Should one ever tell ?

[Laura Eva B]

Just a couple of weeks ago, a Thursday – I was off work and feeling down so I had a few wines at home with lunch and walked into town to cheer myself up with some shopping.

Feeling hungry I popped into my favourite "posh" Italian restaurant and ordered my favourite seafood linguine and a couple of glasses of pinot grigio ... when it came to paying the bill their credit card machine was "playing up" and it took 15 minutes of repeated tries to get things to work ... I asked for a complimentary drink on account of the trouble and to my surprise it was delivered without quibble (really nice male waiter of course !).

Feeling well tipsy, and at 10 in the evening I did something no woman, let alone TS woman should ever do, I wandered into "Bar Med" on my own and odrered a wine ....

No sooner than I'd picked up my drink and started looking for somwhere to sit this really attractive mixed race guy (at least 12 years younger than me) came over an invited me to join him, his younger brother, and younger brother's white girlfriend.  I accepted and made up a foursome, two guys, two girls ....

I was bought a couple more drinks as the evening and the chat went on, and felt that both the guys were really hitting on me ... the younger guy's girlfriend was pretty quiet and passive in all this and I had the feeling that she'd "read" me. 

When both guys disappeared (to toilet and to buy more drinks), my judgement impaired, I made the big mistake ....

I revealed that I was TS to the girl.  She said "she knew" (but did she ?) and said "but the guys don't have a clue".  She asked a bit about whether I was post-op and things.

Finishing my drink and after more chat with the guys I went off to the toilets – there'd been discussion of going to nightclubs later ....

Came back to find the party disappeared ! 

Guess the girl had used the opportunity of my absence to tell the guys about me, and they'd done the "decent thing" and left hurriedly without creating a scene, but even in the UK black guys are really "macho" and given slightly different circumstances I could have been beaten up and seriously hurt.

Moral is I guess never to tell .... I really can't understand what made me do it as I was passing 100%, and if I'd had my mind set on it could have "banged" the guy who picked me up (he was "streetwise" but cultured, professional, and cute !).

Laura x

[Dennis]

Yep, it definitely could have ended much worse. I never say anything unless I'm absolutely sure everyone present knows.

Dennis

[Keira]

Oh my, that was... Dumb, hey it was!!! 
But, you survived so all is well. 

[Maud]

prior to me even comming out as trans i've thought "hangon a second is she trans" when looking at slightly quirky looking women and thinking back half of them probably were not ts, if you don't tell no one will dare confront you about it unless it's blantly obvious which in your case it simply is not.

so yeah, should've kept quiet.

[seldom]

There is a time to tell if you are post-op.  But that is in extremely limiting circumstances.
1. It is somebody you intend to have a long relationship with.  Because it might come up somehow, and honestly not telling is dishonest.
2. You are an advocate for TS causes and are speaking with regards to TS causes at some event, with the press, at a legislature, etc.
3. Close personal friend and it is relevant.
4. Doctor and it is relevant to treatment. 
5. Workplace to HR if it is brought with regards to background check.  But this should be very limited circumstances and avoided if possible.


That's it.  No reason to be open about it to anybody else.  Especially strangers in a bar. 

[Maud]

It doesn't really have much to do with whether you're post op or not, more how well you pass, even then it's a person preference thing.

[Keira]

The question of telling or not abviously only matters to those who pass.
For others, it really doesn't matter does it.

[Renae.Lupini]

My take on this is that the alcohol was the contributing factor to a situation that could have ended badly. Telling people we are TS should be an issue. It is the circumstances under which we do so that may or may not impact us is a negative way. If the guy who approached you hadn't been drinking, would he have had the courage to talk to you? The fact that you are a TS woman out on the town on your own does not trouble me as much as the idea of an intoxicated woman being out on her own.

As i was told repeatedly in the Marines, "Good initiative, bad judgment."

[mavieenrose]

There is a time to tell if you are post-op.  But that is in extremely limiting circumstances.
1. It is somebody you intend to have a long relationship with.  Because it might come up somehow, and honestly not telling is dishonest.
2. You are an advocate for TS causes and are speaking with regards to TS causes at some event, with the press, at a legislature, etc.
3. Close personal friend and it is relevant.
4. Doctor and it is relevant to treatment. 
5. Workplace to HR if it is brought with regards to background check.  But this should be very limited circumstances and avoided if possible.

Couldn't agree more Amy, that's basically just how I see it too (I've done each of 1 to 5 at some point in my life...)

One other golden rule I have is to only ever open up to someone after having already planned to do so well in advance.
Hurried, unplanned declarations are best avoided and for me definitely not something for bars and clubs.

MVER XXX

[Thundra]

The question of telling or not abviously only matters to those who pass.
For others, it really doesn't matter does it.

It does when an inordinant amount of people think that they "always pass" 100% of the time. Passing seems to be for people that just transitioned. None of the people that I know that have transitioned even think about it.

[SarahFaceDoom]

I think if your post-op why tell? 
Obviously if you think it could actually go somewhere, you probably want to disclose.  But in a situation like that where you were outnumbered 3-1, you probably should have played it safe.  I don't know.  I don't know if I would be comfortable alone in that situation around two men by myself.  I would have gone to the bathroom and escaped out the back window or something.  The violence against women numbers in this country are already staggering.   And then put trans in with that, and it seems like a recipe for disaster.

The other thing I would think in that situation is if they knew I was trans and wanted me to be a part of some kind of orgy.

But maybe I am just paranoid.

[debisl]

Been there done that. Except for telling. I have been drunk on my a_ _ and flirting with the guys. It only gets dangerous if you are there by yourself and they want more than you are willing to give. Don't ever go to strange places without a friend with you.

Deb

[Laura Eva B]

I think if your post-op why tell? 
Obviously if you think it could actually go somewhere, you probably want to disclose.  But in a situation like that where you were outnumbered 3-1, you probably should have played it safe.  I don't know.  I don't know if I would be comfortable alone in that situation around two men by myself.  I would have gone to the bathroom and escaped out the back window or something.  The violence against women numbers in this country are already staggering.   And then put trans in with that, and it seems like a recipe for disaster.

The other thing I would think in that situation is if they knew I was trans and wanted me to be a part of some kind of orgy.

But maybe I am just paranoid.

Sarah, my judgment was well impaired when I "outed myself" to the girl, but I was sober enough to know from the guys' earlier interaction with me that they had no idea.

I felt safe because of the other woman ... no way would I have sat down and accepted drinks from two guys on their own !  But a lone guy who I've pulled, in a safe public place, buying me drinks, is always more "pleasure" than "danger".

If I'd been targeted for being "trans" with an orgy kind of motivation, then they wouldn't have left as soon as girl had chance to tell her boyfriend's brother that he'd pulled a TS !

Don't ever go to strange places without a friend with you.

It was a "safe" bar, usually more girls than guys, good music, big "hen party venue" !
______________________________________________________________________

.... The only other time I'd really set out to "pick up a guy" was last summer, just two weeks pre-surgery, when I attended our local "WOMAD" world music festival - for the first time on my own as none of the usual diverse crowd could make it.

Determined not to spend the weekend on my own I headed to the main stage straight away, started dancing with the crowd, and within ten minutes had a guy hand around my waist dancing with me ! 

Not physically the guy of my dreams, nearly as old as me, very inexperienced with women, but personable, clean, OK smelling (!), and really knowledgeable (about global music and politics) - he was a career trades union guy.

We spent two days together, dancing, kissing and cuddling, and I've still not had the heart to tell him the truth about me !

Maybe I played physical contact close to the bone, but I really judged him as a person who could never resort to violence.

A pic he took of me "well gone" on the evening of our meeting ....



Really sweaty from dancing to Mexico's "Los de Abajo" (from the below) a fireworks band of the underprivledged ... loud, rocking, racious, multi-everything !

I think I look like a guy in that photo  , but I guess that's paranoia (after all I'm pushing 50, and not the 20-something rock chic I would like to be !

Laura x

[SarahFaceDoom]

HA You don't look like a guy OR 50 in that picture.  That's definitely paranoia.

And I would have been more worried about the girl being there with the other two, just because like you said, she seemed to read you as TS, and should could have at any moment decided you were a threat, and outed you while you were there.

[Maud]

HA You don't look like a guy OR 50 in that picture.  That's definitely paranoia.

And I would have been more worried about the girl being there with the other two, just because like you said, she seemed to read you as TS, and should could have at any moment decided you were a threat, and outed you while you were there.

It takes a hell of allot of certainty and guts to openly call into question if someone's TS or not, I read a fair few before comming to terms who i'd just never in any situation have the gaul to out or whatever because for all i know they could just look and act that way naturally.

[mavieenrose]

And I would have been more worried about the girl being there with the other two, just because like you said, she seemed to read you as TS, and should could have at any moment decided you were a threat, and outed you while you were there.

As far as I'm concerned if the girl said nothing, her knowing look could have meant anything..  Maybe it was just a look of 'Which one's yours then?', or 'Well, you're definitely in there my dear!',  etc...

In any case, if people you don't know and you don't need to see again decide to try to out you as trans, then you can always just smile and say nothing (or at most very little).

Perhaps a throw-away reply such as 'Right, yeah of course' accompanied by a wry smile (personally I'd never actually deny being trans as I'm proud of who I am and denial is not an option for me).  And then, when the moment's right you just calmly get up to leave, in your own time.

People come in so many different shapes and sizes, how can they ever know for sure if you don't tell them...?

MVER XXX

[Keira]

you don't look like a guy for sure, but the sweaty look, its not you ;-).

[metal angel]

It was a "safe" bar, usually more girls than guys, good music, big "hen party venue" !
Laura x

Sorry to dig up an old topic but i noticed something odd in that, i reckon you're actually safer at a place with more men than women? If guys want to go out and play preditor they'll go out to somewhere with lots of prey won't they? If you are the ONLY female there you may get harrassed, but if the place is normally 10-30% females then you're not a total novelty, but the guys don't go there to pick up or pester.

I'm basing this on presenting as female (and i am biofemale) at heavy metal bars which usually have females in the minority and getting far less harrassment from guys than some of my friends do when they go to bars which are huge hetero meat markets with far more girls.

[Northern Jane]

#1 girl's rule: Never get drunk alone

#2 girl's rule:Have a trusted SOBER friend hold your leash when you are pickled!

[Virginia87106]

To answer the question, I do not want to spend time with folks who are prejudiced against trans people.  I am proud of who I am and would never apologize to anyone.

I believe to keep it a secret can be accepting internalized oppression.