Warning Extreme Danger!

[Shantel]

Thanks Annah and Jen for the nice comments. Being the village HRT crash dummy wasn't fun, but glad I could share the awful experience of what not to do. I knew up front that I was pushing the envelope and taking a huge chance. Looks like I'm going to survive because I am quite fit, don't smoke, drink or chew or go with girls that do which worked in my favor. I have six months on this Warfarin and ongoing labs until I'm in the clear. Thanks again!

[spring0721]

Praying for a speedy recovery for you. And you are too bright & always offer great words of wisdom...we ALL make bad judgement calls at some point.  I'm glad they caught the clot in time....really hoping you'll be okay.

[Shantel]

Praying for a speedy recovery for you. And you are too bright & always offer great words of wisdom...we ALL make bad judgement calls at some point.  I'm glad they caught the clot in time....really hoping you'll be okay.

Thanks sweetie!

[hazel]

Just saw this thread and my heart sank so sorry to hear about what you're going through but thank you for posting it as a warning to the rest of us. It sounds like you've had good news with the latest update tho? Wishing you a speedy recovery!

[Albina]

 That is really a sad story I just learned. Of course, get better by all means, Auntie Shan. We need your company here.

I understand that DIY HRT is dangerous, but I 'd like to tell you guys, that in our country no endocrinologists know how to treat TS people - they just don't have this course in the medical colleges here. I myself started transition on my own, 8 months later I thought it is better to find a doctor. Our LGBT recommended me a friendly endo - a nice woman who even was on the TS conference in Vienna. She then confessed to me that fact that they need to go, say to Holland to learn about HRT. What she does now is just checking with me what medicine I will be taking and checks my blood and other tests. All knowledge about HRT I had to gain from the net.

[Rowan Rue]

Shan,
Just found this thread.  I'm so sorry to hear you've been going through this.  Glad there's a brighter outlook than at the start!
Hugs!

[Trisha]

Shan you are very brave to share this information with us and i thank you.
I hope you will heal quickly. My prayers are with you.

[Cindy]

That is really a sad story I just learned. Of course, get better by all means, Auntie Shan. We need your company here.

I understand that DIY HRT is dangerous, but I 'd like to tell you guys, that in our country (Kyrgyzstan) no endocrinologists know how to treat TS people - they just don't have this course in the medical colleges here. I myself started transition on my own, 8 months later I thought it is better to find a doctor. Our LGBT recommended me a friendly endo - a nice woman who even was on the TS conference in Vienna. She then confessed to me that fact that they need to go, say to Holland to learn about HRT. What she does now is just checking with me what medicine I will be taking and checks my blood and other tests. All knowledge about HRT I had to gain from the net.

A lot of the endo treatment for MtF is very similar to that for menopausal woman, with exception for androgen blockers. From a health point of view it is quite similar in risk - including blood problems and breast cancer. It may be worth while mentioning that.  to her

[Rita]

Someone told me they wanted to take hormones just to be a little girly(but not because he is),  I told him are you insane enough to risk your life?

Now I have this thread as ammunition to show just how dangerous things can be for us.  The kind of risks we all take.

[Shantel]

Someone told me they wanted to take hormones just to be a little girly(but not because he is),  I told him are you insane enough to risk your life?

Now I have this thread as ammunition to show just how dangerous things can be for us.  The kind of risks we all take.

Good for you Rita, I shared this in hopes of saving others from making the same willful errors I did. Take it slow and easy, obey the rules. We hear that patience is a virtue and that speed kills!

[Brooke777]

One of my friends has a friend who just ordered hormones through the mail. I have been using your story Shan to try and get this kid to not follow through with self medication. I don't know if it is sinking in as he is young and dumb. I would like to thank you again for posting your story. Hopefully I will be able to use it to save this kid.

[NotThereYet]

@Shantel

Speedy recovery and don't beat yourself up about it: we all make mistakes.

Thanks for sharing: very informative and helpful.

Love,
Andrea

[Shantel]

FYI - Rather than have to go through the whole sordid story over again with a new thread, I'll just do an update; I had read a previous post somewhere about the question of personality changes caused by HRT. Inasmuch as I'm now off female hormones for at least six months and possibly longer I'm already noticing that my Type-B laid back personality is beginning to dissipate and I'm unconsciously reverting back to my old Type-A chloric prickly personality. It's never nice to yell at people and say "What are you looking at a--hole?" when you suspect they have clocked you and are making snide remarks. Your prayers to your Higher Power or pet rock on my behalf will be most appreciated! 

[Randi]

I would like to point out the it was Ethinyl Estradiol (Premarin), that was the drug in this case.

As she mentioned the "current wisdom" is that this is bad.  The Women's Healh Initiative Study  http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/whi/  was discontinued due to problems with Premarin.

Many doctors still prescribe Premarin, but it's something to avoid.  Pure estradiol is cheap and much safer.

Much the same thing occurs with Progestins, pure micronized progesterone is better and safer.
Premarin and Provera are patented drugs and they are promoted to doctors by their makers.

Estradiol and Progesterone are natural substances.  They can't be patented and any licensed drug manufacturer can produce them.  Cheaper, more natural and safer.

More info on DVT hazards here: http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/whi/update_dvt1997.pdf

Randi

I ignored current wisdom about how dangerous Ethinyl Estrodiol is in terms of unwanted clotting and most especially for an older person, as it is never prescribed.

[Shantel]

I would like to point out the it was Ethinyl Estradiol (Premarin), that was the drug in this case.

Randi

FYI - Ethinyl Estradiol (ethyne, sodium and sodium amide) and Premarin (pregnant mare urine) are two different substances entirely.

[Cindy]

Provera is not a estrogen analogue, it is medoxyprogesterone acetate and from Shantel's original post I don't think she mentioned she was on it. Apologies to all if that is untrue.

In Shantel's cases with her medical history, taking Provera, or probably any progesterone,  in combination with estrogen of any sort would be a negative indication.

Shantel was wisely pointing out the dangers of self medicating on estrogen; the dangers of combination therapy without strict medical supervision, especially for us 'mature' ladies make those risks an awful lot higher.

[Shantel]

Provera is not a estrogen analogue, it is medoxyprogesterone acetate and from Shantel's original post I don't think she mentioned she was on it. Apologies to all if that is untrue.

In Shantel's cases with her medical history, taking Provera, or probably any progesterone,  in combination with estrogen of any sort would be a negative indication.

Shantel was wisely pointing out the dangers of self medicating on estrogen; the dangers of combination therapy without strict medical supervision, especially for us 'mature' ladies make those risks an awful lot higher.

I had been using EE for quite some time, a week before the clot appeared I had begun to cycle Provera into the mix. I actually believe that the clot was present before I made my decision to self medicate as a result of a knee replacement surgery a few years back, the EE and Provera simply exacerbated the problem exponentially and took something that had been relatively small in my lower leg and made it huge. It's analogous to how a log gets stuck in a river and over time debris builds up against it until an island has been created. That's fine for rivers but not so good in one's arteries and can lead to an untimely death.

[Numinum]

Might not mean much but I'm still crossing my fingers for you and I'm glad you've recovered some already; it must be a scary thing to go through!

[Shantel]

Might not mean much but I'm still crossing my fingers for you and I'm glad you've recovered some already; it must be a scary thing to go through!

Thanks, I appreciate everyone's thoughts and comments. I put it out here so more people can learn about what happens when you play "Dumb & Dumber" with hormones.

[bethany]

 Shantel, First let me say that I am praying that you fully recover from this.

And second thank you for having the courage to post what you are going through.
I hope that if someone is thinking of self medicating, that they read this first.

Hugs
Bethany