Can one really know for sure ?

[Anatta]

May I offer a different opinion?

How can you not be sure? This is what I wonder... From the moment I started living full time, I knew. Over the many years i have never, ever, not for one second thought that I would not eventually get the surgery. The thought of wanting to keep my downstairs the way it is now has honestly not even crossed my mind. My only doubts are about the choice of surgeon (is he really the right one? is he? is he? but my second choice is also good...) but that's it. Even if something went cosmetically wrong it could always be fixed (as long as your first surgery isn't done by a butcher) and money is just money, that's all you need to get a revision. I was never comfortable in the wrong gender I lived before starting to live full time and I have never had a single doubt about going back ever since (and it was more than just a couple of years ago).

How can you not know? I'm not talking about cross dressers or androgynous people or gender fluid people. If you truly are sure you are a female, how can you not be sure you want the surgery? It's like not being sure whether you're hungry or want to starve to death (not to say that non-ops choose to starve to death... I just meant that's something you can't really be unsure about!)

Am I alone in having being 100% sure I want the surgery every second of every hour of every day of every week of several years? Is it really normal to doubt wanting to get the surgery done or maybe regretting it later even when you know you're really in the wrong body and you're really the different gender than the body you're in? What makes one so attached to their physical body as it is before the surgery, even if it's wrong, full of stuff that doesn't belong there and doesn't feel right? I am not trying to say 'everyone should get surgery' rather I'm asking 'how is wanting surgery or not wanting surgery not black-and-white/obvious?'

Kia Ora G,

You make some good points...

However just because a pre op M2F person may have always felt uncomfortable with their penis, this is no 100% guarantee they are going to feel any better without it (replaced by a neo-vagina) , the future is unknowable...

And because trans-people come in all shapes and forms of gender non-conforming, where (due to societal pressures) confusion and doubt are common place-people quite often make mistakes when under pressure...Where the irrational replaces rational thoughts...

Metta Zenda

[Northern Jane]

Well it has been 39.5 years since SRS and I think I will know for sure in another 20 or 30 years 

Seriously, pre-SRS, I wasn't going to survive much longer and RLE wasn't enough. Surgery came just in time to save my life. Life after SRS was sometimes pretty rough, just like other women, but it was always better then before.

When I went for SRS, it was with total conviction to make life work and do the best with what I had.

"De-transitioning" was never an option. I didn't pass as a guy back then and I sure as heck couldn't now.

[Anatta]

Kia Ora,

@ N J
In your 'particular' case, the chances of you detransitioning would only happen when hell freezes over

@ G

As the old saying goes "Different Strokes For Different Folks !" in your particular case you may well find true contentment once the 'foreign body' is removed and you're able to live full time in your desired gender(I'm presuming you're not full time yet-my apologies if you are)...

Sadly there are some cases where trans-people have detransitioned after 'successfully' living in their desired gender role (surgery and all) for many years...

One case comes to mind, a documentary I saw a few years back of an English 'guy' who fully transitioned back in the early 80s (had the whole works too) I use the pronoun "he" because he no longer see himself as female...He (as a she) was in a loving relationship with a man for quite a few years, every thing was sweet, a job, house, etc etc (for around 20 odd years)...But then the love of his life got ill and died and his world came crushing down around him,he started questioning his identity like was s/he really 'transsexual'...

Sadly (as is the case for many) not all his family supported his transition and his brother (who had disowned him) said if he starts to live as a man again, he would be welcomed back into the family with open arms, an offer he couldn't refuse...

At one stage in his life he was 'convinced' he was a she and spent 20 odd successful years as such...

Again I say this thread is not meant to scare people, just to make them think long and hard about having irreversible surgery...

If a person think it's the right thing to do for them to do, then so be it, I wish them all the best and a happy life in their preferred gender...

As Martin Luther King once said "I have a dream !" Well I hope all the readers dreams come true...

Metta Zenda

 

[Anatta]

Kuan Yin,

In your example case I read inability to accept the loss of a loved one that lead to a psychological breakdown/severe vulnerability that left the person wide open to manipulation and emotional blackmail; he came to the conclusion that 'gaining' a family would be more valuable than living alone after losing a loved one. I read a very cruel story and an incredibly cruel and ruthless family. I cannot see a transsexual that was really a transsexual and transitioned for the right reasons ever de-transitioning unless they were brainwashed (like I conclude happened in your example) however I'm willing to keep an open mind to the possibility that i'm wrong~

I'm not offended by your assumption but it is wrong! I have lived full-time for years now! Had jobs as well after going full-time I'm fortunate in that I can fully pass even before 'the works', it's only going to get better after hrt and surgeries

"I wish them all the best and a happy life in their preferred gender..."

We can both agree on this and wish this on everyone

Kia Ora G,

It sounds like you have already ironed out any bumps in the road (having comfortably assimilated into society as your preferred gender) and by having genital surgery this will seal the deal...

Sadly it would seem there are some trans-women who fail/neglect to iron out the bumps, often thinking surgery will "fix it" but after surgery the bumps continue to appear and instead of a better quality of life, it turns into a nightmare...

Even if a post op person does not quite blend into society 'physically' they can and quite often do have a better quality of life than before(especially in an environment where people are more liberal and accepting-the world is gradually changing)...

These trans-women have mentally conditioned themselves during the RLE period (developed coping mechanisms) to help them over the rough spots...For example developing the attitude "I'm comfortable in my skin and if you are not comfortable with me...That's your problem ! I'm not gonna lose any sleep over it!" 

Your journey is similar to my own, I lived comfortably (as my preferred gender+HRT) for around four and half years as a non-op (at the time thinking that surgery of any kind was out of my reach)... Then the opportunity presented itself, and I was fortunate to be selected for government funded surgery...Originally I just wanted 'it'(testicles and penis) removed so I didn't have to continue to take testosterone blockers, but ended up getting the whole works( functioning neo vagina) for free...

May your 'surgical' dreams come true Glitterfly...

Metta Zenda

[Anatta]

Kuan Yin,

thank you for helping me see how the surgery might not make things better even for someone that truly is a transsexual. It's too easy to lose sight of the infinitely different situations people can be in when you're so used to your own... I understand and agree with what you said about 'ironing out the bumps' beforehand~ if you have unresolved issues before surgery then of course they won't be magically gone after the surgery. I'm really glad you ended up getting the surgery for free! For me there are no obstacles other than time (there has to be enough time between starting hrt and getting the surgery) and apprehensions about the selection of the correct surgeons~ (it gets especially complicated and leads to a huge amount of second-guessing if you're having more than one surgery but with dedicating enough time to research you can somehow navigate through it... and hope you didn't make a mistake in your selection and hope you don't end up a botched surgery statistic (at least one that can't be corrected))

So thank you for your wishes, may they come true without complications indeed~ and may your dreams come true as well, no matter what they might be ^^

Kia Ora Glitterfly,

Thanks...For the most part they have...
Remember when it comes to worry/anxiety over surgeons and procedures...

What's the worst thing that could happen ? And if it does, what can you do about it ? If you can do something about it, then don't worry, and if you can't do something about it why worry ?

"If you fear you shall suffer-You 'already' suffer what you fear !"

Metta Zenda

[dejan160]

I will try to explain those regrets from my point of view. I have met many transsexuals, who in my opinion are just feminine gay guys who try to adapt in the society via sex change. Usually those guys are very flemboyish, who have never been accepted in the society as men, and because of those reasons they decide to transition and then become women. Very few will complete the transition, and later if they don't succeed to pass and to integrate in the society as women they regret transitioning and then they want to go back. I call this pseudo transsexuality. A real transsexual has an inborn gender dysphoria. It is not caused by social factors but by biological, inborn factors. Also transsexuals who lose their social position and families after transitioning are good candidates to regret the sex change, even though I believe that those regrets are easily treatable with psychotherapy. Also transsexuals who get religious are possible candidates to regret sex change, especially if they are mislead to understand that transsexuality and sex change are sins. I don't think a real transsexual, born in the wrong body, will ever regret surgically modifying the body from wrong to right.   

[Anatta]

Kia Ora,

Ah the complexity of "knowing or not knowing for sure"...

Some trans-women start off 'thinking they are gay, (some even live a gay lifestyle for a while)

And some gay men end up thinking they are trans and "walk on the wild side for a while"

But who is to say what's really going on inside their heads ? The mind can be a trickster - a master(Or mistress) of deceit...

Metta Zenda