Androgyny... or all the way?

[alexharmon]

Hey there.

I'm quite new to this site and I am uncertain about what path I should be taking as far as my gender.

I know many transpeople who have said that I will not make it being androgynous and that I should stick within and gender and deviate within it. I do not feel comfortable as a woman and some of my friends even use gender nuetral pronouns with me. However, I want to be androgynous, but many people say that it is even MORE difficult than being trans. I can not stand being a woman either way, so no matter what, some change is going to happen.

Basically, as far as dyphoria goes, I feel uncomfortable when I look at my body in feminine clothing. However, I love dressing up, but I choose more "cool" clothing. I love guys' hairstyles, and many people tell me I'd make an attractive guy. However, I'm not certain that I could go all of the way. I really want to be just a pretty boy.

Anyway, so, what do you guys thing? Androgyny or all the way?

[Shang]

Do what makes you comfortable.  Don't transition to something that doesn't feel right to you.  Your happiness is what matters.

[supremecatoverlord]

Basically, as far as dystrophy goes, I feel uncomfortable when I look at my body in feminine clothing. However, I love dressing up, but I choose more "cool" clothing. I love guys' hairstyles, and many people tell me I'd make an attractive guy. However, I'm not certain that I could go all of the way. I really want to be just a pretty boy.

Um...do you mean dysphoria? xD Sorry. This made me chuckle being the tad bit of word nerd that I am, but dystrophy refers to disorders due poor nutrition, particularly muscular related. It makes no sense here, so I was like "lulz".
Cute though.


As far as your identity goes, just be whatever feels right.

[alexharmon]

Um...do you mean dysphoria? xD Sorry. This made me chuckle being the tad bit of word nerd that I am, but dystrophy refers to disorders due poor nutrition, particularly muscular related. It makes no sense here, so I was like "lulz".
Cute though.


As far as your identity goes, just be whatever feels right.

Oh, whoops! Fixed it. There I go doing too much at once again

Anyway, I'm still trying to find out how in the world I will be able to find out. Androgyny is scary to me because I know that if I wanted to I COULD pass as a man, but if I pass as a woman as well, then I'm risking not being able to find a job and being discriminated against in general. It's a scary thought.

[supremecatoverlord]

Oh, whoops! Fixed it. There I go doing too much at once again

Anyway, I'm still trying to find out how in the world I will be able to find out. Androgyny is scary to me because I know that if I wanted to I COULD pass as a man, but if I pass as a woman as well, then I'm risking not being able to find a job and being discriminated against in general. It's a scary thought.

Before I started HRT, I could pass for both a man and a woman very well if I so desired & actually had this pointed out to me by several people. However, I feel like I should be a man and deep down, I've always felt that way. Before HRT, I could not pass entirely without additional illusions added to my visage or overall "guise", but now I pass pretty much all of the time without even have to try. I will caution you about transitioning in college though. Unless you are okay with being identified and outed as trans while you are in school, I suggest taking a couple years off to transition (if you plan to) or transitioning after college if you can wait. This is only because I had a miserable eye opening experience and I'd rather you not find out the hard way if you're at all like I am (and I do not know if you are).

[alexharmon]

Before I started HRT, I could pass for both a man and a woman very well if I so desired & actually had this pointed out to me by several people. However, I feel like I should be a man and deep down, I've always felt that way. Before HRT, I could not pass entirely without additional illusions added to my visage or overall "guise", but now I pass pretty much all of the time without even have to try. I will caution you about transitioning in college though. Unless you are okay with being identified and outed as trans while you are in school, I suggest taking a couple years off to transition (if you plan to) or transitioning after college if you can wait. This is only because I had a miserable eye opening experience and I'd rather you not find out the hard way if you're at all like I am (and I do not know if you are).

I do not really know how you are but I do know that I tend not to care what others think. I pretty much beat to my own drum, and I'm quite introverted... However, wouldn't you experience that same kind of experience being androgynous, asking people to use gender-nuetral pronouns? Wouldn't it be worse?

[supremecatoverlord]

I do not really know how you are but I do know that I tend not to care what others think. I pretty much beat to my own drum, and I'm quite introverted... However, wouldn't you experience that same kind of experience being androgynous, asking people to use gender-nuetral pronouns? Wouldn't it be worse?

Yeah, but I'm not androgynous anymore and I really didn't like myself back then. I didn't ask people to use gender neutral pronouns for me once in my life, but I always did tell them I had a masculine spirit. Really, I came to realize I'm full male and really do not like to disclose my medical history as trans with strangers. Of course, there are plenty of people who are perfectly fine with doing this, but I'm not one of them. I was only androgynous in my presentation, but I didn't fall into the queer community is what I'm saying. I just never presented as female, but was too afraid of the people around me to present as full male either. Occasionally, I would forget I was female when I was happy and that was when I was most content with my life. I assume we're not much alike, so transitioning and how people read you will no doubt be hard for you, but maybe a bit easier than it was for me. I don't even identify as "trans" per se, so heh.

[alexharmon]

Well, I am not entirely the same as you, I am quite feminine at times but the way that I communicate, act, speak, and deal with myself in social situations is very masculine. I just don't feel like I fit this body, no matter what... So... I can't entirely say that I know for certain that transitioning would be the right thing for me, but it would be good for me to have a fall-back gender...

[supremecatoverlord]

Well, I am not entirely the same as you, I am quite feminine at times but the way that I communicate, act, speak, and deal with myself in social situations is very masculine. I just don't feel like I fit this body, no matter what... So... I can't entirely say that I know for certain that transitioning would be the right thing for me, but it would be good for me to have a fall-back gender...

There are many more femme and/or gender-varianted guys here and I'm sure they will be more helpful to you than I am, mainly because they could probably give you some of their transitioning experiences for you to juxtapose. Hopefully, some of them will be posting here shortly.

[ativan]

I have used this quote several times, I hope Emerald doesn't mind. It's one of my favorites...
If you are just picking a gender to call yourself, it might be wrong for you.
In that case you could look at it as counterfeit.
The following is from a thread that was discussing it...

Gender has no meaning or value if it is counterfeit.
Counterfeit gender is just a game, a trick, an amusement,
an act, a fraud, a deception, an imitation, artificial, bogus.

Be yourself, not a gender.
Being yourself is effortless and genuine.
Being yourself is REAL, not counterfeit.
In being yourself, in behaving in a manner which is natural to you,
whatever gender you are becomes self-evident.

-Emerald

Thanks Emerald!
Ativan

[alexharmon]

You're right. I'm looking too much to define myself around the gender that I'm trying to choose.. I know many transpeople who are doing that and I wasn't even aware that I was doing that until now.

I have to try to be female, I don't really have to try to be male. I would have to try to be androgynous. It would be difficult for me...

Thank you very much, and thank you so much for your quote.

[Jamie D]

Hey there.

I'm quite new to this site and I am uncertain about what path I should be taking as far as my gender.

I know many transpeople who have said that I will not make it being androgynous and that I should stick within and gender and deviate within it. I do not feel comfortable as a woman and some of my friends even use gender nuetral pronouns with me. However, I want to be androgynous, but many people say that it is even MORE difficult than being trans. I can not stand being a woman either way, so no matter what, some change is going to happen.

Basically, as far as dyphoria goes, I feel uncomfortable when I look at my body in feminine clothing. However, I love dressing up, but I choose more "cool" clothing. I love guys' hairstyles, and many people tell me I'd make an attractive guy. However, I'm not certain that I could go all of the way. I really want to be just a pretty boy.

Anyway, so, what do you guys thing? Androgyny or all the way?

Alex, you said in your introduction that you are headed off to college next year.  Your college years are an opportune time for experimentation.  Don't feel pressured to make any hard and fast decisions now.

[Padma]

Gender identity isn't a career - you can try on different facets of you and see which ones you like yourself in - and you wouldn't wear the same outfit for the rest of your life, would you? College is absolutely a good playground for this. But enjoy playing, and you have no obligation to anyone else to be a certain way, or even stay a certain way.

[ativan]

You're right. I'm looking too much to define myself around the gender that I'm trying to choose.. I know many transpeople who are doing that and I wasn't even aware that I was doing that until now.

I have to try to be female, I don't really have to try to be male. I would have to try to be androgynous. It would be difficult for me...

You don't have to try to be female...Be yourself, whether that means adding facets of male or not.
Many people envision gender as a spectrum, let yourself be you...not an invention, not a statement, just be you.
Find yourself.

What I quoted was referring to not being someone else's expectations.
That is the counterfeit, why the word was used.
The essence of what Emerald said (as I understand it), is to be yourself.
Who ever you are, who ever you become in your journey of self discovery,
you will be the person that you are looking for...Your True Self.

Let the question of gender, just be. It's really not important enough to help guide you.
What ever it is or becomes, doesn't matter as much as you being true to yourself.
That is important to those of us who are non-binary.
Just be yourself.
It's something we all try to be here.
We are all different as non-binaries, we are all the same in trying to understand ourselves.
Gender is just not important.
Who you are,... is.

Once I learned to just let go of the idea of gender, I became more accepting of myself.
There are some of us who hang around enough to help others here.
It is that important.
What Padma and Jamie D are telling you is important.
They have been where you are, they have gone through it.
Forget all the labels and all the boxes that they go on!
They do nothing but get in the way of yourself, of who you are.

Ativan

[Pica Pica]

The essence of what Emerald said (as I understand it), is to be yourself.
Who ever you are, who ever you become in your journey of self discovery,
you will be the person that you are looking for...Your True Self.

Adding to that, that being yourself ought to be enjoyable and easy and natural. It shouldn't have to be a chore.

[foosnark]

Related to that:  it seems like people either find androgyny -- either as identity or presentation -- a tense and precarious thing, or their natural state.  It shouldn't be a balancing act, but a comfortable groove.  If it's not comfortable, roll around and find the groove, wherever it may be.

[VannaSiamese]

Just relax and be yourself =)  It can be really easy to feel pressed into one gender or the other, I know this all to well.
I transitioned to female over 3 years ago, and have been a girl ever since.  However, the more female I became, the more I missed being a male.  So, I decided to just do whatever, dress as a girl some days, dress as a boy some days.  Everyone still treats me as a woman because I'm very small, look and sound like a woman.  However, I feel no pressure to be a woman, granted I still present as one almost every day. 

It's important to find where you feel most comfortable at, and be that person =)

[insideontheoutside]

People told me to "just be myself" my whole life - but I really wasn't able to until I figure out WHO I really was. And I've noticed that as the years went on I discovered more and more about myself. I'm not even the same as I was 5 years ago in that I think differently about myself and who I am. I definitely didn't know who the hell I was during college.

So while it may seem easy to say that (and I've been plenty guilty of saying it myself), I realized that a lot of people are still on that journey to figure out who they are. I realize that maybe something better to say is, "do what makes you feel comfortable and what makes you feel 'right'".

[foosnark]

I've often envied people who seem to know clearly who they are and what they want.  Whether they actually *do* know, one can only guess...

[ativan]

The confidence to pursue the Journey, to find who you are and what you want. It's about the Journey.
When you think you have it figured out, often you have only figured out that it is a good place to rest for a while.
The Journey should never end, at least I don't want it to.

Ativan