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Beliefs…Can Bring Comfort Or Despair .

Started by Anatta, May 24, 2013, 04:53:18 PM

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Jess42

Quote from: vegie271 on June 07, 2013, 11:09:34 AM



I am sorry I can't beleive in some all powerful all knowing being who can run around doing things and make this wonderful universe, but leave it so messed up as it is. Why are things in such a state?

Asimov gave a much better theory

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Question

better than all of the delirious ramblings of prophets throughout  history



I can't either vegie271. That is why my beliefs are outside of the realm of most if not all common belief systems. If you hit the links that Kuan Yin put up about Michio Kaku and look through about some of his views about God and then look at some of the views of Albert Einstien about God, it makes a lot of sense. Regardless though when Theoretical Physicist start throwing around the ideas of there actually being a Creator, it's something we should all be listening to. My views of God would have gotten me labeled an heretic 500 years ago because I don't believe in an intervening God that micromanages every little thing in our lives. But... there seems to be an order to the chaos of the Universe or else there would be no life in the Universe. Life on earth is a delicate thing. If the sun was a little hotter or a little colder, life on this planet would be limited to simple life forms or no life at all. It is balanced enough to allow for liquid water to exist and life to evolve to tremendous levels, ourselves being one of the life forms. How many other planets are habitable and contain liquid water for higher forms of life to evolve out of billions of solar systems in this galaxy alone? Not to mention possibly billions of galaxies in the Universe which could in turn contain billions of stars.

Wherever I look, it seems that there is indeed intellegent design. Why would an all knowing God leave it a mess? It's a trap when we personalize our Creator which is not even a human. It's not God's fault, it's our own.  We have Freewill and are free to make our own choices, good or bad, without intervention from the One that created us. This means that everything that is messed up falls on our heads, not God's. People have caused all of the geopolitical problems, environmental through damaging the planet not just with oil but also with developement, prejudice, crime and so on. These are not Devine actions by no means but personally we can use Devine reactions when we face these problems. And besides, our Spirits were what were Created, our bodies are just the same matter that this planet is made up of. Our Spirits were created in the same image of the Creator, what would be of most concern to God?

Everyone has a right to believe what they want or need to believe. I never call anyone wrong in their belief systems, even Athiest because I don't believe there are wrong beliefs. If a person don't have a need for a belief in a Creator, then there will be no belief. If someone needs a belief in a Strict, all knowing micromanaging God, then that is what the person will be drawn to. There are many levels in between.

It's not just prophets. The majority people believe in an existance after the physical incarnation. This existence is highly debateable in the specifics. I tend to believe in reincarnation because as complicated as being a human with human emotions is, I just don't think man can be prefected enough in 70 someodd years to have learned all life's important and complicated lessons. Others do. With the majority of the human race believing in an "afterlife", I just think it happens to be a subconscious or superconscious feeling that there is more. Remember that we can only see certain colors in the spectrum. From red to red or violet. The highest vibration that we can see with our eyes to the lowest. We know there is a lower vibrational level below red because through technology we can percieve it and it is infrared. We also know there is a vibrational level above violet and it is ultra violet. We can't see infrared or ultraviolet because both are out of the sectrulm of visable colors but they are there all the same. How many more colors are there that we can't see even through technology? Could we be missing whole worlds existing in unison with ours that we can't see or hear just because they are hgher or lower in vibrational levels than what our five senses can percieve? Same way with sound. We can only percieve between one vibrational level and another, yet dogs can hear sounds on either side or our range of hearing.

I really suggest that people that have never heard him talking to click on the links that Kuan Yin provided yesterday on Michio Kaku. He even mentions vibrational levels, which I talked about earlier in this post, and the multiverse theory. The man is brilliant when it comes to Theoretical Physics. If you think about it, wouldn't it be ironic if a scientist discovers the existance of a Creator? Spirituality for me is not about religion, heaven and or hell, looking good to my peers by sitting in church every Sunday but rather helping, loving, having compassion toward and respecting my fellow human beings and looking for a rhyme and reason for things that happen.

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Arch

Quote from: Kuan Yin on June 06, 2013, 12:27:55 AM
I'm happy to hear your personal beliefs bring you some form of contentment...

Contentment, no. That, for me, would be a sign that something was horribly wrong and that I'd sold my intellect and integrity for Lethean ignorance.
"The hammer is my penis." --Captain Hammer

"When all you have is a hammer . . ." --Anonymous carpenter
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Anatta

Quote from: Arch on June 07, 2013, 03:15:24 PM
Contentment, no. That, for me, would be a sign that something was horribly wrong and that I'd sold my intellect and integrity for Lethean ignorance.

Kia Ora Arch,

Fair enough...

Whatever floats ones boat and helps it to stay afloat through the often turbulent waters of the ocean of life...

Metta Zenda :)
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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vegie271

Quote from: Jess42 on June 07, 2013, 02:49:30 PM

I really suggest that people that have never heard him talking to click on the links that Kuan Yin provided yesterday on Michio Kaku. He even mentions vibrational levels, which I talked about earlier in this post, and the multiverse theory. The man is brilliant when it comes to Theoretical Physics. If you think about it, wouldn't it be ironic if a scientist discovers the existance of a Creator? Spirituality for me is not about religion, heaven and or hell, looking good to my peers by sitting in church every Sunday but rather helping, loving, having compassion toward and respecting my fellow human beings and looking for a rhyme and reason for things that happen.


I understand and yes I did go into and look at the links, I did read, I am listening, I don't just skim and spout. yes sometimes I am a loudmouth sorry I am somewhat emotional. I have been hurt by fundamentalists, that can cause problems.

but I have actually looked into some of the different things people have talked about and I still  just personally have a "physical, real, grounded, description" for my sense of reality.

from where I come from no spirit, I don't want to live again, I want no heaven, no hell, just get me out of here with as little damage as I can accomplish for the rest of my life.

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Anatta

Kia Ora Jess, (and others)

!

It's possible Einstein originally used the term "God" as a metaphor for the laws of physics. Physicists (such as Michio Kaku) continue to use the metaphor in memory/honour of Einstein.

However............a more sticky subject to ponder.....................

What 'is' consciousness ? If it is just 'awareness' then who or what becomes aware ?

So here's a simple question for atheists, agnostics, gnostics and theists to ponder(in other words all who believe in something...or no-thing) and one to stimulate the 'Zen' master locked within the confines of the 'self'...

"One hour and then another.
Inexorably march, step by step.
Whenever I meet you, we each smile.
But who is it who drags your corpse around ?"


Chan Master Hsu Yun (Empty Cloud)


Take a minute, an hour, a day-week-year, a lifetime to ponder Chan (Zen) Master Hsu Yun's question...And if you 'think' you 'know' the answer...well.......... then you know.....................

Metta Zenda :)
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Anatta

Quote from: vegie271 on June 07, 2013, 06:14:40 PM


but I have actually looked into some of the different things people have talked about and I still  just personally have a "physical, real, grounded, description" for my sense of reality.




Kia Ora Vegie,

::) So who experiences this so called reality ? Who or what gives you this sense of experiencing reality ?  :icon_yikes:

Just some food for thought...

Metta Zenda :)
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Kia

QuoteBut... there seems to be an order to the chaos of the Universe or else there would be no life in the Universe. Life on earth is a delicate thing. If the sun was a little hotter or a little colder, life on this planet would be limited to simple life forms or no life at all. It is balanced enough to allow for liquid water to exist and life to evolve to tremendous levels, ourselves being one of the life forms. How many other planets are habitable and contain liquid water for higher forms of life to evolve out of billions of solar systems in this galaxy alone? Not to mention possibly billions of galaxies in the Universe which could in turn contain billions of stars.


If you look for patterns they tend to appear.

The amount of the known universe is soooo super tiny compared to the total universe and since Earth is the only planet of its kind it seems rare. It's probable that life is actually quite prevalent and may take forms completely alien to the standard Earth lifeforms. But from what we can perceive experience existence looks to be some kind of fine tuned instrument; I would venture to say that chaos is the natural state of everything. The order is merely our perception of it. God, Ultimate Reality, or whatever you call it for me is that great big thing beyond our perceptions and even the perception of chaos as a whole. It's something that language fails to capture and I am assured that it's alive, maybe not thinking as we think but definitely living. It's this all encapsulating thing beyond physics, philosophy, religion, and all human understanding. We are just little itty bitty mirrors of it.

that's just my own wacky-daisical thinking, btw and kind of off topic has anyone read Michio Kaku's Physics of the Impossible in which he explains how all the cool scifi technology will work in the future.
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Jess42

Here's my take of it and I warn, is really out there. During medetation I don't even try to clear my mind anymore. I just let my mind wander until it finds something to fully concentrate on. One of these things is the possiblity of non existance. For me it is impossible to grasp the concept of non existance. That when we physically die that we just cease to exist on all levels. How would we know we were ever alive? What was life for anyway and are we just random forms of consciousness, intellegence and energy that pops into existance when we are born or concieved and then pops out of existance when the body dies? Is non existance possible? Yes it is as great a possiblity as intellegent design to the universe is.

Vegie271. I am not a fundamentalist. Probably the farthest thing from it. I believe there was a Christ but I also believe there was The First Buddah and many more and more yet to come. Like I've said before and will always say, even on my deathbed, is that religions should be built upon one another for a much bigger picture and better tools in order to achieve different levels of enlightenment. When it comes to the texts, I read them with a skepticle mind open to the possiblities that the stories are nothing but mere myths. I also try to put myself in the mindset of the people of the time that did write the stories. What the technology and superstitions were at the time. I also look into historical data of those times and then try to weed out the sensationalism and factors of awe. I am sorry that you have been hurt by fundamentalist, but we all have at one time or another. I get told things all the time like I don't believe in Christ and that I will burn in hell even though I do. When I mention that we shouldn't be worshipping as much as modeling our own lives after Christ, well you can just imagine how well that goes. There are a lot of other things that I say that would have gotten me burned at the stake 500yrs ago but fortunately today only gets me verbally downgraded. I won't change my views, no matter how dynamic they are, for anyone though and really don't care what others think of me. In the beginning all religions are Devine in nature but when the original teacher is gone, man takes over and we all know what is in the hearts of man. I am shunned by fundamentalists and atheists alike and equally. Both side scream at me with insults and judgmental words, but I don't let it bother me and what a person does shouldn't affect me with the same judgementalism and hatred that they have shown against me. I am the only one that has the power to allow myself to feel bitter, resentful, hateful and judgemental and I choose not to feel that way. Look at me. With all the the negativity I have experience from both side of the fence, I cannot and am not willing to judge anyone according to their beliefs, race, nationality, sexual orientation or what they think of me. I will say though that a belief in something positive and higher than yourself will allow a person to experience the positive emotions. No matter if the higher 'something" happens to be your own higher self or a statue that eminates nothing but good or a cow that you believes poops golden patties. As long as you percieve that the "something" is positive, you should experience more positivity in your own actions and thoughts. Negative emotions will eat you up physicall, emotionally and psychologically and nothing good will come of having these negativities.

This is way out there but it almost seems like the whole Universe is a time keeping piece. It seems to me not much different that the inner workings of the old watches where all the pieces are moving at different speeds. Revolutions of heavenly bodies revolving around a central point for example or solarsystem. Bigger systems rotating around a bigger central point, example or solar system in the Sagitarius arm of the milky way revolving around the center of the galaxy. The Mayans measuring 26000 year cycles accurately makes me wonder what other knowledge mankind has lost thoughout time.

Kia, looking for patterns and cycles. Yes random by luck of the draw patterns happen. But there is a pattern to human Spirituality too. Religious symbolism changes according to what astronomical age we are in. A lot of people I don't think can comprehend this cycle or pattern, if so I haven't run into them yet. The ages are roughly 2600 years. The transition is slow and we are now at this time and have been since the 1960's transitioning out of the Age of Pices and into the Age of Aqurius. In other words we are transitioning from the teachings of Christ to the next teacher that will come about. Ever really wonder why a lot of cars have the symbol of the fish representing Christ? It's because of the Age of Pices. A lot of the stories and mythes surrounding Christ has a lot to do with fish. I believe this is more than just a coincidence because the symbolisms of Moses and Abraham match the particular symbol of the age we were in at the time. Remember these ages are astronomical in the sun's elliptical path crossing through the constellation due to the earth's tilt of the axis, It is not astrological. Ever wonder what the Sphinx is? The weathering on the Sphynx matches that of the environment in that area at least 10,000 years ago. 26,000 divided by 2 is 13,000 and halfway between the Age of Aquarius back to the Age of Aquarius is the Age of Leo and I would be willing to bet that the Sphynx pays homage to The Age of Leo.

Kuan Yin. The question for eons has been who or what is God. That is the big unanswerable question. Even people who go through past life regression in a clinical setting can't answer it. This is what gives me some hope that reincarnation is an actual dynamic of human Spirituality. If these recollections from the subconscious or superconscious were just mere fantasies then the mind we would have fantasies of what God is. The one common equation to the question is that God is Love, just like what is written in the Bible and a prevailent message contained in Devine belief systems. One thing I find extrememly interesting and kind of surprising is that subjects under hypnosis liken us as being on a train. God or whatever you call It is the engine and we are on the last car as it's moving down the tracks. They state that we will evolve to the same point when God created us but it's probably impossible for us to ever be at the same level as God Since we are all evolving. They also have stated that God is niether male or female but one in the same, which I am sure others have heard me write on this forum before. Another interesting aspect is that everything is created to evolve. So, according to past life regressions God is above all of our understanding but we can understand the aspect of Pure Love and we will probalby never be on the same level as our Creator but achieve the same levels God has achieved. This leads me to my next question, "If God created us, who created God?" If God is an entity that is evolving according to past life regressions, then it makes sense that there would have to be a beginning with God just like with us. I know, we don't even know or comprehend our own Creator and here I am pondering upon the Creator's Creator. It's just one of the many places my mind goes when I meditate. I really surprise myself that I ain't in a rubber room wearing a straight jacket sometimes. I have to add that there is no specific prevailant religion among the people that experience past life regressions, they are varied throughout the Spiritual Spectrum. Some expetience a sense of Heaven and others Experience Hell. Some experience nothing but others they were close to that have died while other's experience a rejoicing. All for these experiences only last for a short while until the old physical human mindsets are shed and then it is all the same type of experience with slight variations according to life actions.

As for human consciousness though, there are different levels. Where or what they morph into after we are physically dead is a mystery. I do believe they exist outside of the physical body. One reason is because of paranormal activity to where there is no possible explaination for. I study paranormal activity so I know a little about it. Haunting come into two main categories, intellegent and residual. Residual would be like information stored in mineral deposit like limestone and quartz Limestone mixed with running water is a powerful recipe for residual activity and quarts, well it don't need anything. When atmospheric conditions are right, residual activity will occur and is usuall like a recording that will play over and over until those conditions change. More or less like playing a DVD or CD and hitting the button to pause or stop and then hitting play again later. There is nothing that is a willful intellegence controlling it. Itellegent activity is a tough one. When you can ask questions and recieve reactions from something that by all sane thought should not be there is mind opening. A lot of people metally can't handle it and why there is so much negativity surrounding paranormal activity. Also the reason why hollywood make billions from Ghost Stories. We all safely want to experience fear but when the safety is gone and the activity is occring or around you physically, it can be a traumatic event. When you record a disembodied voice in a voice recorder specific to a question you asked especially when it comes to names dates and such and you can back this information up through research, well there is something to it. I have to say though that all of the years I have done this, I have never had a really negative experience. I have however run into mischevious entities, resentful entities, bitter entities and so on. I have also run into happy, humorous and joking entities. I am 100% skeptical and around 96% of what I investigate I can debunk throug natural, mechanical or missunderstood causes but there is that 4% unexplainable with no normal causes.

How many layers of consciousness do we have? For sure without a doubt two; the conscious and the subconscious. Some psychologist believe in a third which is called the superconcsious. I am willing to bet there are many more that we can't experience knowingly. I have read and heard that there are at least 7 which is a powerfully significant number. Whether or not there are 7 I really don't know. Look how hard it is to experience the subconscious consciously. We can through hypnosis and while we are dreaming but tapping into the subconscious and understanding it knowingly is almost impossible. I believe that our consciousness in intellegent energy and since energy can't be destroyed it will continue to exist separate from the human body after a physical death. Where it goes and or what it transforms into is a question of Faith and is answerable only with uncomprehensible knowledge or a physical death.

Anyway, here's some more lunatic thoughts from a madwoman. ;D
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Anatta

Kia Ora Jess,

:icon_yikes: Wow ! Now that's some interesting theory you had tucked away...new agey but interesting all the same...

The mind is truly amazing... a source of wonder and for the most part it's an untapped source...

It's the root of 'all' things-peace-turmoil-love-hate-anger-joy-happiness-sadness...Yet one tends to look 'outside' at the 'illusion' for the means to appease/to be freed from their aversions (or desires) ...

"If you know your 'self' you'll know all there is to know!"


The ancient Chinese seemed to have had it all sown up 'way' back when....

Quote from a BBC article which summarises "The Tao" in easy to understand terms...(easy that is, if one lets the mind find its own 'way' )

The Tao is not a thing or a substance in the conventional sense.

"It cannot be perceived but it can be observed in the things of the world. Although it gives rise to all being, it does not itself have being.

Although it's conventional to refer to The Tao, some writers think that the "the" should be dropped because it isn't in the original Chinese term.

They feel that using 'the' gives Westerners the idea that the Tao is a metaphysical reality, by which they mean a thing (in the widest sense) or an absolute being like a god.

But even the name Tao can lead Westerners to think of Tao in the same way that they think of objects.

That sort of thinking is misleading: Thinking of the Tao as some sort of object produces an understanding of the Tao that is less than the reality.

It might be more helpful to regard Tao as a system of guidance. And if one does this one can translate 'achieving union with the Tao' into 'developing oneself so as to live in complete conformity with the teachings of the Tao' which is easier to understand, and closer to the truth.

Glimpsed only through its effects

A good way of avoiding the Tao-as-object error is to see the various concepts of the Tao as doing no more than describing those effects of the Tao that human beings are aware of. They do not describe its reality.

The Tao is not God

The Tao is not God and is not worshipped. Taoism does include many deities, but although these are worshipped in Taoist temples,(by those who see Taoism as a 'religion') they are part of the universe and depend, like everything, on the Tao.

The 'Tao' includes several concepts in one word:

•   the source of creation
•   the ultimate
•   the inexpressible and indefinable
•   the unnameable
•   the natural universe as a whole
•   the way of nature as a whole


BTW Jess, if you remove the person behind the title "The Buddha" what are you left with ?....
= An A _ _ _ _ _ _ D Mind

Metta Zenda :)
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Anatta

Quote from: Kia on June 07, 2013, 06:44:17 PM

If you look for patterns they tend to appear.


that's just my own wacky-daisical thinking, btw and kind of off topic has anyone read Michio Kaku's Physics of the Impossible in which he explains how all the cool scifi technology will work in the future.

Kia Ora Kia,

I haven't listened to it yet, but I found this radio interview where he talks about his book:

Michio Kaku "Physics of the Impossible"



BTW It would seem the brain is 'programmed' to seek out patterns...

Metta Zenda :)
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Anatta

Kia Ora Jess,

On the topic of consciousness...There are many ways/possibilities to understand it, for example...

::) The theory to blow the mind wide open...(With or without the use of psychedelic drugs)  :icon_yikes: ;) ;D

Starting with the subconscious which for the most part is the level of 'knowing' the physiological need of the body...It regulates our breathing(we breathe whether we are conscious of it or not)...It's aware of all what's going on in the body and mind and what our senses pick up from the external world-

Our 'normal' consciousness (when we are awake in the mundane sense) gives us the ability to interact with the outer physical world, along with being aware of our feelings (The ones the subconscious allows/filters through to our awaken state)

And the ultimate-consciousness is what lies behind the gateless gate that sits between the two...

An example of this is the 'present moment' (what we call the 'now') ....When one meditates and is focused upon ones breath-the subconscious and the conscious merge together creating an opening in the gateless gate ...

How wide this gate will open depends on the amount of "I/self" that is trying to look/peek through...It stays firmly closed if the I/self tries to force it open...However if the clinging grasping self/I has been disposed of, it opens wide to the ultimate consciousness/reality...

"What lies behind the gateless gate ?
The I/self is eager to see, it just can't wait-
But alas it must bid its time-
And meditate upon this thread & rhyme!"


So there you have it-in a nutshell the theory of everything and nothing...Something no doubt you already knew but what the heck... ;)

Remember none of this is gospel, it's just from my personal 'warped' experiences....

Metta Zenda :) 
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Anatta

Kia Ora,

Well now to re-thread the de-threaded thread (The eye is wide enough to allow de-threading and re-threading to take place with ease)

In a sense my personal beliefs about the world tend to bring both despair and comfort:

Despair in that everyday I see all the unnecessary suffering people constantly put them'selves' through-

But I'm comforted to know that they too have a way out of this cycle of suffering-

Through personal 'insight/experience' ( insight meditation) the  "scales" of Comfort and Despair are changing (Self adjusting)...bringing with this change an ever-present balance of 'contentment'...

Sadly at times it would seem people can't even be true to themselves...They don't know how to overcome personal suffering so they pretend to 'enjoy' it ...(If you can't beat it join it)

Matthieu Ricard (French Buddhist Monk) sums this up quite neatly in

"The Habits Of Happiness!" TEDTALK

"Some intellectuals say 'We don't care about being happy or contented, we need to live with passion-We like the ups and downs of life-We like suffering because...... it's so good when it ceases for a while !"

::) A touch of involuntary 'Sadomasochism' perhaps......Fortunately no-thing is permanent... 

Metta Zenda :)
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Jess42

Ugghhhh Kwuan Yin, I have always dislike the lable of "new age". I have always though that the way of thinking that I have is more old perceptions with a modern twist. ;) Take quartz crystals as an example. For ages these mystics lumps of heat and pressure tempered carbon were looked at with awe and admiration and some cultures have even used them for healing. Today we now that infinate amounts of data can be stored in minute amounts of quarts. If they can store data, what else might they do? A lot of books were written on the subject of past life regressions in the 90's and it was actually discovered in the 50's by mistake under hypnosis and was used as a cure for psychosematic illnesses but in a sort of hush hush capacity. Plenty of ancient religions saw reincarnation as a Spititual dynamic. If you look into it though, reincarnation was a dynamic of Spirituality in Christ's day, In the Gnostic Books and in the Bible. It just happened to disappear in the 6th century A.D. due to Emporess Theodora having a "god complex" and couldn't bear all of us "peasants" believing she would be punished for her trespasses to the common people. So, the dynamics of Karma and reincarnation disappeared. Remember, the Roman Empire pretty much ruled the whole world at that time. I pretty much assume that it was fairly easy to dupe and fool ancient man much like it is for modern man. For an example look to your politicians, from all sides, and religious leaders and you can see it's still happening.

So with that said, most of what I think, believe, study and so on comes from much older thought processes and belief systems but fit in my modern mind and perceptions. It just seems more natural and possible. Much like the myth of the Mayan Calender. In 1987 when I first heard about it, I started looking into it and learned what it really was and that is the end of one great age, 26,000 year cycle and the biginning of another 26,000 year cycle. I knew that we all weren't all gonna die, an asteroid slam into the earth or the sun was gonna explode, but that it has happened before and will happen again until the sun burns out.

Thanks for the new link.
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vegie271

Quote from: Jess42 on June 09, 2013, 12:27:04 PM
Ugghhhh Kwuan Yin, I have always dislike the lable of "new age"....... So, the dynamics of Karma and reincarnation disappeared. Remember, the Roman Empire pretty much ruled the whole world at that time. I pretty much assume that it was fairly easy to dupe and fool ancient man much like it is for modern man. For an example look to your politicians, from all sides, and religious leaders and you can see it's still happening.




Ouch! Pretty EuroCentric attitude. China (where the largest city in the world was) was actually doing great in the 6th century AD, The Mayan civilization was flourishing, need I go on?

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Arch

But there's a lot of ruins in Mesopotamia!
"The hammer is my penis." --Captain Hammer

"When all you have is a hammer . . ." --Anonymous carpenter
  •  

Anatta

Quote from: Jess42 on June 09, 2013, 12:27:04 PM
Ugghhhh Kwuan Yin, I have always dislike the lable of "new age". I have always though that the way of thinking that I have is more old perceptions with a modern twist. ;) Take quartz crystals as an example. For ages these mystics lumps of heat and pressure tempered carbon were looked at with awe and admiration and some cultures have even used them for healing. Today we now that infinate amounts of data can be stored in minute amounts of quarts. If they can store data, what else might they do? A lot of books were written on the subject of past life regressions in the 90's and it was actually discovered in the 50's by mistake under hypnosis and was used as a cure for psychosematic illnesses but in a sort of hush hush capacity. Plenty of ancient religions saw reincarnation as a Spititual dynamic. If you look into it though, reincarnation was a dynamic of Spirituality in Christ's day, In the Gnostic Books and in the Bible. It just happened to disappear in the 6th century A.D. due to Emporess Theodora having a "god complex" and couldn't bear all of us "peasants" believing she would be punished for her trespasses to the common people. So, the dynamics of Karma and reincarnation disappeared. Remember, the Roman Empire pretty much ruled the whole world at that time. I pretty much assume that it was fairly easy to dupe and fool ancient man much like it is for modern man. For an example look to your politicians, from all sides, and religious leaders and you can see it's still happening.

So with that said, most of what I think, believe, study and so on comes from much older thought processes and belief systems but fit in my modern mind and perceptions. It just seems more natural and possible. Much like the myth of the Mayan Calender. In 1987 when I first heard about it, I started looking into it and learned what it really was and that is the end of one great age, 26,000 year cycle and the biginning of another 26,000 year cycle. I knew that we all weren't all gonna die, an asteroid slam into the earth or the sun was gonna explode, but that it has happened before and will happen again until the sun burns out.

Thanks for the new link.

Kia Ora Jess,

My apologies regarding the "New Age" label...

::) However if you start to get a big following(people who find your thoughts on this matter 'enlightened' and start to 'pay' for this privilege) then the new age label sticks....(Only joking  ;) ;D )

You're welcome, I found the radio interview quite interesting...

And yes I had read somewhere that the head of the 'church had a meeting and decided to 'drop' the idea of reincarnation from it's books...

Metta Zenda :)
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Anatta

Kia Ora Jess,

You might also find this guy interesting...Re: Quantum Time: The Illusion of Past, Present and Future ft. Anthony Peake



Metta Zenda
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Jess42

Quote from: Kuan Yin on June 09, 2013, 06:13:31 PM
Kia Ora Jess,

My apologies regarding the "New Age" label...

::) However if you start to get a big following(people who find your thoughts on this matter 'enlightened' and start to 'pay' for this privilege) then the new age label sticks....(Only joking  ;) ;D )

You're welcome, I found the radio interview quite interesting...

And yes I had read somewhere that the head of the 'church had a meeting and decided to 'drop' the idea of reincarnation from it's books...

Metta Zenda :)

Apology accepted on the new age label Kuan Yin. The term 'New Age' puts images of the Hippy movement in my mind and flowers make me sneeze. I am also more of a leather and lace type of girl than I am of the hemp clothing not to mention I hate hate hate hate going "au natural" with the body hair.;)

Don't worry about me and profit gains because somehow money seems to run away from me. I've done many paranormal investigations and have never charged a dime. Over 30 some odd years I have probably put out over 20,000 if not more dollars for equipment and software in order to do it. Technology becomes outdated in the blink of an eye and once you purchase something and use it for a year, something better comes along. Thank God thermal imaging equipment doesn't change like video recorders. Also don't worry about me having a following because most people think I need to be fitted for a straightjacket anyway. I love embracing insanity, it's so much more interesting than normalcy. 

I'm sure you're not going to be suprized but I find anything dealing with theories of time interesting.

Yes, the brain is programmed to seek out patterns but it really doesn't delegitimize the patterns or synchronisities though. It may be that we, unlike other animals, pecieve these patterns quicker and naturally due to our more advanced brains. In the paranormal world there is what is called matrixing. Matrixing is responsible for faces and or aparitions in windows, on mirrors or even with shadows and can be on pictures, video or seen with our own eyes. Usually with the eyes, the apparition will be there in one moment and then gone in another. Matrixing is responsible for a lot of pictures and video that is out in internetland. This happens because our brains are hardwired to recognize our own species and sometimes random shapes, patterns, shadows and so on fool the brain into seeing someone who is not there. A really good example of matrixing is the 3D picture amid a picture of random colors and shapes. You have to look past the 2D flat "noise" and unfocus your eyes and then you would see the 3D picture. I have chunked a lot of supposed evidence I have captured just because of the matrixing effect. I have to be 98% sure that the evidence I capture is possibly paranormal before I use it. There are no 100%s in paranormal investigation or parapsychology because there is always a 2% chance that it is a natural occurance that nobody knows about.
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Jess42

Quote from: vegie271 on June 09, 2013, 01:48:57 PM



Ouch! Pretty EuroCentric attitude. China (where the largest city in the world was) was actually doing great in the 6th century AD, The Mayan civilization was flourishing, need I go on?



Wow. Did I do or say something to offend you vegie271. If I did I apologize. If you have the need to be mean toward someone that is Spiritual, go ahead because we do need to drain the anger sometimes. If you are lumping everyone that is Spiritual together with the same that hurt you at one time or another, that isn't right. In that case you need to confront the ones that caused you the pain. It's OK though, I can be a verbal punching bag to anyone as long as they feel better afterwards.

People are all different and you can't hold a person responsible for something someone else did. If you are an atheist, that is fine. You will never see any judgement from me but make sure you don't exhibit the same negative emotions and actions toward others that others have shown toward you. Leaving the Spiritual aspect out of the equation and using plain old psychology. If someone treats you with contempt, what good is it for you to treat others with contemp. If someone shows you hate, discriminates against you, degrades you and so on, why treat another person the same way? We really shouldn't because we should treat everyone the way we want to be treated.

Please don't take this the wrong way but with all the far fetched, way out there, lunatic, way beyong the outer limit things that I posted on this thread, why attack my belief in a Creator and me writing that the Roman Empire ruled the world at the time? I'll be the first one to admit that some of the stuff I wrote sounds 100% insane. Anyway, like I said in an earlier post. I am sorry you were hurt on any level by "fundementalists" but not all Spiritualists are at fault. I myself have been trashed, thrashed, verbally abused, shunned and just about anything else by people across many spectrums, even Atheists. The truth is that it happens, the solution is not to let it effect you mentally. I have had one really bad thing happen but will not go into it here but I hold that one particular person alone responsible and no one else. One thing that I know for certain and without a doubt is that negativity breeds more negativity.


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peky

Quote from: Kuan Yin on June 07, 2013, 02:39:16 AM
Kia Ora Peky,

I don't know much about Judaism, (or Kabbalah the 'mystical' part of Judaism that you follow) so I did a bit of digging and found this on "Sheol" ...(Which sounds an awful lot like the Catholic purgatory) 

"Sheol in the OT, comparable to contemporary Greek Hades or the Babylonian underworlds, was a place where dead human beings were sent, to maintain their being in a diminished state. It was a place inferior to natural human life, but not one of punishment, per se. Virtue and sin did not enter into it; based on the OT, everybody went to Sheol."

"Hebrew word of uncertain etymology (see Sheol, Critical View), synonym of "bor" (pit), "abaddon" and "shaḥat" (pit or destruction), and perhaps also of "tehom" (abyss)."

http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/13563-sheol


Metta Zenda :)

Dear "Kia Ora,"

This link gives a more realitc view

http://www.myjewishlearning.com/beliefs/Theology/Afterlife_and_Messiah/Life_After_Death/Heaven_and_Hell.shtml?p=1
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