How much does 'hair' contribute to society's perceptions of others (us)?

[Jenna Marie]

For *some* people it apparently is a primary factor - I know I got taken for female sometimes just because I've worn my hair very long since high school. I have other male friends who were mistaken for women based on hair despite having bushy beards, and female friends who were presumed male if they had very short hair and big breasts/curves. Some people just don't pay enough attention, I guess!

[Adreni]

It is a society thing. Currently in the U.S. males with long hair still seem to be judged immediately as more feminine or something. It wasn't always that way of course. I mean, even looking back through "western" history men wore their hair longer and it was no big thing, it was even the going style during times. And of course in other cultures it varies too. All that aside, I do think that people judge gender by hair and that it's one of the major factors.

Yeah, what on bloody Earth is with people these days? Back in the day, it wasn't just "no big thing," it was the norm... EVERYWHERE! Plenty of cultures have viewed long hair as a sign of higher status or freedom, with shaven or short hair signifying servitude or poverty.

But then... I guess that answers the question. These days one is supposed to be in servitude to everything around them... I guess it's always been a bit that way, but it seems stuffier now somehow.

[Soren]

It's not possible for men to have long hair, you know! It just doesn't... grow.

You've clearly never been to a metal concert

[Stella Stanhope]

Very good points!

It's also the texture of the hair that's important and a gender indicator, just like skin textures.

Female hair tends to be smoother, shiner and silkier and this is especially evident when long. Men's hair (especially as most men reach their thirties) tends to go brittle and coarse, though they still might be able to grow it long.

A hilarious thing I noticed a while back when I worked in London - apparently putting bobby pins in your hair when you are gendered as male by the public, really confuses them! I decided to pin my hair up (sort of like the Edwardian female look but comparatively plain). It was a functional do as it was a windy day, however the "controversial" aspect was that it looked "prettier". And when a man crosses the line and does something that looks pretty, then it becomes an issue. 

So if you want to have fun with confused looks and even the odd surprising compliment, use a bobby-pin, it is mightier than the.... sword? 

[ativan]

Female hair tends to be smoother, shiner and silkier and this is especially evident when long. Men's hair (especially as most men reach their thirties) tends to go brittle and coarse, though they still might be able to grow it long.

I started to use oil treatments. Currently Fructis 'Sleek and Shine'.
Really gets rid of the brittleness in a hurry.
Yep, shinier and silkier.
Makes brushing my 60 yr old MAAB hair a lot easier.
It's down to my waist, by the way.
Ativan

[ativan]

Honestly, I don't think it's as big a deal as some people are making it out to be. I think a lot of people are just looking at it from the perspective of transchicks. I see a LOT of dudes with long hair and there is NO WAY I would think they were women because they sure don't look like women.

Really?
The Avatar pic is a year old, and my hair is a few inches longer and my hips are a little bigger now.
That was an interesting day back then, even with a tight T-shirt on.
I was with a friend in a park full of trails.
The look of disappointment on faces as they walked faster to overtake us on the trail was priceless.
Did have a few fun conversations that day.
It was on the 3rd of August, last year.
I should go have a couple pics taken to update.
Ativan

[Hollytime]

Mine is to my waist too.  I rarely get misgendered as a female (I'm a guy) but I'm certain its due to my build and my square, manly head.  That, plus I don't curl or style my hair in a feminine 'do.  Oh, sure, it happens, particularly if they see me just from behind, or if I dress up.

I think most see me as a long-haired rocker dude.

Its funny, though.  I knew a young lady who also had thick, brown straight hair to her waist.  Like mine, parted in the middle.  No bangs.  She used to get called "Sir" all the time!  She was a big girl with a rather "mannish" face; I'm certain she could pass as a guy if she wanted to, long hair or not.  She's lesbian, not trans, at least not as far as I know; its been several years since I've seen her.

[Stella Stanhope]

Yes, usually long hair doesn't automatically single you out as female, especially if you have a middle parting (which is what long haired guys tend to have usually). As mentioned before, its usually as soon as you wear something in your hair, put it into an "up do", or dress it in some way - then you've crossed the gender line and people assume your hair is of feminine presentation.

Ativan Prescribed - you are sixty years of age? If so, awesome sauce!! You certainly have retained your figure, and have amazing hair.
Oil treatments get rid of the brittleness?? My hair has suddenly gone from smooth, strong and thick, to thin, flyaway and brittle in a very short space of time.  Not sure if its monilethrix or just standard male hair-loss that's the cause . Do you think oil treatments may help anyway?

I get misgendered as female when seen from behind, sometimes, and occasionally people get confused, but my face clears up the confusion.... unless its dark. In which-case my large eyes and high-cheek bones tend to confuse them for a few seconds more before they notice my masculine sunken cheeks and shoddy skin.

[ativan]

Try it, I think you'll like it. It has really stopped the breakage and it feels thicker. Brush glides right through.
I don't wash my hair everyday, more like once or twice a week. If it's dirty, I used a conditioner to loosen the dirt.
The natural oils from your scalp shouldn't be washed out of your hair, so when you do use shampoo, keep it to a minimum.
Your cleaning the outside of your hair, not stripping away the natural oils.

Long hair, no shirt and a short skirt, and tall chunky heels out on trails in the woods will get you noticed and gendered pretty fast.
Even woman seemed to be disappointed that I didn't have boobs.
But i do notice that a lot of people come up from behind and look me in the face and suddenly get this bewildered expression.
I don't think they were expecting that Sam Elliot look I have.
It would be fun to have him gender me female only to catch up and see me from the front.
Even in cold weather, I usually wear a long coat that's a little below my calfs and I wear knee high boots with 3" chunky heels.
Same thing, gendered from behind as a woman. I'm told some of it is my movements.
They tend to be fluid and I got rid of that male swagger for the most part.
But the damage from Testosterone overdose has ravaged my looks.
I may try a more full dose HRT regime sometime. I'm kinda leaning that way lately.
I just don't know. I have never had a problem with my looks and most people like it the way it is.
Fluidity is a strange thing sometimes.
Ativan.

[Hollytime]

I started to use oil treatments. Currently Fructis 'Sleek and Shine'.
Really gets rid of the brittleness in a hurry.

Is that the one that comes in a little pump bottle?  Apply to hair damp or dry and gently comb through?  (IE, not a shampoo or "wet" conditioner?)  I must give it a try.

I'm currently liking Aussie "3 Minute Moisturizer" which contains Jojaba oil.  Its keeping my hair healthy but I get more frizz than I'd like.

[ativan]

It comes in a little orange bottle. It isn't expensive. It may be in a pump bottle, now.
Seems like I saw it that way the other day shopping.
A little goes a long way. 'Sleek & Shine, Moroccan sleek.'
It says Moroccan Argan Oil.
For Frizzy,Dry, Unmanageable Hair.
It absorbs really well, I've even used Hairspray for a scrunched look within an hour of using a lot of it.
I just drizzle a line on my brush and start at the bottom 4", brush it through and then work back 4" at a time.
I used just a ton of it one day to see how long it would take to soak in. In an hour, you couldn't feel it in my hair.
Argan Oil is really good for your skin, also.
So a little or a lot, it works well enough that I'm definitely going to be buying more.
I must have 15 bottles of conditioner and detangler stuff that are half full that I will probably end up giving away.
I will keep the the Dove hair conditioner that I use between washings, though. It uses the same oil.
When I wash it, I generally just use my body wash, Olay extra moisture with Shea butter. Another good product.
I use less body lotion than before.
I also use Olay Total effects 7 in one advanced anti-aging body lotion to wash my face with,
unless it is really dirty and greasy (still work on greasy engines and stuff).
The natural moisture oils in your skin work best, so why wash then out of your skin with harsh soaps?
I do use exfoliant little towelettes to wipe my face down a few times a week.
But I think just towel drying your face does the same thing.
Since I started LDHRT, my pores are all but gone. Damn big ass nose still has some.
Ativan

[black_moon_dust]

Depends on the person. People are too concerned with how a woman/man should look anymore and are labeled automatically cause it. So cruel

[Hollytime]

It comes in a little orange bottle.

Ahhhh I found it!  I rushed out to Target during lunch and bought a bottle.  Thanks for mentioning the orange bottle; they had a whole shelf of green Fructis products but then I spotted the little orange bottle.

I combed some in back here at the office.  It smells nice!  Too soon to see how fast it dries (or soaks in) but its sure soft at least right now.  As an unexpected bonus, its straightened-out the waves in my hair, although I'm sure that's just temporary, just like when its wet.  It feels like I've gained a few inches of length.  As long as it helps keep my hair free of tangles when I go outside (so I can comb it without pulling out hairs!), its a plus.  Thanks again for the tip!

[Shantel]

Long hair, no shirt and a short skirt, and tall chunky heels out on trails in the woods will get you noticed and gendered pretty fast.
Even woman seemed to be disappointed that I didn't have boobs.
But i do notice that a lot of people come up from behind and look me in the face and suddenly get this bewildered expression.
I don't think they were expecting that Sam Elliot look I have.
It would be fun to have him gender me female only to catch up and see me from the front.

Ativan.

A carload of guys driving down a country road sees a gal up ahead walking along the side of the road, her back to them. Beautiful long hair, nice legs, shapely ass and feminine walk, all heads turn as they pass her only to see a flat chest and manly face. The reaction is a riot, it would be interesting to get instant facial expressions on film!

[ativan]

It would be fun to have a collection of the looks I have seen.
I used to, before I had knee surgery, walk the dirt roads out here where I live.
It's an area that is more far right wing in politics/religion and also has a hate group that is not that far away.

What is nice though, as compared to the negativity of some here, is the conversations I occasionally have.
Most are people who live along the roads. There are some truly nice people I have met.
A documentary of those conversations would have been pretty uplifting for many.
I tend to try and keep them open minded, and people do respond in kind for the most part.
I find it interesting that they will comment on ideas that they have had.
Only to realise that meeting an actual person who represents some things they have always had negative views on, are after all, just another person.
We find common ground, even if it is a MN standard of discussing the weather.
I do draw the line at discussing Tater Tot Hot Dish recipes, another staple of MN conversations.... 
Ativan

[Shantel]

It would be fun to have a collection of the looks I have seen.
I used to, before I had knee surgery, walk the dirt roads out here where I live.
It's an area that is more far right wing in politics/religion and also has a hate group that is not that far away.

What is nice though, as compared to the negativity of some here, is the conversations I occasionally have.
Most are people who live along the roads. There are some truly nice people I have met.
A documentary of those conversations would have been pretty uplifting for many.
I tend to try and keep them open minded, and people do respond in kind for the most part.
I find it interesting that they will comment on ideas that they have had.
Only to realise that meeting an actual person who represents some things they have always had negative views on, are after all, just another person.

Attitude and personality can overcome a lot of pre-conceived negativity!

We find common ground, even if it is a MN standard of discussing the weather.
I do draw the line at discussing Tater Tot Hot Dish recipes, another staple of MN conversations.... 
Ativan

That's a riot! 

[Sammy]

You know this "long hair-woman, short hair-man" is extremely funny, because in a lot of ancient warrior cultures men were growing their hair and were proudly showing it. I believe the current trend is more related to the "military style" with all of its consequences (crew cut, buzz cut etc).

[Taka]

i have a brother who's too lazy to get a haircut. i don't think anyone would mistake him for a woman though.
and i just look cute with short hair.

but wearing a hairdo which is very stereotypical for the gender one wishes to be taken for does help if the rest still isn't close enough, if accompanied by the right clothes as well.

personally i prefer long hair on others. my own hair looks horrible when it grows long, so i ended up cutting it short just so i won't have to braid it every day just to look fairly presentable. a bun would also work.
but they're both too feminine on an already feminine body, i wouldn't like to go back to that.

[Shantel]

i have a brother who's too lazy to get a haircut. i don't think anyone would mistake him for a woman though.
and i just look cute with short hair.

but wearing a hairdo which is very stereotypical for the gender one wishes to be taken for does help if the rest still isn't close enough, if accompanied by the right clothes as well.

personally i prefer long hair on others. my own hair looks horrible when it grows long, so i ended up cutting it short just so i won't have to braid it every day just to look fairly presentable. a bun would also work.
but they're both too feminine on an already feminine body, i wouldn't like to go back to that.

I've seen your photo and you look good in androgynous mode with short hair, I prefer a low maintenance look myself as well and so what? We have to satisfy ourselves rather than live for the pleasure of others.

[Taka]

it's all about what i'm most comfortable with. i love long hair on others and it makes me sad when they cut it (gender is irrelevant to this), but i wouldn't disrespect their choice by telling them they looked better with long hair unless that's actually the truth (i can't remember that having happened yet).

low maintenance is great, but i sure do envy people who look good in their long hair just by brushing it. i looked more like hermione the way she was portrayed in the books, the movies didn't do our kind of chaotic witch hair justice.