Trans jealousy; what is a fair self-image?

[pretty]

A lot of times, some of the less passable members, or those who have problems with very masculine features, will tell passable or better-off members that they are very jealous, and that the better-off members should "just be happy because _____"

That kinda got me thinking, what standards should we judge ourselves by?

Don't you think it's fair and totally reasonable for any trans girl to feel sad about their body just because of the fact that they were born trans? Or do you think the eventually passable trans girls have nothing to complain about?

Also, do you judge yourself by cis girl standards or trans girl standards?

Personally I like to go by cis girl standards even if it's just setting me up for feeling bad about myself. But ultimately, I wanna be a girl, not a trans girl. 

[GhostTown11]

I go buy cis standards because I feel it would be facetious of me to think less of myself because that would get me depressed. Also, I have a very feminine body and when my hair finishes growing out I know I can put my mind at ease about passing. However, I do think a lot of the younger girls go for a barbie pinup look which is fine but it takes a good deal of work to gett there. That's what I find so great about the older gals is that they are more realistic about just wanting to pass as a woman even if they do not look like a bombshell girl.

[Stephanie_b]

A good thread, thanks for posting it.  I just want to look like a woman, period and am positively sure that I will end up looking like one, I have doubts there will be any traces of masculinity left after the hrt does its thing (I'm not masculine at all in any way as it stands). I compare myself to cis females too, not transwomen. 

But I do think its a bad idea to compare yourself to others, might just be me

[A]

Of course it's reasonable. Even if there's less bad stuff, there's still bad stuff, and there's nothing wrong with disliking bad stuff.

And I also go by cis standards for the exact same reasons as pretty.

And by the way, whenever I hint at someone's incineration by jealousy, it's meant in a playful manner, eh. I mean, I -am- jealous, but I don't mean any harm for that.

[Brooke777]

I am going to try not to compare myself to others. I just want to be the real me. If I end up not looking "good" compared to others, that is fine. I basically just want my body to match my mind. I think we are all beautiful in our own way.

As A said, I playfully say I am jealous of other women. It would be nice to look that good, but I am fine with not being gorgeous.

Another way I look at it is I am not the most attractive male, so I probably won't be the most attractive woman. I have learned to live with that.

[Dale]

We find more happiness in "inter-beauty".  How we feel about us. Hey just look at some at Wal-Mart, to improve your self feeling.  We may not all look like models, but with self confidence we will feel happier, and more fullfilled. We have reach a huge goal in our lives. That alone should put a big smile on your face!

[Kelly J. P.]

 I judge myself by cis-girl standards. The fact that I do below average on those standards means that I should alter myself so that I do better-than-average. This, however, requires a lot of patience of me, as getting the money together will take some time.

In the meanwhile, I feel very jealous for those who don't have to wait or spend money, because it means that aspect of their life is easier and quicker.

[Ms. OBrien CVT]

I don't judge myself by others.  Girls do that when they are younger.  20-somethings do that.  Older women do that.  And by judging yourself by others is a good way to destroy your self-esteem.

Judge yourself by your own character.  Be a good person.  Love others as you would yourself.

Many years ago I had a self-esteem issue.  Looked to masculine, beard shadow, thinning hair.  I was close to suicide.  Then a thought rumbled through my head.

"What if you were born female and still had these problems?"

It was then I realized that I am beautiful.  From the inside.  I just let that shine through and the rest took care of themselves.

[peky]

After reading some of the response I felt like saying: "what cis standards are you talking about?"

Have you been to Walmart recently? Lot of cis standards to chose from?

[Kelly J. P.]

After reading some of the response I felt like saying: "what cis standards are you talking about?"

Have you been to Walmart recently? Lot of cis standards to chose from?

My best "standards" come from what I know of high school and college girls in my area and at my age. So, I imagine these standards are usually based off of age and occupation. If you're a 21-year-old student, then you compare yourself to students near your age.

Besides, Wal-mart is renowned for having strange creatures in it

[RosieD]

Thanks Ms O'B for this: " And by judging yourself by others is a good way to destroy your self-esteem." Too, too true.

Besides which, why would I want to lower my standards so far? ;-).

Nikki

[Angelique1994]

I don't judge myself by others.  Girls do that when they are younger.  20-somethings do that.  Older women do that.  And by judging yourself by others is a good way to destroy your self-esteem.

Judge yourself by your own character.  Be a good person.  Love others as you would yourself.

Many years ago I had a self-esteem issue.  Looked to masculine, beard shadow, thinning hair.  I was close to suicide.  Then a thought rumbled through my head.

"What if you were born female and still had these problems?"

It was then I realized that I am beautiful.  From the inside.  I just let that shine through and the rest took care of themselves.

idk if this is wat u meant by judging urself to other people but i compare myself to every single girl i see to see if im prettier than them and u r so right that it makes ur self esteem so low cause i have the lowest self asteem ever i mean i have the body of a girl except  i dont have a vagina yet but i still dont think im pretty enough. yall are gonna think im crazy but i wanna be perfect i wanna look the prettier than any girl i see and if i see a girl thats prettier than me i changed something about how i look to make me prettier. ik im crazy

[eli77]

That kinda got me thinking, what standards should we judge ourselves by?

I think we should judge ourselves by what we can cope with when we look in the mirror, and what makes it possible to live our lives. Both are pretty complex and require more than a picture or 3.

I am not a fan of the "do I pass" threads. Passing is that thing that happens when you walk out the door.

Don't you think it's fair and totally reasonable for any trans girl to feel sad about their body just because of the fact that they were born trans? Or do you think the eventually passable trans girls have nothing to complain about?

I think it's totally apples and oranges. A passable trans girl can experience more dysphoria over their body than an unpassable one. I've met girls who are totally fine with how they look even though they are visibly trans. That's cool for them. Doesn't make my dysphoria better.

On the other hand I think it is important for those of us who have it to recognize our privilege in being passable. It does make my life incredibly easier, and pretending like it doesn't would be disingenuous and dismissive of the difficulties others encounter.

Also, do you judge yourself by cis girl standards or trans girl standards?

I don't think I really do either of those. I judge what I'm comfortable with based on my dysphoria.

And I judge my passability based on the reactions of people who are unaware of my trans status. Or rather I used to.

[UCBerkeleyPostop]

After reading some of the response I felt like saying: "what cis standards are you talking about?"

Have you been to Walmart recently? Lot of cis standards to chose from?

LOL.

[Jamie D]

There is a poem, that I actually first heard on the radio in the early 1970's.  It is called Desiderata, and it was written in the 1920's by Max Ehrmann.  (It is no longer under copyright.)

    Go placidly amidst the noise and haste, and remember what peace there may be in silence. As far as possible without surrender be on good terms with all persons. Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even the dull and the ignorant; they too have their story.

    Avoid loud and aggressive persons, they are vexatious to the spirit. If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain or bitter; for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.

    Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans. Keep interested in your own career, however humble; it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.

    Exercise caution in your business affairs; for the world is full of trickery. But let this not blind you to what virtue there is; many persons strive for high ideals; and everywhere life is full of heroism.

    Be yourself. Especially, do not feign affection. Neither be cynical about love; for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment it is as perennial as the grass.

    Take kindly the counsel of the years, gracefully surrendering the things of youth. Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings. Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.

    Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself. You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here.

    And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should. Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labours and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul. With all its shams, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be cheerful.

    Strive to be happy.

When I was younger, the key line in the poem was:

If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain or bitter; for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.

Today, this passage resonates more with me:

Take kindly the counsel of the years, gracefully surrendering the things of youth. Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings. Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.

We should all have realistic goals, and the goals for one person need not be the goals for the next.  Nor should they be.

[Sephirah]

Desiderata is one of my favourite poems. There is a lot of wisdom in it.

For me it's more this:

Go placidly amidst the noise and haste, and remember what peace there may be in silence. As far as possible without surrender be on good terms with all persons. Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even the dull and the ignorant; they too have their story.

[Beth Andrea]

Many cis-girls use the "Barbie" standard of beauty, and they pay the price for it.

If you don't like something about yourself (brow ridge, 5 o'clock shadow, etc) learn techniques to minimize or eliminate it, and achieve those as best as possible.

No one is perfect (although a few might come close), so just be the best you can be and be happy be content.

[pebbles]

no matter when you transitioned you will always envy others if it's part of your personality to do so.

[JoanneB]

We find more happiness in "inter-beauty".  How we feel about us. Hey just look at some at Wal-Mart, to improve your self feeling.  We may not all look like models, but with self confidence we will feel happier, and more fullfilled. We have reach a huge goal in our lives. That alone should put a big smile on your face!

Very well said Dale!

My "Standard" for judging myself, that I share with others, is to look around you the next time you are waiting in line at the grocery store. That is where "Real" women are found.

It may be a trans platitude but I do believe passing is 90% attitude, a good part of which comes with self confidence.

[Siobhan]

Comparing myself to other girls cis or not generally makes me feel like total crap.
Looking at my closest female relatives is even worse, they are totally gorgeous and stunning, and I just look like an ugly male version cos testosterone has ruined me 
Im trying hard now to have a healthier attitude towards all that before it totally destroys me.