Disney movies

[Brooke777]

So FA, when are you going to come sweep me off my feet and rescue me?

[Shang]

Agreed. Beastly Beast is better than human beast.

He's yummy as the Beast.  As the Prince he's...eh...xD  I have a thing for cranky guys, though.   Well, in television. In real life give me a nice androgynous looking man. x3

[Kevin Peña]

Why do people say that they liked Beast as a beast? Unless his name is Beast, it goes without saying that his beast form was a beast. You should instead say that you preferred the Prince's appearance when he was transformed into a beast.

Ah, semantics. 

[Pica Pica]

I think Belle was strong and still feminine.

She certainly didn't need a man and turned down Gaston pretty easily because they didn't connect intellectually. She is curious and adventurous, longing for more. Physically she is not up to much, she is easily overcome by Gaston and imprisoned in her home, I don't remember her 'kicking ass'.

That said, she was strong enough to show love and respect to the Beast and his servants and to draw their kindness out from the heart of them. I'd say that is a more traditionally feminine kind of strength, and so tends to be undervalued.

[Edge]

Why do people say that they liked Beast as a beast? Unless his name is Beast

It's the only name I remember him being called.

I agree, Pica. She is also intelligent and imaginative.

[Shang]

Why do people say that they liked Beast as a beast? Unless his name is Beast, it goes without saying that his beast form was a beast. You should instead say that you preferred the Prince's appearance when he was transformed into a beast.

Ah, semantics. 

Because he was known as beast separately from being known as a prince.   It was like two entirely different characters instead of two parts of the same character.  So you have Beast and then Prince, in my mind.  Beast is the cranky, sexy guy and Prince is the weird looking guy. 

Belle was also a good character.  I liked how she read and pushed the gender norms of her era.  She was also very feminine and very very sweet, but nice and strong as well.  She had a good, strong will and knew what she wanted in life [and it didn't involve a guy though she did get a decent one].  But she was kind on the flip side and was very motherly (in my opinion).

[Nero]

I think it's because there's a prevalence of women who don't want the message to be that in order to be feminine you have to have a guy or that you have to be saved by a guy.  [It's why I hate Twilight -- I hate the idea that in order to be happy you have to have a guy (if you're a girl).  I dislike the idea that there's a "need" to have someone -- you should want to be with them and not need to be with them.]  Anyway...it's quite possible to be feminine while being strong.  [Leelu was a good character to show this and the same with the lead in The Princess Bride.  Both of them were feminine, but they were strong and didn't need a man to be happy -- something that has been pushed on throughout the movies of the 1900s.]

I'm all fine by characters being feminine and being happy wearing traditionally feminine clothes and being housewives, etc.  Just don't show me someone who needs a lover to be happy.

Oh that is a good distinction. Maybe we're on the same page after all. I also was thinking of someone like Buttercup from Princess Bride when I mentioned 'strong in a feminine way'. Love Bella though! 

That said, she was strong enough to show love and respect to the Beast and his servants and to draw their kindness out from the heart of them. I'd say that is a more traditionally feminine kind of strength, and so tends to be undervalued.

Yeah, that's more what I was talking about. I prefer this kind of femininity in a partner (male or female), so I'm kind of biased I guess. 

[Shang]

Oh that is a good distinction. Maybe we're on the same page after all. I also was thinking of someone like Buttercup from Princess Bride when I mentioned 'strong in a feminine way'. Love Bella though! 

Yeah, that's more what I was talking about. I prefer this kind of femininity in a partner (male or female), so I'm kind of biased I guess. 

I don't get how you can like Bella.   She was /so/ whiny.  I can't stand whiners like that, male or female.  It's fine to whine on occasion, but all of the time?...And she fell for an emotionally abusive twat.    No, don't fall for the guy that's always there and willing to help you no matter what.  Instead fall for the guy who's constantly leaving and the creeper who watched you while you slept.  [My other big thing is that she led the good guy (Jacob) on...ugh...]

But...Buttercup was decent. xD Though she fell for a dork. That was pretty cool.  XD

[Pica Pica]

How DARE you call Westley/The Man in Black/ Dread Pirate Roberts a dork!

[Shang]

How DARE you call Westley/The Man in Black/ Dread Pirate Roberts a dork!

He's a dork and he's a cute one at that.   I don't see anything wrong with being a dork or dorky. x3

[Nero]

So FA, when are you going to come sweep me off my feet and rescue me?

now that's what I'm talking about! 

The whiny part I never noticed. I just loved how gone she was over love, ready to give up everything and stuff.
Don't remember Edward being emotionally abusive (but it's been awhile since I read the books). How so?

I think Edward was kind of an ass because he did that whole "I'm going to protect you from yourself even if you don't want it" babying thing.  But Edward was a total Mary Sue character so of course he gets to talk down to people.  If I were Bella I would be pretty whiny too, at least for a while, being friends and the lover of vampires yet stuck in the mortal world listening to Jacob trying to pick me up all the time.

Sorry I can't stand Jacob

Mary Sue?

[Pica Pica]

I read the book of Princess Bride before I saw the film so my vision of Westley is not all that dorky. Flip him on his head and you could almost see him as some sort of conniving Steerpike figure.

[Brooke777]

I'm very big into women's rights. However, I think it would do our society some good to see that it is OK for a woman to be feminine and still strong. I personally want to be rescued (albeit by a woman and not a man). Most of my friends consider me to be a strong woman, and very feminine. Why can't we show our children that you can have it all. That you can be both feminine and strong at the same time?

[Kevin Peña]

On the matter of the feminine dichotomy presented by Disney, I must say that neither side is right.

Someone from the 1930's: "Get a job? Aren't you ashamed of yourself? You should be getting married and taking care of your kids."

Someone from today: "You like being a housewife? You should be doing something more rewarding like getting a job."

No difference^^^^

Both sides do the same thing, deny the reality that people are different and want different things. To some women, getting a job is more rewarding than raising kids. To others, raising children is the most rewarding thing in the world. If you want one or the other, it's okay either way. However, no one should tell you what you can and can't want.

[Pica Pica]

I'm very big into women's rights.

I'm sure you don't mean that exactly as it sounds.

[Brooke777]

I'm sure you don't mean that exactly as it sounds.

Depends, how does it sound to you?

[Pica Pica]

Well, there are two kinds of rights.

The kind that are the few essential things that every human being needs to live a fulfilled life.

Or there's the nebulous things that people whine the need of, like a small child crying 'it's not fair'.

- I assume you agree women deserve the first lot.

[Kevin Peña]

I LOVE Snow White's dress.

[Brooke777]

Well, there are two kinds of rights.

The kind that are the few essential things that every human being needs to live a fulfilled life.

Or there's the nebulous things that people whine the need of, like a small child crying 'it's not fair'.

- I assume you agree women deserve the first lot.

Yes, the first. I believe fully in equal rights for all. I don't care what your gender, sexual orientation, race, age, religion, anything. We all deserve to be treated the same.

[Pica Pica]

Of course you do, you're sane.