New SRS technique?

[Terra]

Ok, I remember reading a bit ago that Thailand I think was/has developed a new technique to do srs. They would take cheek cells to grow a graft that would self lubricate and could be made to any depth. But I have forgotten where I read about this technique and haven't found any new information on it. Any of you know who is performing this procedure or if any one is?

[~RoadToTrista~]

http://transgirldiaries.com/?p=2133

[Joeyboo~ :3]

http://transgirldiaries.com/?p=2133

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Awh yeah.
i'm gonna have a pimpin vagina.
Since I'm not gonna be able to afford SRS in like a million years, so it'd be even better right?

[toxicblue]

After reading that, I think I'd prefer penile inversion. It sounds more natural.

[Morrigan]

Since I'm not gonna be able to afford SRS in like a million years, so it'd be even better right?

I'm thinking a donor vagina? 

[Sadie]

I'm thinking a donor vagina? 

Might be closer than we think, saw a really interesting documentary on transplant technology and its getting pretty amazing.  They have at this date grown a heart and lungs from using part donor material but with the recipients own cells. So much that they had these newly grown heart and lungs, beating and breathing outside of the body. So how hard could a vagina be?

[Sadie]

After reading that, I think I'd prefer penile inversion. It sounds more natural.

How so?  Vaginas are made of mucosa material and are meant to lubricate and be very pliable.  How does a vagina made of skin sound more natural?

[Terra]

Wow, thanks for the source.

might have to rethink on when i'm going to try for my srs if this might be available soon.

[Jacelyn]

Penile inversion is the oldest technique, the penile flap is more suitable for construction of the external lips to match the nature one, but this material is not enough to create the lips in the inversion technique, as a result, later vaginoplasty surgery usually necessary to improve appearance, but the result is not as nature when constructed with penile flap. Present technique of non-inversion is using normal skin graft for vagina, the new technique simply change the graft material with cheek cells which is better, so the rest of the technique already exist as standard procedure (not entirely new).

Cheek cells can apart from being self-lubricating, it can also absorb sexual fluid that is left inside, which mean it is self-cleansing like the nature vagina, later administration of hormone tablet can be through this route too (thus by pass the liver).

[Danacee]

All the decent surgeons today use scrotal tissue for the actual vagina, the penis are entirely there for the clitoris/inner labia. Scrotal tissue might not sound so great, but its actually very good tissue. First thing the surgeons literally cut out all the hair cells over a lamp, and secondly scrotal tissue is the analog of the inner labia and vaginal opening on normal women. Its extremely flexible and absorbent of estrogen and for intent purposes morphs into normal red vaginal skin, same texture feel and color. Still like mucosa it is not very sensitive to anything but pain and also is very overly sensitive to any chemicals that can burn. .

Mucosa simply means skin that does not keratinize in its natural environment and in both the mouth and vagina is reliant on large glands in the region to provide lubrication. Using it in a neo vagina makes sense, but its not going to be the revolutionary breakthrough for SRS as it was for natal women with sealed vaginas, as they were using thigh and arm skin before, which is even worse than penile skin.

[A]

A vagina made of cheek cells only is likely to lack sensitivity. And unless you run out of material, good penile inversion SRS's today give good results in both looks and feeling. I remember a testimony of a lesbian trans woman who had bought a little camera and compared the inside of her vagina with her genetic female partner's. It looked pretty much identical, except for the fact one had a dead end and the other lead to the uterus.

[lilacwoman]

natural vaginas clean themselves with waves of contractions that forces the natural lubricating and cleaning moisture out several time a day and the same thing happens with the seminal fluid from sex - which is why women need panty liners or get messy knix?

colonvaginas work exactly same way as the colon is designed to move food wastes along by sequential contracting of muscles so my colovag cleans itself the same way.   after dilating and douching it does a sharp contraction that ejects the dialator lube.

as for hoping for cheek linings I think the costs would have to be very high for many years and then who is going to be the guineapig to test the theory that a cheek lining vagina will work and be happy long term?

when the penile skin is too small and colovaginoplasty is too expensive or problematic the bit of penis skin can be extended quite a bit by latticing it likr a pie crust like they do to cover the horror incisions needed for emergeny compartmnetal syndrome surgery.

[Jacelyn]

Scrotal tissue might not sound so great, but its actually very good tissue. First thing the surgeons literally cut out all the hair cells over a lamp, and secondly scrotal tissue is the analog of the inner labia and vaginal opening on normal women. Its extremely flexible and absorbent of estrogen and for intent purposes morphs into normal red vaginal skin, same texture feel and color.

It may look like mucosa but it is not, otherwise it would be self-lubricating (there would be no need for alternative method like colonvaginoplasty or utilization of uretral flap in order to achieve self-lubrication).  Thus it is not the nature skin type for absorption of medication through the neo vagina's route.

Still like mucosa it is not very sensitive to anything but pain and also is very overly sensitive to any chemicals that can burn .

Sensitivity should not be focus on the vagina wall, since the sensate nerves are preserved externally as material for clitoris/inner labia. Also the nature vagina's wall is not sensate. Deep vagina sensation is from uretus during the trusting of the penis, in the case of neo vagina, it is the prostrate's sensation.

Mucosa simply means skin that does not keratinize in its natural environment and in both the mouth and vagina is reliant on large glands in the region to provide lubrication.

Mucosa does not entirely rely on other glands in the region for lubrication, mucosa itself is self-lubricating, like the case of material like colon (colovaginoplasty) and uretal flap (with the Saberia's penile inversion technique).

Colovaginoplasty apart from being expensive, its blood vessels are linked to the liver, so it make latter day medication not suitable to be apply to the neo vaginal 's route

[Jacelyn]

natural vaginas clean themselves with waves of contractions that forces the natural lubricating and cleaning moisture out several time a day and the same thing happens with the seminal fluid from sex - which is why women need panty liners or get messy knix?

This only apply to excess fluid / excretion in the vagina, the nature vagina's wall can absorp much of the seminal fluid from man, along with its ingredient (estradiol, other hormones and minerals) for the body's benefit, thus it is well known that semen is good for the woman's emotional well-being and as antidote to depression. Also the vagina's wall is better route for hormone administration than sublingual, since there is no chance of being swallowed (thus pass through the liver and largely being destroyed / eliminated).

as for hoping for cheek linings I think the costs would have to be very high for many years and then who is going to be the guineapig to test the theory that a cheek lining vagina will work and be happy long term?

As mentioned, the technique of construction is the same, only the material for the skin graft changed, why should price varied from a stomach skin versus a skin from the cheek for graft?

[Elsa.G]

even though ive been saving my cash for some time for srs, i still know it wont make me feel complete. There's always been this black cloud over my head that i wont get rid of because im not a real female. I hope however that having a neo vagina will help me feel a little bit more at ease with myself though at least externally

[Sadie]

What I am thinking would be a little more complex.

Basically in this documentary, think it was on Discovery called "Can we live forever", showed how the problem until recently had been how would you take cells of a heart for example and have them grow into all the complex structures that makeup the heart? The answer is you need some kind of scaffold to build the organ on.

That was the revelation, they discovered that all organs actually have a inert scaffold that has the entire blueprint of how the organ is built.  They then learned how to strip all the cells from the scaffold leaving only the scaffold, then they reseeded the scaffold with the patients own cells and those grow upon the scaffold.  The end result was an organ of the patients own cells that can be transplanted into the patient without any rejection. It was amazing.

So take a vagina from a cadaver, strip all the cells off of it (its actually not that hard to do) and you would be left with a vagina scaffold and then take the needed cells from us (I am sure we have analogous cells to a female, I believe the inner mucosa layer of the urethra is the same stuff that lines the vagina.) Then transplant the new vagina into us and have no rejection.  If the tech is there that does not seem that hard.

I know I sound like Dr Frankenstein but I think it could work.

[Jacelyn]

Could you give some more information about this technique? Or a link to a place where we can read more about it? I tried to google for it, but the name Saberia in combination with "penile inversion" or "srs" didn't give any results.

I think the technique is pioneer by the late Sava Perovic but it is now Rados Djinovic who is the only surgeon at present that continue Sava Perovic's technique.

http://www.savaperovic.com/

Links to the technique:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11069412

http://www.peyroniecenter.it/files/Vaginoplasty%20in%20male%20transsexuals%20using%20penile%20skin%20and%20a.pdf

[lilacwoman]

/quote]

you be the guinea pig and report back on it and esepcially the costs.

[ByeBye]

Why can't they just make the vagina out of vaginal cells?

[lilacwoman]

costs, rejection issues etc.
simpler to stick with well known techniques.
plus a major issue that must be mentioned is that we all hope to have once and for all surgery so how devastating/debilitating/expensive/ souldestroying would it be to have a vagina fail and be rejected?
the girls who find that surgery has had complications and especially the fistulas go through months/years of repair and hospitalisations...who wants that?