Spironolactone in body

[SusanK]

I'm trying to find information on the uptake and residual time (curves) for Spironolactone in the body. I've found lots of descriptions and only this so far (from Wikipedia), "Spironolactone's half-life is 85 minutes, but canrenone's half-life is 10 to 35 hours, depending on the dose." The reason for the question is dosage level. Since I'm on low dosage (health reason), I'm testing, with my physician's understanding and approval, the once per day versus twice (half dosage) per day regimen. I just wondering if anyone knows some sources to judge the difference in the total effect from either regimens. Thanks.

--Susan--

[Wendy]

Susan,

I am not sure of the effects but the doctor knows what to assign you.

However you can graph the half life of the different regiments and you will see the difference.  The shorter the duration between pills the "smoother" the graph.  The shorter duration looks similar to .8 to 1.0 steady state.  The longer duration looks like .6 to 1.2 steady state.  That is not exactly correct but it puts things into perspective.

W

[SusanK]

Susan,

I am not sure of the effects but the doctor knows what to assign you...

W

Thanks. First, my physician has given me some latitude with the dosage to the maximum dosage to ensure my health. And she split the dosage at the maximum, so I'm wondering about spliting it at the lower dosage.

My physician has overseen my transistions and works with each to ensure the health of the patient. She also gives each some latitude within the assigned dosage because we're the ones on the drug. She trusts our judgement and expects we'll call if we have questions or problems. And she requires annual visit to renew the prescription to track progress.

Second, you're right the once a day has an initial higher dosage and longer recession time to a stable state. But if I calculate right from the Web source, spiro has a halflife of 80-90 minutes, which means it declines to a low state in about 10-11 hours. The half dosage will decline at the same rate but sooner to the same steady state, in about 8-9 hours, but will be reset with the next dosage 3-4 hours later.

Third, while not having the same initial effect on the body and maybe a less overall effect taking longer, the half dosage might be easier on the body.

I was just looking for additional information. You're right, it's the area under the two curves over 24 hours. Now if I can remember my calculus enough to determine the areas. In the meantime I going by 4 week tests.

--Susan--

[tinkerbell]

You can always read the inserts provided in each prescription bottle, or you may ask your pharmacist.  If you don't have access to the inserts, try this link.  You may need to enter the brand name of certain drugs instead of their generic definition.

tink

[Wendy]

Susan,

Remember that drugs break down into metabolites which have a different half life.  Try plotting canrenone on your graph paper.  Actually you are correct this is a limit problem in Calculus but graph paper gives you a good approximation.  By the way Tink has a wealth of knowledge.

W

[SusanK]

Thank you Tink and Wendy. I'm working on the graph plots (where did I put my log-linear paper now or find some software package). Anyway, in reality, I'm using the real-life approach and letting my body sort it out. Working with my physician we discovered both (spiro and estradiol) pushes me over the edge physically (to stay fit and active), so we adjust the dosage accordingly.

The problems in a transistion, plans change when reality throws you a curve:

Y_t=(W_t-R_t)/L_t

Where Y=You, W=Wishful thinking, R=Reality, L=Life, and t=transistion

--Susan--

[Wendy]

Susan,

I like your equation.

Do the meds make you more tired than usual?

W

[SusanK]

Susan,

I like your equation.

Do the meds make you more tired than usual?

W

Thanks about the equation, sudden moment of enlightment, or someone turned on the lights in the room and I saw the blackboard.

Since I started hrt a year ago, it's been a frequent adjustment of dosage. My physician says some people have different reactions to hrt; in my case estradiol pushed my body crashing (metabolism) and we reduced the dosage to the minimum to keep active, and spironolactone pushed me into a deep depression (double depresssion with Dysthymia) so we reduced it to keep me from that. This caused me to readjust the timeline, but really for the better financially (time to save more) and recluctantly mentally and emotionally.

As they say, such is life.

--Susan--

[tinkerbell]

Thank you Tink

--Susan--

You're welcome my dear.  I hope that you found out what you needed to know.  If not, let me know, and I will try to find out specific things about certain drugs for you. 

tink

[Wendy]

Susan,

Depression seems to be common at this site.  Fortunately the meds have not added to my depression but my depression is chronic.  However I have experienced a large energy loss and am tired too much.  I eat less and gain weight.  This is troubling.  Have you found ways to keep your energy high?

[SusanK]

Susan,

Depression seems to be common at this site.  Fortunately the meds have not added to my depression but my depression is chronic.  However I have experienced a large energy loss and am tired too much.  I eat less and gain weight.  This is troubling.  Have you found ways to keep your energy high?

Yes and no. It's one of the first question my physician asks me each visit, right after, "So, how's your life going?" She's aware of the energy problem and we always discuss maintaining my exercise program and being active (and being a photographer carrying 20-40 lbs of gear helps a lot). One of her first goals with my transistion is to keep the fitness level through the whole thing. And while I haven't done this, I'm gaining back some level, but sometimes it's hard to sort out where my age, genetics, and hrt are working.

The short answer is simply watching my diet and being active first, and then fit the exercise program when I can. Part of the problem is that I have a naturally slow metabolism, so hrt really rolled it into the dumps real fast, and it's a on-going self-awareness program. After reading many of the life stories, it's hard not to say, "WTF, why isn't mine better?' But it's the reality we all live with. Thanks for the words and support.

--Susan--

[Renae.Lupini]

Susan,

Depression seems to be common at this site.  Fortunately the meds have not added to my depression but my depression is chronic.  However I have experienced a large energy loss and am tired too much.  I eat less and gain weight.  This is troubling.  Have you found ways to keep your energy high?

Eat fruits and take multi-vitamins. I had to completely reconstruct my diet when I went on my meds. I also don't eat meat unless it is poultry or fish. If it had nipples on it at one point in time then I don't eat it. I don't eat at any fast food joints at all either. Even their salads are chemically enhanced. I used to taco bell and micky d's non-stop and would down an entire box of little debbies without any shame at all. Those days are over now and it is only healthy eating for me now.

Eating right, drinking plenty of fluids, and getting plenty of sleep keeps me going. I am not a big fan of exercise by any stretch of the imagination. I get what i can from walking. I am a freelance photographer in my spare time so when I go walking it is with about 40 pounds worth of camera equipment on my back. That makes for a fun day in DC. 

I haven't slumped into depression from my medications at all. So I can't talk about that point. I can only hope you pull out of it and get through it to life a happy and eventful life.

[ssindysmith]

Susan,

I like your equation.

Do the meds make you more tired than usual?

W

I asked about this 5 years ago my Dr. said HRT in the beginning HRT will effect your stamina because HRT suppresses testosterone, something your body was used to, and that after you adjust to have estrogen in its place you should see an increase in stamina and guess what I did

[Wendy]

Eat fruits and take multi-vitamins. I had to completely reconstruct my diet when I went on my meds. I also don't eat meat unless it is poultry or fish.

Eating right, drinking plenty of fluids, and getting plenty of sleep keeps me going.

Thanks Renae.  I am trying to improve my diet.
.........................

I asked about this 5 years ago my Dr. said HRT in the beginning HRT will effect your stamina because HRT suppresses testosterone, something your body was used to, and that after you adjust to have estrogen in its place you should see an increase in stamina and guess what I did

Cindy my brain adjusted nicely to E however my body prefers not to cooperate.  I look forward to more stamina.  I hope it does not take 5 years to get more stamina.

[Renae.Lupini]

What is with the need for more stamina? Doesn't anyone else just kick back and relax?

[SusanK]

Eat fruits and take multi-vitamins. I had to completely reconstruct my diet when I went on my meds. I also don't eat meat unless it is poultry or fish.

That would work but I have digestive condition which restricts the foods I can eat, so little I can write them on a 4x5 postit note. And yes I've had all the test about it and take a number of health supplements. It's a 25-year old problem from an illness. Fortunately I like the foods I can eat.

I am not a big fan of exercise by any stretch of the imagination. I get what i can from walking. I am a freelance photographer in my spare time so when I go walking it is with about 40 pounds worth of camera equipment on my back. That makes for a fun day in DC.

Interesting, I run and weight train when I can, but mostly rely on being a photographer and hiker. I also carry 25-40 lbs of either 35mm camera system for events and street, nature and landscape photographer and/or my 4x5 camera system for landscape photography. And I carry 40-50 lbs with that and the normal hiking essentials for the trails.

I think that it's as said, time as the body adjusts. It slowly is and it's interesting while many lose weight, I seem to be staying about the same (+/- 5 lbs). It's likely due to genetics, the German half with our "stocky, solidly built" women.

Thanks to all for the words. It's appreciated.

--Susan--