Something that made me think of you boys.

[Adam (birkin)]

I think that all in all it's a good cartoon. It definitely helps put things into perspective if you're a gay trans guy and worried that gay guys won't want to date you.

It does come off as a bit defensive, but it's probably because he's had his sexual orientation questioned so many times and he wants to explain as much as he can.

[Leo.]

Sorry but I see this as somewhat offensive. The whole thing is basically regarding us as being female and not sure how anyone can be ok with that. Ok the guy is gay and is with them not seeing himself as straight, but rather than defend his partner when the ignorant cis guy questions their anatomy he just goes along with it saying basically that makes us female. Firstly its none of their business what our anatomy is and shouldnt disclose that to anyone in the first place, secondly he should consider his partner a bit more than trying so desparately to 'defend' himself. Honestly if someone called me that I would leave them if thats how they considered me. Im sure this was all meant well but it sends completely the wrong message to me. All it demonstrates is he's less transphobic than others might be but he still has alot to work on there. All I actually like is showing that gay guys can be open to being with trans guys. He may have been questioned alot for it but think how his partners felt with whom it was directed towards. He seems to only be thinking of himself and trying to justify it. The message is still flawed. It doesnt even take into account the fact that we can have surgery with results now that people cant tell we're trans. All it wants to talk about is 'female anatomy' which is the last thing any trans man should want to hear. To me it comes across as we're guys but basically really girls. Yeah thanks for that one. I dont want my body considered that way by anyone. We do not all have that anatomy and even if it is the case it should not be considered in the way it was here. Just makes it sound as if its all fake. When its needed just get it off the shelf.. Yeah some of us have it attached and its very much real. He might think hes being cool about it, and in some ways is, but he needs to think how his actions and words affect his partners, and hell every other trans man out there. I dont see how its ok in the slightest. There are a few good messages but the whole is flawed to me. Certainly demonstrates the general ignorant cis view that we're only defined by genitals and he is a bit better than that cause its not all about that but still considering it as female anatomy is seriously irritating me


Glad Im not the only one who sees problems with this. I agree with everything Nygeel said. Im hardly just being sensitive either, my cis girlfriend was also not happy by the way this comes across. She has never seen me as anything other than male and if asked would either say so or tell them its none of their damn business. She would never say I am 'basically female' regardless of my current body because she has a hell of alot more respect than that. Not just for me but for anyone else out there too. Why would you even divulge your partner's sexual anatomy to anyone else to begin with anyway? I date men but he has ____ , why?


I just needed to get that out it has been annoying me. I do see the good but I also see the bad which shouldnt be ignored. Yes it is only one person's view but if he has it you can bet theres plenty others who do too. Sure alot can be worse but I've certainly seen better too

[NathanielM]

I don't really have a problem with this comic. Actually I've thought a bout this thing for a while and I don't understand some of the issues people have with it.
It says we're essentially female: Uhm, that's not how I read it. It says one time we're physically speaking essentially female. Now  while that isn't the most gentle or pc way to put things if you started arguing with clueless straight guy as put in the comic saying that a vagina isn't female per se, even physically speaking will get you nowhere. Then the comic proceeds to say: I only date men (so clearly he considers us male), some of the guys I date have a vagina (so yes, we have that part that's a reality it's not the word most of us like to use but it's there, yet as he says that doesn't make us any less men).
It makes a big deal about the penis: uhm, I read it as pointing out that people make a big deal about the penis but that really it's not: as he says there are lots of other parts that are important, and if his hot boyfriend likes it he'll like it too and that you know things can be helped, whatever, it's all good.
Lastly the whole not attracted pre-testosterone, attracted post-testo and being attracted to short guys (he points out: okay, that's defensive, yes I like trans men): I'm attracted to certain things as well. I'm pansexual so generally these things have nothing to do with gender or sex, but I for example prefer the lean muscley types to the big muscles. No this isn't the most important thing, but the short guys... I mean if he likes that and is attracted to it he's likely to end up with those. Most of us are quite short, it's not like he's saying he likes transmen because they're short he's saying that might explain why 3/4 of his last relationships were with a trans guy. And most of us look prepubescent pre-T so I mean,... It's not wrong to start a relationship based on pysical attraction is it? If he happens not to notice most pre-T men that way (trans or not really) is that such a big deal?

[Ryan B.]

I didn't really find it offensive.  As someone else pointed out, it is only supposed to be this guys experience. 
Then again, I don't feel like I'm offended often or easily.

[DriftingCrow]

I am just pointing out the extreme obvious--it is a comic, that doesn't mean the author discusses his partners junk with others IRL. I thought it was more the authors way of showing his frustration on the questions people actually do ask him.

[Tossu-sama]

I saw this at Tumblr for the first time, and then on a Finnish ftm message board and they pointed out similar offensive traits from the comic, too.
Frankly, I'm not offended but I do see why it could be offensinve to someone else.

It would be easier for me to explain my views on this by actually talking so I'm not gonna write a huge paragraph of text here because it wouldn't probably make much sense in the long run (plus I sometimes have huge issues to express myself in English).
BUT CONSIDERING the comic is made from the perspective of a gay cisman, it's not surprising it has some things that trans* people might find offensive. He's not as sensitive or prone to see what can be offensive to trans* people compared to the said minority.
And I personally think that comic clarifies some things to cispeople, gay or straight. Kinda like the fact that not every man has a penis. Of course, not all trans* guys refer to as their netherregions as a vagina, considering it's usually a part of a woman's anatomy. But considering how some people can't even see the difference between sex and gender, trying to explain why a vagina isn't... well, a vagina to someone would just mindf**k them more. Simple people need simple explanations, so to speak.

Plus, one can't really consider every possible aspect that might be offensive to some in a relatively short comic like this. He could have put asterisks after every possible sentence and provide explanations and examples at the end or on the sides but I bet the sheer amount of examplary exceptions would eventually "overpower" the comic itself.

I don't know if this turned out confusing or whatnot else. I just think the comic's purpose is not to offend anyone, and yet it does. But hey, so does basically everything else in the world.

[John Smith]

For the sake of pretend, if this guy had been my boyfriend, and had argued in the manner he did in the comic, that would be perfectly fine by me. For all we know, his past boyfriends have been of the same mindset. And he's not stating all trans guys have vaginas either. Some guys have vaginas, some have [insert alternative term] and some have dicks. And some of the guys he dated and are referring to in the comic had a vagina.

[Natkat]

I am just pointing out the extreme obvious--it is a comic, that doesn't mean the author discusses his partners junk with others IRL. I thought it was more the authors way of showing his frustration on the questions people actually do ask him.

theres always to be people who is gonna be offended by transgender comics of any art. people have diffrent taste, and feel diffrent about the whole transthing.

[Jennifer.L]

Two Points

1. Anyone that thinks of you boys as girls is both blind and stupid xD
2. The author, seemed to be saying that he finds is offensive that anyone would see dating T as different from Cig.

[aleon515]

theres always to be people who is gonna be offended by transgender comics of any art. people have diffrent taste, and feel diffrent about the whole transthing.

People have killed over comics. Don't think that will happen here. So a good discussion never hurts things (or usually doesn't). I think there are some people who would be highly turned off wiht a gay guy talking to them in this manner and others would not be. You know, we're all different. And apparently he finds some boy friends.

--Jay

[Natkat]

People have killed over comics. Don't think that will happen here. So a good discussion never hurts things (or usually doesn't). I think there are some people who would be highly turned off wiht a gay guy talking to them in this manner and others would not be. You know, we're all different. And apparently he finds some boy friends.
--Jay

oh yes.. I make comics myself some of the first thing my mom pointed out where that I should be carefull. 

[BrotherBen]

And most of us look prepubescent pre-T so I mean,... It's not wrong to start a relationship based on pysical attraction is it? If he happens not to notice most pre-T men that way (trans or not really) is that such a big deal?

This is why I'm not offended by the whole "libido not responding til after T" thing- I can completely understand why a man in at least his thirties wouldn't be immediately attracted to someone who seemed to be much, much younger than him. Not that EVERY transguy has this problem pre-T, but it does seem pretty darn common.

[Adam (birkin)]

Well, the younger thing is part of it, but as someone said (I think it was Taka - can't see that far back), hormones do play a role in our sexual responses. And some people really are monosexual, you can't help what physical/sexual cues you respond to. Even down to little things like skin texture. I know I personally couldn't be with a trans woman who hadn't begun her transition yet, not because I didn't regard her as a woman, but physically, it just wouldn't work for me. I like the way a woman smells, feels, and so on. If this guy is gay, it's going to be kind of hard for him when someone has little to no male characteristics - but when hormones do their work and change the overall physical form, yeah, the "bits" aren't going to be that important because the larger package (lol) is male.

[Darrin Scott]

Well, the younger thing is part of it, but as someone said (I think it was Taka - can't see that far back), hormones do play a role in our sexual responses. And some people really are monosexual, you can't help what physical/sexual cues you respond to. Even down to little things like skin texture. I know I personally couldn't be with a trans woman who hadn't begun her transition yet, not because I didn't regard her as a woman, but physically, it just wouldn't work for me. I like the way a woman smells, feels, and so on. If this guy is gay, it's going to be kind of hard for him when someone has little to no male characteristics - but when hormones do their work and change the overall physical form, yeah, the "bits" aren't going to be that important because the larger package (lol) is male.

And to add to this, some people like certain "bits". End of story. Some gay guys want a "normal", bio cis male penis. End of story. As a trans guy myself, I do not fault them for this. To me, you like what you like and I know my body isn't everyones cup of tea. I see no issue with this. However, there is a right way to turn someone down and a wrong way. The issue for me isn't being turned down, but how it is done.

[Contravene]

After reading it again, the whole comic seemed less about trans men and more about a guy just trying to justify his sexuality while accidentally being insensitive towards trans people. That's probably the part about it that still irks me the most too. He's trying to justify himself at the expense of the trans men he's been with and trans men in general.

People, like this guy, who are constantly shoving their sexuality in others' faces are obnoxious, as obnoxious as peope who shove things like their religion (or lack thereof), their taste in music, etc. in others' faces. Just be who you are and like what you like. Don't apologize for it and don't try to justify it. If you want to have pride and flaunt a little, that's perfectly fine but don't do so at someone else's expense and know where to draw the line. No one really cares if someone is a "gold star gay". No one really cares if someone prefers transmen to cis men. The only people who "care" about your personal preferences are you and the few trolls out there who just pretend to care so that they can bother you.

No one has the authority to tell the guy that he isn't a "gold star gay" because he's had sex with transmen. It's just a petty label which makes the entire comic ironic because he's complaining about being labelled.

What it really comes down to is: do we really need a comic about something as petty as a guy whining about being mislabelled when he can just tell the people who are harassing him to sod off because who he prefers to have sex with is none of their business? I guess not because he apparently wants some sort of special recognition or award to honor him for who he bangs which is even more petty than making a comic complaining about not getting the recognition.

So yeah, even if the comic weren't about transmen, it would still be pretty pathetic.

[aleon515]

@Contravene, well I can see the meme in the gay community of "not gay enough" just like there is the meme "not trans enough" in our community. So someone who has dated a couple trans guys might get the meme that he wouldn't be gay enough. I don't see anything wrong with "justifying oneself".


Some people were not offended and some were. Not everybody here is offended.



--Jay

[Leo.]

Well we are all entitled to our opinion. I do not like this at all and I am entitled to that. If you disagree thats your opinion not mine but you have every right to feel that way too. The main annoyance was how focussed he was on himself trying to justify his actions basically at the expense of his partners feelings. They may not have minded but someone with more consideration wouldnt do that in the first place, or at least ask them first. People just really need to think more before opening their mouths about how what they say can affect other people. It only comes down to respect. Most cis people dont get it but some actually do. My girlfriend would never have acted that way. We have talked about that as I typically currently dont pass I wouldnt want the world to see us and her as something we're/she's not but she said she doesnt even mind cause she knows what I am. I didnt want her to be labelled as something shes not while Im in the bad phase right now but she would never act like this trying to justify herself. We'd both probably tell them to f**k off and thats as much of an explanation as they'd get. They dont deserve or need to know anything more, why does it matter to them anyway? All that matters are those involved


Also yes it is just a comic but that doesnt make it ok either. The fact it was done in the first place obviously theres intent behind it. Its the same thing as describing their feelings except they've drawn it. Doesnt change that fact. Comics are done for a reason and anything drawn there is there for a reason. I did alot of this in history at school we would just be given a comic drawing and had to analyse everything as to what it meant. If anything was drawn there it was there for a reason. Ok propaganda type stuff like that is a bit different but I still take it in the same way as why would it have been done if that wasnt how the author would go about dealing with such situations. It just demonstrates a viewpoint to me thats being put forward in this manner. Doesnt mean he wouldnt speak like that to people in person. If he tries this hard to justify his sexuality to others it would only seem more likely that he would. Would just be nice if people were more considerate of others is all. I know we are still way behind gays in terms of how people view us but that doesnt make us less than them and ok to treat us however they like to justify themselves to an ignorant prat. Actually telling them his anatomy was not going to change their ignorance in the slightest, if anything potentially hinder it by describing a man as still being female, so in such situations sometimes its best to not say anything. No one elses business at the end of the day

[DriftingCrow]

I just find it interesting how about 50% or so of the people here are offended by this comic, while so far no one has expressed any feelings of being offended in the Grand Theft Auto thread over in Arts & Entertainment News, there's even been defenses for GTA in that thread. I just can't really understand what makes this more offensive to those who have replied than the more bluntly sterotypical portralys in the video game. Is it because the potentially offensive material is coming from someone who is supposed to be a friend?

[Nygeel]

I just find it interesting how about 50% or so of the people here are offended by this comic, while so far no one has expressed any feelings of being offended in the Grand Theft Auto thread over in Arts & Entertainment News, there's even been defenses for GTA in that thread. I just can't really understand what makes this more offensive to those who have replied than the more bluntly sterotypical portralys in the video game. Is it because the potentially offensive material is coming from someone who is supposed to be a friend?

Because I don't go to the Arts & Entertainment News section, and I'd wager a lot of people don't.

[DriftingCrow]

Because I don't go to the Arts & Entertainment News section, and I'd wager a lot of people don't.

Of which I am aware, so does that mean the ones who did reply in A&E are less sensitive or is there an actual difference between the two subjects?

Either way, it was just an observation I found interesting. The convo here is "it doesn't matter if it's just a comic" while over there it is basically "get over it, it's just a video game".