More on Progesterone for breast and nipple development

[kathyk]

I have had an email discussion with my doctor in California, and she wants me to do some serious research on the side effects of Progesterone, and the probabilities of developing serious health complications.  In effect, she has very real concerns, and wants me fully understand them.  So I'm going to do some big time reading over the next few days.  And if I decide to go on with my request for progesterone it would only be with advised consent. 

And now my questions for those who are taking, have taken, or decided against taking Progesterone. 
1. What about problematic side effects and were these a concern?  Such as depression, weight gain, swelling, or heart and vascular issues.
2. Did you feel it was still worth taking progesterone even though there's an increased prosibility of having little, or no more breast inprovement after using it for a year?
3. If you used Progesterone did you see any results within six months, and if so was there continued development for the following six months?   

Thanks girls.

[calico]

I recently restarted taking progesterone, even though of the controversy surrounding it. I feel I have already seen result's and its been 1 week!  but I am post-op so....
no side effects as of yet, and I feel that this drug has been around for a while and its still being prescribed so if it was super dangerous than it would of been pulled and or would have more lawsuits. I may not stay on it forever, I just want to allow my breasts to grow more since it seems srs has kickstarted growth with them.

[Teela Renee]

im gonna be asking my dr about going on it later this month also

[Isabelle]

I've been cycling it for two weeks per month for 3 months. So far I haven't noticed any side effects, although my boobs are a bit tender and I got a pimple. These could have been caused by anything though.

[Doctorwho?]

Ok folks - Initial disclaimer here - I am only a Medical student - I have not yet fully qualified as a doctor, however I do have a particular interest in endocrinology, so please take what I say on it's merits, but bear in mind that I am not yet an authority.

As far as benefits in regard to breast development are concerned I have no information. I suspect that it may help in some cases, but as with everything medical YMMV and in fact genetic factors will almost certainly play a large role in determining what results you get from any particular approach (including your response to Progesterone).

You worry about certain supposed side effects.

Depression :- progesterone is known as the feel good hormone, which is why women in the early stages of pregnancy often seem to "glow." In general in natal females it acts as a bit of a mood stabiliser preparing the woman for a calm maternal outlook.

Providing your brain has the right receptors your mood should actually improve. So I would argue that the psychoactive effects of this hormone might actually be a BENEFIT and a positive reason to take it even if breast development is not affected.

Weight gain :- Simply put - eat less! Weight gain is an issue with any HRT.

Swelling :- What? oh you mean as in fluid retention - well yeah that could be an issue for some but the best way to find out is to try.

Heart and vascular issues :- the problem with this is that there is some very messy research out there... A lot of the studies which reported problems were not using micronised progesterone but progestins - these sometimes refered to as synthetics - they don't work the same way!!!

Another big problem is that all the studies I have seen used natal females - and again the presence of uterine tissue and ovaries will alter the results. So this one is quite frankly completely unproven. I did see one small study which suggested that Blood pressure actually reduced when micronised progesterone was used - so again this could actually be beneficial.

Quick Summary:

Will it help you? - No one can say that for sure...
Will it harm you? - If you do it cautiously and monitor your vital signs properly you should be fine. Just be prepared to stop if something starts going out of whack.
IF you decide to try it, I would suggest that you opt for micronised progesterone, and avoid the older Progestins like Provera etc...

[MaryXYX]

Advice I have read on the TG Hormones Yahoo Group is that progestins are very dangerous, and there are likely to be doctors who have read this and think it applies to progesterone as well.  I have used micronised progesterone before and am about to restart.  Note that adolescent cis-girls are awash with estrogen and progesterone and nobody has called that a health risk.

When the gender clinic took over my meds they stopped the progesterone because their opinion is that there is no evidence it does any good.  Now that one is not my own opinion - it's the opinion of an endocrinologist at a gender clinic.  However, my breast growth stopped then, which is why I'm going to restart.

'P' every day or half the month?  I don't know - anyone have any credible research to quote?  'E' on a level dose as the clinic prescribes, or on a cycle mimicking a cis-woman?  Nobody seems to know.

[LilDevilOfPrada]

Well all I have read on proestrogens says take natural proE because synth is way more risky so that should help you if you can accept the risks.

[Joanna Dark]

I started taking P a month ago for two reasons: I read it kills T very efficiently and I hatehatehate spiro and it is supposed to make you more curvy. I feel like I am more curvy but my boobs are the same 32C. That's the thing I was a 34C but my band size shrunk so I thnk I loss muscle mass. I do think I am more curvy but I have also been on HRT for six months so maybe that is the reason. But my facial hair is growing slower and erections are becoming none existent. Thankfully. I actually think spiro raised my T levels. It didn't kill them. I get blood work done tomorrow so I'll know then. Well a couple weeks from then.

[kathyk]

If anyone has more to add go ahead and post it.  But thank you girls for what you've already said.  I'm going to do even more research because I saw a few things about studies where that were women developed cancer after extended use of progesterone.  But I'm pretty sure I'll go ahead, and will probably talk to my doctor again next week.  And now that I've read a lot and also went through your comments I see no reason why I wouldn't ask for the most safe type of progesterone available (micronized).   

[kira21 ♡♡♡]

I cycle two weekly too. I have no depression, in fact I have felt super happy, but that might not be the progesterone. I take natural progesterone, not medroxyprogresterone. I couldn't tell you about the differences as I have only really ever taken this regimen. What I can tell you though is that my breast development is quite well above what I understand the average is and I have a reasonable waist, which is quite good going for a skinny gal like me.

[LilDevilOfPrada]

I started taking P a month ago for two reasons: I read it kills T very efficiently and I hatehatehate spiro and it is supposed to make you more curvy. I feel like I am more curvy but my boobs are the same 32C. That's the thing I was a 34C but my band size shrunk so I thnk I loss muscle mass. I do think I am more curvy but I have also been on HRT for six months so maybe that is the reason. But my facial hair is growing slower and erections are becoming none existent. Thankfully. I actually think spiro raised my T levels. It didn't kill them. I get blood work done tomorrow so I'll know then. Well a couple weeks from then.

6 months HRT and 32C breasts :O you have a BA by anychance ?

[JLT1]

It may (YMMV) help glandular development in the breasts.  That is a small portion of the total breast development.  However, I suspect that the role of progesterone isn't fully understood in natal women let alone trans women. 

[Jenna Marie]

I decided against it after seeing the results of more than one meta-study (what can I say, I like databases and our local library has some good medical ones). I'm not trying to talk anyone else out of it, but the health risks - particularly breast cancer - scared me personally too much.

Of course, I was also 42C by four months on HRT, so I'm not sure I *want* to encourage them. (Currently 40DDD/42DD at 3.5 years in.)

[kathyk]

.... I'm not trying to talk anyone else out of it, but the health risks - particularly breast cancer - scared me personally too much.  ...

This is my only hang up right now.  My mother died from breast cancer, and my mom's sister had multipul cancers, including breast cancer when she died.  Plus both my sisters had non cancerous lump removals.  So I'm considering the Big C pretty seriously.

K

[A]

For one, cycling or not cycling progesterone, as far as I know, is a gamble with pretty much no real fact behind either approach. Some cycle because cis women have it cycled (though not sure it's something as extreme as having no E half the month and no P the other half), and "probably if nature happens to be that way the body reacts better to it". Others don't cycle because they're not aware of any positive effects of hormone level instability at all, and they don't want to burden their patients with the problems associated with the instability, such as changeable mood.

Honestly I think the only risks there should be to progesterone are obvious to any medication/hormone. It needs to be processed by the liver, so a smaller or larger, depending on the delivery method, amount of additional liver problem risk is added. It makes stuff grow, so as with any such growth, there is a chance it will go wrong and evolve into cancer.

I also read that progesterone is supposed to somehow protect the body from whatever negative effect estradiol may have on the body.

[Northern Jane]

A year ago I started on high-dose micronized progesterone (Microgest) to simulate pregnancy, working toward lactation. My endocrinologist did not recommend progesterone and said that because I do not have a uterus I did not "need" it but she had no negatives to argue against it. She followed me through my little "experiment".

Within a couple of months there was a significant change in the shape of my nipples, the aerola became larger and darker, and I increased 1 to 1.5 cup sizes, and I had more 'natural moisture' all the time rather than just when aroused. I used to get frequent yeast infections and they stopped altogether on progesterone.

Of all the symptoms of pregnancy that are possible without a fetus present, I had every one of them, particularly the mood swings (my poor boyfriend LOL!) but after 4 months on the progesterone the depression was becoming serious and I stopped the progesterone and added herbs to bring in my milk. That was 4 months ago. The depression went away within days of stopping the progesterone but the other effects remain. I can still feel and even sometimes see the lobules in my breasts and they definitely look more 'mature', very much Tanner stage V.

I have not cycled progesterone nor taken "normal doses" so I can not comment on those circumstances but that was my experience with high-dose progesterone.

[kathyk]

The studies are not inclusive for transsexuals and I'm still concerned about cancer.  But, my doctor has said she can plan for monitoring and she already has me on an annual mammogram schedule.  So I sent her a note this morning asking for micronized progesterone in a daily dose.  I decided not to cycle because there was so little evidence to show it was helpful. 

Gonna switch from monthy breast self exams to at least twice a month.  ? 

K

[Teela Renee]

The studies are not inclusive for transsexuals and I'm still concerned about cancer.  But, my doctor has said she can plan for monitoring and she already has me on an annual mammogram schedule.  So I sent her a note this morning asking for micronized progesterone in a daily dose.  I decided not to cycle because there was so little evidence to show it was helpful. 

Gonna switch from monthy breast self exams to at least twice a month.  ? 

K

Between how many exams I give myself a week, 2 just doesnt seem like enough.  Im sure everything will be ok.  Just ease into it and see how it goes.

[kathyk]

To all you girls, thank you.  I just got an email confirmation that the progesterone prescription is filled.  It will be mailed from California to me here in Michigan next week.   

[A]

Doctors and modernity. Emails. I'm jealous. I'm lucky if I can even get the medical people to use a fax, that thing so old I never learned how to use it, instead of the hospital's internal mail then mail then the destination hospital's internal mail, which takes half a century.