Transgender and Transsexual

[SaveMeJeebus]

I was just talking to a transgirl, and i mentioned to her she's located where this other transgirl is (a friend of mine), so i said she should consider getting in-touch with her. She replied back to me saying that she didn't want to know the other girl as, "she is active in sex so she is not ts girl, but tg. so i dont want to know she if i know that I cant understand she". I was quick to react  by saying that just because my friend is active doesn't mean she isn't transsexual. Which brings me onto my question. If a girl is active, does that rule out her being transsexual? My assumption was that it doesn't as if given the opportunity, they MIGHT use hormones and have surgery.

[spacial]

I was just talking to a transgirl, and i mentioned to her she's located where this other transgirl is (a friend of mine), so i said she should consider getting in-touch with her. She replied back to me saying that she didn't want to know the other girl as, "she is active in sex so she is not ts girl, but tg. so i dont want to know she if i know that I cant understand she". I was quick to react  by saying that just because my friend is active doesn't mean she isn't transsexual. Which brings me onto my question. If a girl is active, does that rule out her being transsexual? My assumption was that it doesn't as if given the opportunity, they MIGHT use hormones and have surgery.

My mind is spinning with the convolutions.

Someone is transgender when they say they are.

Someone is transsexual when they say they are.

I get the feeling the one doing the knock back here was taking a bit of a bad tempered swipe. But that happens with women sometimes and when men take it seriously it's so incredibly sweet.

[jilldavidson53]

And both transsexual and transgender people can be sexually active.

[SaveMeJeebus]

This is what i thought. Someones transgender or transsexual when they say they are, doesn't matter if they are 'active' in bed. This other girl kept saying that it's written in science texts or something, it was hard to understand her as she was Polish.

[Sammy]

Every person is different and so is the TG/TS community. I identify myself as transsexual, though I kinda dislike that term a bit, because of "sex" in it. At the same time, I am also transgender, because it is a broader notion and encompasses other variations. As for my preferences, I know that I am mostly interested in communication with transsexual MtF and intersex persons, because I can relate to them easier, whereas I find it more difficult to communicate with crossdressers, who identify themselves as males.

[blueconstancy]

That's really odd. Transsexuals are never supposed to have sex again? Is that ever, or only until after GRS, or what?! Of course, hormones/surgery don't make someone transsexual, either.

Attitudes like hers made my wife convinced she wasn't "really" transsexual and hurt her deeply (and caused a serious depression). She's doing actual harm with that nonsense.

[vegie271]

That's really odd. Transsexuals are never supposed to have sex again? Is that ever, or only until after GRS, or what?! Of course, hormones/surgery don't make someone transsexual, either.

Attitudes like hers made my wife convinced she wasn't "really" transsexual and hurt her deeply (and caused a serious depression). She's doing actual harm with that nonsense.

That is exactly what I was thinking! my comparison is don't cis gender womyn have sex, and aren't they active in bed, or do they have to be passive to be REAL womyn does it make the MEN if they are active or wear pants or are top or anything!

I am transexual because I say it, I transitioned, I am on HRT, even though I have not had SRS yet I am still transexual, even though I actually identify as womn in real life.

[blueconstancy]

vegie : Heh, excellent points! It's possible this person does have those sorts of old-fashioned views about cis men and women, too.

(And I admit that while I interpreted "active in sex" as "engages in sexual activities," based on the fact that hopefully this stranger didn't know the *details* of the other woman's bedroom habits, your interpretation as "does anything but lie there passively like a REAL woman" makes sense too. Ugh.)

[JoanneB]

A long long time ago my wife, who is transsexual and pre-op, and I had plenty of sex.

To paraphrase what others have said; WTF? Just because you identify as transsexual you aren't allowed to have sex? Or that you cannot be a "True" transsexual if you do have sex?

I thought some of the Harry Benjamine definitions were a bit off 

[vegie271]

vegie : Heh, excellent points! It's possible this person does have those sorts of old-fashioned views about cis men and women, too.

(And I admit that while I interpreted "active in sex" as "engages in sexual activities," based on the fact that hopefully this stranger didn't know the *details* of the other woman's bedroom habits, your interpretation as "does anything but lie there passively like a REAL woman" makes sense too. Ugh.)

I was was not certain if it meant "active in sex" OR "sexually active"

either way, it does not invalidate me, I can have another womn over my apartment and go down on her and still be a TS! (hope that is not too explicit)

or even if I had decided to have intercourse it still shouldn't invalidate me being TS (for those who decide for whatever reasons to be non-op!, or are currently pre-op and are active)

[Nero]

I guess the implication is that a 'real' transsexual is so disgusted by their genitals as to never use them until after surgery. But that's just not true. Sex is a biological drive that transsexuals aren't any more immune to than cis people.

[vegie271]

I guess the implication is that a 'real' transsexual is so disgusted by their genitals as to never use them until after surgery. But that's just not true. Sex is a biological drive that transsexuals aren't any more immune to than cis people.

Well actually there WAS a point where my dysphoria  was so severe that I could not stand to be touched or do anything. It was beyond description, I even mutilated myself.

It just took so many years of realization that I may never get SRS and either I have to kill myself or accept this to the point that I CAN be touched now.

[Nero]

I guess the implication is that a 'real' transsexual is so disgusted by their genitals as to never use them until after surgery. But that's just not true. Sex is a biological drive that transsexuals aren't any more immune to than cis people.

Well actually there WAS a point where my dysphoria  was so severe that I could not stand to be touched or do anything. It was beyond description, I even mutilated myself.

It just took so many years of realization that I may never get SRS and either I have to kill myself or accept this to the point that I CAN be touched now.

oh I didn't mean to imply that no transsexuals ever feel that way.

[spacial]

Well actually there WAS a point where my dysphoria  was so severe that I could not stand to be touched or do anything. It was beyond description, I even mutilated myself.

It just took so many years of realization that I may never get SRS and either I have to kill myself or accept this to the point that I CAN be touched now.




oh I didn't mean to imply that no transsexuals ever feel that way.

Of course not. Some do some don't.

The point it, it isn't about absolutes or certainties.

It's about exercising the basic human right to express ourselves.

[Padma]

This is why I just call myself (and others) trans now (or trans* when I'm writing). People are so eager to universalise their own experiences and definitions, it's better to keep things really general, or to use explanations in preference to labels - since labels get less useful, the more open they are to misinterpretation.