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xx fathers

Started by Nero, June 22, 2007, 09:18:14 AM

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Nero

ok, just got this from something lisbeth said, but didn't want to thread hijack.
if a family had a dozen daughters and half or more turned out to be ftm trans, could that possibly mean he couldn't 'make' boys? are there any other conditions besides xx fathers that could cause this?
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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Dennis

There are indications in studies that there are other genes that contribute to "brain sex", so it could be other than the XY chromosomes.

Dennis
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Jessica

Quote...if a family had a dozen daughters and half or more turned out to be ftm trans, could that possibly mean he couldn't 'make' boys? are there any other conditions besides xx fathers...
.

I'm not sure what you mean.

Excluding technologies involving DNA extraction and insertion into a cell, a genetically XX individual is incapable of spermatogenesis and therefore can not be, biologically, a paternal donor.

If he is chromosomally XX, he is incapable of making boys by virtue of the fact that he can not pass on a "Y" to any potential children because he does not possess one.

The SRY gene is responsible for spermatogenesis and is located on the Y chromosome.

I guess I don't understand what you are asking.

I always thought it was ironic that the name of that gene was SRY (I pronounce it 'Sorry'... it's someone's way of apologizing for doing this to me.)
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Nero

well, jessica. i don't know a whole lot about this stuff. i just wondered if an xx father had only girls and some were ftm trans, if his condition caused them to be born female because he could'nt make girls. maybe what makes TS has nothing to do with that at all. just curious.
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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Emily_P

If a man was xx and fertile he could probably produce both male and female children.  The only way you could have a fertile xx male would be for genes on the y to cross over to the x.  Any child he passed on his mutated x to would also be male.  I do not think that if a person is trans or not would be affected by this.
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Nero

Thanks for answering Emily. I've been wondering about this for some time. So - are you saying he could produce male offspring, but they would also be xx?
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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Emily_P

Quote from: Nero on September 09, 2007, 02:12:20 PM
Thanks for answering Emily. I've been wondering about this for some time. So - are you saying he could produce male offspring, but they would also be xx?
Thats right.
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taylor

Hey Nero,

just came in tonight and have not been around for a good while. When I read this I had to drop in and ask you this quesiton.... to puzzle you some more possibly lol.... who said that chromosomes determine a persons "sex" to begin with? In fact in many cases evidence shows that chromosomes do NOT determine a persons sex. If it did it would be easy and determining sex identity is all but easy. Well unless the doctors and scientist would listen to the individual and then it would more often be rather simple, we all know what sex we are, regardless of what science may or may not be able to determine from our genitic and physical make up.

Good to see you still around!

Peace,
Taylor
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shanetastic

I thought that in order to actually become a man/father you need a Y chromosome.  That is unless your interesexed and have an XXY.  The only other possible solutions is for an XY male and XX female of course.  And in that sense, there is always the probability of having a male because of the Y chromosome. 

I don't think I understand because how could one be a father if they are strictly XX, in a reproductive sense.  I thought you would either have to be XXY (aka intersexed) or XY (male) in order to reproduce as a male. 
trying to live life one day at a time
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Jessie_Heart

Quote from: taylor on September 17, 2007, 09:34:16 PM
Hey Nero,

just came in tonight and have not been around for a good while. When I read this I had to drop in and ask you this quesiton.... to puzzle you some more possibly lol.... who said that chromosomes determine a persons "sex" to begin with? In fact in many cases evidence shows that chromosomes do NOT determine a persons sex. If it did it would be easy and determining sex identity is all but easy. Well unless the doctors and scientist would listen to the individual and then it would more often be rather simple, we all know what sex we are, regardless of what science may or may not be able to determine from our genitic and physical make up.

Good to see you still around!

Peace,
Taylor

you make a very good point Taylor I just had to comment!
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taylor

Shane,

to go buy what your saying one would first have to believe that XX and XY means female, male, and that would mean that other states of sex identity do not exist. There are males with XX and there are females with XY, the problem in the TS community as with many others is they buy into what the so called "Professionals" want to keep "fixed in place", as if they (doctors etc) have a clue of what male and female are, and truth is no one does. So what is a XX person with a testicle and ovary? I could list a number of other variables, but I think this makes the point.  Re production abilities or lack of, does not determine a persons sex. If it did we would have to say that a XX woman that does not have the ability to reproduce is no longer much of a woman, and I think history shows us,, women do not appreciate that.

The world may not appreciate this, but there are males that have babies and females that don't, depending on how one defines male and female, and if we go by the socially accepted method then we will remain confused and evolution is going to take care if it all anyway. What I want to see happen is people in the TS and the IS community stop buying into these oppressive lies that make them feel as if they have a "Condition" a "Dysphoria" etc. We are all naturally a mix of what nature made us from. There is no well established method of dividing the sexes, and therefore the idea that XX and XY are methods of deciding ones sex is absolutely false and being challenged all over the world.

In CA within the next year you are going to see how this method of determination is about to be used against the TS and the Gay community with rights to Marry, so you may really want to re-consider how you view this, and look past the claims of science that contradict themselves, dig deep, search for the conflicts and realize that nothing is as it seems.

Peace,

Taylor
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shanetastic

Quote from: taylor on September 27, 2007, 04:53:15 PM
Shane,

to go buy what your saying one would first have to believe that XX and XY means female, male, and that would mean that other states of sex identity do not exist. There are males with XX and there are females with XY, the problem in the TS community as with many others is they buy into what the so called "Professionals" want to keep "fixed in place", as if they (doctors etc) have a clue of what male and female are, and truth is no one does. So what is a XX person with a testicle and ovary? I could list a number of other variables, but I think this makes the point.  Re production abilities or lack of, does not determine a persons sex. If it did we would have to say that a XX woman that does not have the ability to reproduce is no longer much of a woman, and I think history shows us,, women do not appreciate that.

The world may not appreciate this, but there are males that have babies and females that don't, depending on how one defines male and female, and if we go by the socially accepted method then we will remain confused and evolution is going to take care if it all anyway. What I want to see happen is people in the TS and the IS community stop buying into these oppressive lies that make them feel as if they have a "Condition" a "Dysphoria" etc. We are all naturally a mix of what nature made us from. There is no well established method of dividing the sexes, and therefore the idea that XX and XY are methods of deciding ones sex is absolutely false and being challenged all over the world.

In CA within the next year you are going to see how this method of determination is about to be used against the TS and the Gay community with rights to Marry, so you may really want to re-consider how you view this, and look past the claims of science that contradict themselves, dig deep, search for the conflicts and realize that nothing is as it seems.

Peace,

Taylor

Okay gotcha, I didn't know some of that information at the time.  I always though that the only possiblity to actually be like intersexed and have say ovaries and testicles would make one have an XXY chromosomes.  I wasn't aware that you could have XX techincally and have both of those attributes.
trying to live life one day at a time
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