Quote from: Shantel on August 30, 2012, 05:48:13 PM
Gee Frank,
Isn't this just a bit insensitive to your fellow FtM's who became mothers before their decision to change gender? I'm sure they must love their children more than to consider them parasites! As for your concerns about getting pregnant, don't give it another thought, it ain't going to happen!
He isn't insulting those of us who have kids. He is saying that he views pregnancy as being something that he couldn't do because he views himself as male. Men don't get pregnant so emotionally he would equate it to being like a parasite. For the record, I know plenty of women who have had kids and referred to their pregnancies that way. They love their kids and hated being pregnant. So, no, he isn't being rude or unreasonable I would say. Pregnancy is something that a lot FTMs have to worry about so I think its reasonable for us to talk about it. For Frank, depending on his stage of transition, partners and circumstances may have to worry about it, so its a valid topic.
Quote from: KyleXX on August 30, 2012, 08:48:26 PM
I'm pro-choice but could and would never get an abortion if god-forbid something happened to me. But I also have no intention of giving birth myself, I'll leave that one for my future wife. My mom always tells me about this girl she went to high school with. She kept getting pregnant and having abortions, at least SIX of them if you can believe it. Then she grew up, got married, decided to have kids.. and gave birth to a child with down syndrome. That story sticks with me.
I doubt a doctor would do six abortions on a teenager. Not even the most liberal of people I have met would consider that reasonable and I know that most doctors who do abortions wouldn't consider that reasonable. Also, there is no connection between abortions and Down Syndrome. But even if there was an unlikely event that it was maybe connected it would be well documented. Also, people with Down Syndrome are still people, and some of the sweetest people I have ever met have had it. People who are born different are not inferior humans at all.
For the record, I'm pro-choice. I've had an abortion and I would do it over again. I know people who have had them and I know people who have chosen against having one. I think the right to choose is an important one and I frankly think every woman as the right to seek it out. If we make abortions illegal and then we are just going to have a rise in botched abortion deaths going up. If someone doesn't want to have the kid, they will find a way not to. Simple as that. It happened in a village in Alaska - they closed the planned parenthood, local doctor wouldn't do the abortion, so a rape victim died trying to give herself an abortion. In this day and age that is unreasonable.
Common arguments against it would be that they fetus has a soul or can feel. Scientifically it isn't true. It doesn't even start to resemble a developed human until it the last trimester. People argue that its murder, but I don't agree with that either - if it cannot live outside the human body then it cannot be given personhood or be considered a person. The last argument I have heard is people saying "Oh, but then teenagers will be getting abortions all the time!". So, in this case, teach them about safe sex. Take out abstinence only education because telling a bunch of teenagers with crazy emotions not to have sex is silly. Teach them the realities of sex and maybe teen pregnancy would go down. Saying someone would use abortion as a valid form of birth control could only come from the lips of someone who has never had one. They are painful. Incredibly so. So no, I don't see someone putting themselves through terrible pain to prevent having a kid. It sucks to bleed for three weeks and cramp so bad that you can't walk. Adults can barely handle the pain, I doubt a 15 year old would seek it out.
This isn't to say that there should be no regulations, but we certainly shouldn't make it illegal. From my perspective its like me saying that I don't agree with porn so it shouldn't exist. And we all know how well that would work out. *And before anyone throws up the "but porn doesn't harm human life" argument against me, I will say that actually, it certainly can depending on if the people in it were forced or not, and I don't consider a fetus a person. I consider it a potential human. Oh, and before I forget, people have been having abortions for the last 5,000 years on record. They did it in Ancient Egypt. It's also pretty ethnocentric considering in some cultures abortion isn't even an issue, so imposing a blanket western view on it doesn't work.
I'm pro-choice. All it means in the end is that I respect someone's right to choose. My father is anti-abortion and pro-choice because he realizes that it is not something he ever has to worry about and he has no right to tell someone they can't do it. Just as a note. Being pro-choice doesn't mean that you are pro-abortion. I think everyone would rather not wish a painful medical procedure on anyone.
I'll use my friend Sara's statement to sum up my opinion. "Its a bunch of right old white men trying to tell me what do to with my body. When they can get knocked up, they can talk about the issue seriously." So, I don't see the moral or ethical issues with abortions. Frankly, its just a way to further control the womb-having population, as far as I'm concerned.
