What is it like to de-transition?

[MariaMx]

I think I do not have a choice but I do.

Doing nothing is a choice.

Though I don't really believe in free will I still get what you are saying, however, some options are sometimes unacceptable and thus not viable as far as  choices go.

[Beth Andrea]

Know why we can not understand someone else thoughts? 

It is because we can not read minds.

I think I do not have a choice but I do.

Doing nothing is a choice.

That is very true...however, if the other person is honest with what they share, and we are honest with how we hear it (two very, very big "if's"), perhaps some degree of understanding can happen.

The first step is to reach out and ask...the second step is to be able and willing to answer.

Rush had a song "Freewill" which had the line...

You can choose a ready guide in some celestial voice
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice
You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill
I will choose a path that's clear
I will choose freewill

There have been times I've felt "guided by some celestial voice"...and other times it's all me. Sometimes it's a chorus, sometimes it's a cacophony.

Sorry, got distracted there...

[Alainaluvsu]

IDK if this counts but I was part time before going full time (which I'm sure many of us did). I basically was male at work and female everywhere else. That dread of having to go to work and pretend to be a guy was filthy and painful for me. I literally hated my life when it came time to get ready for work.


For me, going back is not an option. It's something I'll probably die before doing again.

[Beth Andrea]

I don't personally know anyone who fully detransitioned, but I do know of a few that sort of toned things down enough that they could go either way in their daily lives and sort of forever in between.  Me, I couldn't do it, its got to be all or nothing. 

And I imagine that some who eventually detransition may have gotten caught up in things and experiencing so many new things during the process that they didn't really stop to think about the ultimate end and what all it would entail. Its partly why I'm not a big cheerleader, I think sometimes, there is a bit of pressure that shouldn't be there within our community to go farther than might be appropriate for some people.

Absolutely! The first trans-couple I met were really emphatic on that: Take it slow, one step at a time...go as far as you are comfortable with, but slow slow slow.

Not snail's pace slow, but at a speed where one can understand and affirm that's what they want.

IDK if this counts but I was part time before going full time (which I'm sure many of us did). I basically was male at work and female everywhere else. That dread of having to go to work and pretend to be a guy was filthy and painful for me. I literally hated my life when it came time to get ready for work.


For me, going back is not an option. It's something I'll probably die before doing again.

LOL...I was just the opposite...female at work, male everywhere else. But I too went FT because it was too "filthy and painful" for me to pretend to be male anymore.

[wendy]

Though I don't really believe in free will I still get what you are saying, however, some options are sometimes unacceptable and thus not viable as far as  choices go.

I believe in free will and I believe some options are not good.

Hormones make me feel better and I will continue taking them.

I feel sad to dress as a male but I can do it.

I also feel I can not integrate as a woman into society.

I have told few neighbors I have gender issues.

That works.  They can understand that and ask no questions.

No one cares about trans but trans people.

Do what you think is correct since happiness is an illusion.

It takes great courage to transition to a woman.

Anyone that understands how it feels in our heads would never make fun of a trans person.

I'm out but back to hiding.  No one cares either way but me and my family.

My autism is not treatable but I can learn how to live with it if I chose.

I would guess Mike Penner/ Christine Daniels became depressed and missed his/her wife.

[MariaMx]

I believe in free will and I believe some options are not good.

Hormones make me feel better and I will continue taking them.

My view on the matter is that scales don't choose which way to tip and neither do we. We stack up the pros and cons and sway to the option with the most weight. If our choices aren't governed by some underlying principal then they are random. Maybe I'm wrong but I fail to see a third option.

No one cares about trans but trans people.

Do what you think is correct since happiness is an illusion.

It takes great courage to transition to a woman.

Anyone that understands how it feels in our heads would never make fun of a trans person.

How true that is. Sometimes I wonder what not be trans is like.

[wendy]

Sometimes I wonder what not be trans is like.

Too funny!

I always felt we all were girls but some of us got stuck as boys. 

[Keaira]

I have a friend who 'tried' to de-transition. It didn't work. she says she can't pass as male, even when she tries. That's on top of all the other problems she ended up with that are unrelated to transition. She was de-transitioning so that she could try and get contact with her children again.

[AbraCadabra]

 
Something that has not been mentioned yet - I think - is the normalcy that comes about once you have +/- transitioned.

All of the sudden all this excitement of working out your "final solution" comes to almost... nothing...

In my case it made/makes me wonder --- what on earth was all this GD stuff about?!?

Its after a while as if you lost your compass showing female, female, female... you arrive... and the dang thing is spinning - arriving like some explorer at the magnetic north pole!

NOW WHERE TO GO FROM HERE

In some cases folks might just like the momentum and the 'drama' and feel they have to keep moving, and so keep moving away from their original goal/pole?

To be a woman is much the same deal as being a 'male' (well our kind) given a number of different priorities. In any case that is my experience.

I have to remind myself at times of how it was... almost KILLING me! Yet it happens only now, when speaking to others that are still deeply stuck inside their very own "transition drama".

Lastly, there is this question of integrity, it might be a binary thing.

But for me you either did, or you didn't do something.

You can't be 1/2 pregnant, 1/2 steal, 1/2 tell a lie, 1/2 do whatever IN TERMS OF YOUR OWN INTEGRITY... never mind those loopholes in law etc.

I think WE know for ourselves what was, and what is.

So de-transitioning the proper way is trying to undo something WE ACTUALLY cannot.

We just try to undo something not really to be undone. Unless the whole GD driven issue was one big BS trip. Can that be? YES!

Because some folks wind up thinking they are Napoleon, Jesus, Mother Mary, Theresa, the Empress of China, etc. and are completely convinced of that. Delusions EXIST, and it is THAT which a gender therapist has to figure out - and more better will do, before all has gone too far.

Would I personally contemplate de-transitioning? No THANK YOU, not in this life for all I can tell.

It simply FEELS unthinkable to go and backtrack. We walk through hell-fire, and now suggest a turnabout and walk right back through it once again?!

To ME... that is a pretty insane suggestion. But then, that is just my very own notion. It be devastating, killing - and yes as was mentioned it killed some doing just that.

Quite a subject as it turns out,
Axélle

[wendy]

I have a friend who 'tried' to de-transition. It didn't work. she says she can't pass as male, even when she tries. That's on top of all the other problems she ended up with that are unrelated to transition. She was de-transitioning so that she could try and get contact with her children again.

This is funny in an odd way in that I look better as a woman than a man; however I can not pass as a woman unless I wear a wig and modify my voice.   I guess I pass as a guy if I suppress and somewhat pass as a gal if I try.

Keaira did your friend that tried to de-transition have plethora of mental issues rampant in community?

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Axell wrote, "Lastly, there is this question of integrity, it might be a binary thing. But for me you either did, or you didn't do something."

I have no problem with humans being analog.  There are no lines between man and woman.  Overlap makes sense.   I also see no problems in people making one decision over another.  Many put off transitioning for years.

[Dahlia]

I've watched a TV 'documentary' once about 'christians' 'saving' homeless MTF by first of all converting them to christianity and giving them shelter and then forced them to  revert back to being 'straight' 'men' being forced into marriages with women.


It was heartbreaking to look at, this foul blackmail and besides that: the 'former' MTF's didn't make credible men.


Very strange to look at because of the remnants of their former feminity in their faces and figure.


I personally know one person who went from male to female...and changed zher mind post op.


First zhe had zher breastimplants removed, then zhe went off hormones and started using an 'in between' hormone for a year or so and then started to use testosterone....and grew a goatee.


Zhe doesn't call zherself a man, nor a woman, nor MTF but TG, to avoid 'new' social problems.


And also a very strange one to look at.

[Joelene9]

  What Dahlia described is 'repairative therapy'.  It has been in use by christian groups and others to 'cure' gays, lesbians, and transsexuals in the past.  There were a lot of attempted suicides, suicides, and remissions to be an effective therapy. 
  Detransitioning is an option here.  But at my age, the available women are not interested in a long-term relationship or those relationships have too many restrictions to them.  This after last summer's awakening inside followed by the anger I felt last fall.  I blossomed in the winter of my generation.  I will have to have a good support base that was better than the paltry one I had as a male before I transitioned.  I was treated more as an 'it' than a proper human being. 
  Joelene

[rachl]

Part of the reason psychological counseling is part of the Standards of Care is that, for some people, transitioning is not the right thing to do.

And yet personal freedom and responsibility: we're free to change our minds. No standards of care can completely prevent regret or de-transitoining. I don't even think that the goal should be to minimize it (conceptually, it's not far from tying to make sure it never happens). Hmm...I should write a paper on this.

[wendy]

I've watched a TV 'documentary' once about 'christians' 'saving' homeless MTF by first of all converting them to christianity and giving them shelter and then forced them to  revert back to being 'straight' 'men' being forced into marriages with women.


It was heartbreaking to look at, this foul blackmail and besides that: the 'former' MTF's didn't make credible men.


Very strange to look at because of the remnants of their former feminity in their faces and figure.


I personally know one person who went from male to female...and changed zher mind post op.


First zhe had zher breastimplants removed, then zhe went off hormones and started using an 'in between' hormone for a year or so and then started to use testosterone....and grew a goatee.


Zhe doesn't call zherself a man, nor a woman, nor MTF but TG, to avoid 'new' social problems.


And also a very strange one to look at.

Wow.  I do not call myself a man nor woman nor MTF but person with gender issues to outsiders and TG to community.

I have no intention of taking T.  Dual processor 650's hurt and may be removed.

I think I am fluid.  When I am with community I feel fine other than I remain autistic; however when I go home I feel I can live in two genders.  Living in two genders feels like de-transitioning.

We do not have a precise language in which to communicate terms.

[AbraCadabra]

 

[clipped]
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Axélle wrote, "Lastly, there is this question of integrity, it might be a binary thing. But for me you either did, or you didn't do something."

I have no problem with humans being analogue. There are no lines between man and woman. Overlap makes sense. I also see no problems in people making one decision over another. Many put off transitioning for years.

I don't think it is "putting off transition" it is, let's face it, simply NOT transitioning - but having tried. Fair enough.

Unless sleeping in front of a switched on TV is some sort of  'analogue' watching TV?

It's like being a bit 'analogue' pregnant... or having a bit analogue VJ or penis or whatever... if not being Inter, that is. And then one is also not 'analogue' Inter either - or?

It's the same with a bit 'analogue' de-transition... like it's a bit night... that would be dawn or dusk, yes?

We can of course relativize the heck out of it all and might as well stop to define ANYTHING. Like a car is a bit analogue bicycle, etc. etc.?

Just my non-relativist thought (binary? really?) on the subject.

Or just a what ... Analogue or a binary brain-fart?

Hum,

Axélle

[SUMMERWINE]

i have read about one person who had full transition srs ect and lived for a while as a woman but found that it wasnt working so went back to a male look. she had only small breasts so her body is still female but on the outside she presents as male. she never wants male genitalia and is happy with still a female body. for some of us maybe this is a happy halfway ground as with like me i have body gender dysphoria but may struggle to present as a convincing woman. at the end of the day its what makes the person feel complete not what others expect us to be like. i think it can go wrong for some women when they try to fit in and force bits of the transition when really its not suitable for them.

[wendy]

 
I don't think it is "putting off transition" it is, let's face it, simply NOT transitioning - but having tried. Fair enough.

Unless sleeping in front of a switched on TV is some sort of  'analogue' watching TV?

It's like being a bit 'analogue' pregnant... or having a bit analogue VJ or penis or whatever... if not being Inter, that is. And then one is also not 'analogue' Inter either - or?

It's the same with a bit 'analogue' de-transition... like it's a bit night... that would be dawn or dusk, yes?

We can of course relativize the heck out of it all and might as well stop to define ANYTHING. Like a car is a bit analogue bicycle, etc. etc.?

Just my non-relativist thought (binary? really?) on the subject.

Or just a what ... Analogue or a binary brain-fart?

Hum,

Axélle

Axelle fascinating comments.  Last year I sat in a therapy group of about 30 people (mostly TS) and said I was not transitioning.  As usual I was totally serious and as usual entire room broke out laughing.  Moderator said, "Oh I do not agree.  You are just on 10 year plan."

I also said last year to same support group that I an not transgender.  Moderator said, "I am always amazed how people search for people similar to themselves and then ask if they are similar."

O.K. let's go back to digital.  I am a man.  I am not transitioning.  I am not transgender.  I am eunuch by choice.  Prefer female hormones over male hormones.  Want to be pretty not handsome.  Prefer to hold a woman over a man.  Prefer to have breasts.  Dislike facial hair and body hair and prefer smooth skin.

Only trans people can somewhat understand my feelings.

I do not live real time.  I do not consider myself "transitioned" until  SRS.

Chicago did not turn out as I wanted.

Is a eunuch by choice analog?   

Axelle you consider an intersex person can be analog; therefore a brain can be analog.

I know several gender queers but are they digital?

.......................................

i have read about one person who had full transition srs ect and lived for a while as a woman but found that it wasnt working so went back to a male look. she had only small breasts so her body is still female but on the outside she presents as male. she never wants male genitalia and is happy with still a female body. for some of us maybe this is a happy halfway ground as with like me i have body gender dysphoria but may struggle to present as a convincing woman. at the end of the day its what makes the person feel complete not what others expect us to be like. i think it can go wrong for some women when they try to fit in and force bits of the transition when really its not suitable for them.

People are people and every combination exists.  I may be analog and could not sense that I arrived until I went past where I should go.  Do not know.

[AbraCadabra]

[clipped]

O.K. let's go back to digital.  I am a man.  I am not transitioning.  I am not transgender.  I am eunuch by choice.  Prefer female hormones over male hormones.  Want to be pretty not handsome.  Prefer to hold a woman over a man.  Prefer to have breasts.  Dislike facial hair and body hair and prefer smooth skin.

Now THAT sounds REAL to me... and standing to one's choices - that is not analogue, it clearly is statement of intend. Period.
Like I'm this... and so be it! Very refreshing when comparing it with some wishy-washy stuff... very refreshing! Taking a STAND, and making a choice - that... has integrity.
In my view at any rate.

Only trans people can somewhat understand my feelings.

THAT --- does not MATTER, and I'm not so sure if they understand, so WHAT?! It is your choice. Period.
When e.g. I decide to learn French there be enough folks that do not even understand that --- and never mind your choices, yes?
BUT... they are your choices and so they show integrity, to say it again. There is POWER in integrity. Absolutely.

I do not live real time.  I do not consider myself "transitioned" until  SRS.

Another choice, your choice, and who doesn't like it can take a hike. Quite simple. It's your life not the person's life judging you. Never to forget this simple fact.
If they don't dig your choices - fine --- you have to live of course with the consequences. The problem starts when we choose what we need, AND INSIST that others have to go along with it.
Than loosing integrity by trying to dance on a penny, trying to please one's own needs as much as others'.
THAT... is a no-go and it requires integrity, emotional growth, and the ability to LET GO!

Chicago did not turn out as I wanted.

So? LEARN TO LET GO!

Is a eunuch by choice analog? 

A eunuch is a eunch. Periode. No analogue TS/TG/T-anything for all I see.
There IS no need to complicate things beyond the necessary AT ALL.

Ockham's razors: "... assumptions introduced to explain a thing must not be multiplied beyond necessity."
i.e. an eunuch is just that - an eunuch. The rest is unprofitabe and unnecessary.
Amen

Axelle you consider an intersex person can be analog; therefore a brain can be analog.

Same here, intersex is just that - intersex, and so the brain will be intersex. Not some of this, some of that and some of the other.
Bird-lovers do not have portions of analogue bird-brains either, or?
No need to go into analogue stuff.
Again... Ockham's razor applies as you asked me.

I know several gender queers but are they digital?

They as you say are GENDER QUEER, and better (my view) don't go and create a load of confusing, confounding EXTRAS about it all.
Be gender queer and get on with it. Quite simple then, or?

.......................................
People are people and every combination exists.  I may be analog and could not sense that I arrived until I went past where I should go.  Do not know.

Babe, your are who you are, and who you choose to be. Stick by it and move on, and try real hard learn to LET GO.

There is NO magical mathematical formula out there to satify your present need to make 'sense' of it all.
It just IS - and THAT... will have to suffice, (since you asked me)

Hug,
Axélle

[Naturally Blonde]

A lot of people de-transition because it's not working, the HRT is not working, the fat distribution is not working, the facial softening is not working, and the breast development is not working. So the transition is not working out! It's a horrible situation to be in and I think there would be far less people who would de-transition if they physically looked like genetic females.


The expectations of transition are higher than the reality and after 14 years of transition I'm fairly depressed by my personal results but I still don't want to de-transition. 

[henrytwob]

Are we calling de-transition someone will in the one years lived experience phase? My understanding of teh SOC suggest one year - living as the opposite gender, I am also mistakenly (?) under the impression that during that year one can have hormones, because to a large degree, without cross gender hormone, few would pass. That said, the whole point is to see if "the grass is greener" or rather if you are happier and better adjusted as a person of the opposite gender. I could see how people could do a year and feel that it is not for them, for many reasons.

I also don't think SRS surgery needs to the the "end all" for a transition - at least not until they have it perfected.

I'm sorry to hear, naturally blond, that you don't feel you look feminine enough to look like a "real" woman. Have you seen the incredible variety of shapes and sizes of women these days.  It is strange, or rather i'm surprised, i have seen on a number of posts that trans -women are having trouble fitting in with groups of cis women, i.e. they are being excluded. I think that is terrible. one of the things girls usually have going for them is acceptance of others.