trying other anti-androgen.

Note: Androcur is not superior to spiro as an antiandrogen due to 5 factors:

1) substantially increasing SHBG and reducing androgen levels, thereby making less estrogen bioavailable.
2) inhibit growth hormone secretion and reduce growth hormone levels.
3) exert weak to mild androgenic action thereby weakly to mildly inhibiting breast growth.
4) reduce estrogen receptor levels, thereby making cells less sensitive to estrogen.
5) reduce natural conversion of androgens into estrogens, thru androgen depletion.

Are you stating that androcur is inferior to spiro or simply not superior?

[Emily Ray]

Generics can be 20% stronger or weaker than the name brand and so I agree that a brand change should be the first step. But, not having any E is your biggest problem. Only estradiol or ethinyl estradiol are going to reduce your T levels into the normal female range. It was reccommended by a pharmacist who gave a lecture I attended not to switch generic with hormones because the window in bioavailability is wider than the effective range of them.

Huggs

Emily

[missF]

It's not technically possible to develop resistance to spiro, but the drug's effectiveness depended on brand, you may want to check the brand and change it to another before trying other anti-androgen.

Note: Androcur is not superior to spiro as an antiandrogen due to 5 factors:

1) substantially increasing SHBG and reducing androgen levels, thereby making less estrogen bioavailable.
2) inhibit growth hormone secretion and reduce growth hormone levels.
3) exert weak to mild androgenic action thereby weakly to mildly inhibiting breast growth.
4) reduce estrogen receptor levels, thereby making cells less sensitive to estrogen.
5) reduce natural conversion of androgens into estrogens, thru androgen depletion.

Interesting. One of its"side effects" are exactly the breast growth. And believe me: it is very good and powerful anti androgen.

[Jacelyn]

Androcur is a weak gonadal androgen production inhibitor (http://home.earthlink.net/~miche1/hormones.html), it may cause temporary result of breast growth but after prolonged use (3 months+), due to substantially increasing SHBG (decreasing bioavailable estrogen) and together with other factors as mentioned will begin to hinder rather than contributing to breast growth.

Spiro has contributing effect on the breast growth (long term) by increasing conversion of androgens into estrogens. The increased conversion is due to inhibition of conversion of weak androgens to stronger ones (ex androstenedione to testosterone) and thus more androstenedione left to convert to estrone (thru aromatase). Estrone can later be converted to a stronger estrogen, estradiol.