REJECTED!!!

[JordanBlue]

So it seems like she's made that impression on you as well. Perhaps it's caused from her upbringing. She comes from a middle class family. Good point there about the bible, and it's something that I'm going to hit her with at my next therapy meeting.

Gina:
I'm no expert and not telling you what to do, but..."hit her with the Bible my next therapy meeting" is really not how you need to approach this situation.  You don't need to defend who you are.  GOD is about UNCONDITIONAL LOVE, ACCEPTANCE, FORGIVENESS. period.  If your Mom doesn't grasp that concept, all the scripture you can quote to her won't mean a damn thing.  Just sayin.

[Gina Taylor]

Gina:
I'm no expert and not telling you what to do, but..."hit her with the Bible at my next therapy meeting" is really not how you need to approach this situation.  You don't need to defend who you are.  GOD is about UNCONDITIONAL LOVE, ACCEPTANCE and FORGIVENESS. Period.  If your Mom doesn't grasp that concept, all the scripture you can quote to her won't mean a damn thing.  Just sayin.

You made me laugh when I read your post JordanBlue.  I didn't mean to physically hit her with the bible, but metaphorically hit her with my words and make them sting. With my therapist present he'll hear them and he'll defend me to some extent, 'cos he knows the way my mom is. He actually told me last time I saw him that there were a few times that I could have jumped in and said soemthing and he would have allowed it, but I missed my opportunity. This time it'll be no holds barred! Because I've gotta do what's right for me.

She just told me that she still believes that my anger, rage and depression is a result from my accident because it's all dealing with frontal lobe damage, so there is an inkiling in her that will believe that I am transgendered, but it was more caused from my accident than something I was born with.  So there may be hope for her yet . . .

[Gina Taylor]

As it turns out, my mom holds it over me that she gave up her life to look after me for the six months that I was in the hospital during my accident and now I'm asking her to accept me as her daughter, which she won't do, even though it's all part of the same thing. And she tells me that I'm being selfish???

[foreversarah]

It really does fascinate me how people do twist and use the Bible how they want to suit themselves. As has been said it's all about love, not hate, and the real stinger - when someone does mess up (Gina you have by no way messed up, this is just an example) - to forgive.

I think the problem most people have with people changing gender relating to religion is God is supposed to have made us all perfectly. To this I always respond about those with a disability or health problem. So a doctors then not supposed to intervene if a baby is born with a health problem that could kill them if they don't? Or to intervene if the child has a lifelong illness that could be 'corrected' and make the child completely healthy?

[Gina Taylor]

It really does fascinate me how people do twist and use the Bible how they want to suit themselves. As has been said it's all about love, not hate, and the real stinger - when someone does mess up (Gina you have by no way messed up, this is just an example) - to forgive.

I think the problem most people have with people changing gender relating to religion is God is supposed to have made us all perfectly. To this I always respond about those with a disability or health problem. So a doctors then not supposed to intervene if a baby is born with a health problem that could kill them if they don't? Or to intervene if the child has a lifelong illness that could be 'corrected' and make the child completely healthy?

I know exactly what you mean Sarah. My accident was a thing of fate, and my mom feels responsible for it to some respects. It's just fortunate that I came out of it as good as I did. But the thing my mom can't accept is that even though she understands that my brain is all messed up and that I am now thinking more like a woman than a man, she can't accept it, so she wants me to suffer for the rest of my life instead of correcting the problem now, since I now know how.

[Robin Mack]

... But the thing my mom can't accept is that even though she understands that my brain is all messed up and that I am now thinking more like a woman than a man, she can't accept it, so she wants me to suffer for the rest of my life instead of correcting the problem now, since I now know how.

While it is *possible* that your mom hates so much she wants you to suffer for the rest of your life, it is unlikely.  More probable is that she is in the denial phase, believing that you don't know what is best for you and that you can't possibly be the way you describe and that eventually you will grow out of it and be her "son" again, like nothing ever happened, and thank her.

We both know this is not going to happen, but it is very likely she doesn't know this yet.  From what you've written about her, she seems very set on her world view and unshakable in her convictions.  Very certain that she knows what is right and best for you (and everyone else)... This is a defense mechanism, just like your male shell was. It will take some time (maybe years) for her to work past this if she can.  Just remember, as you age and mature so will she.

*hug*

[Gina Taylor]

While it is *possible* that your mom hates so much she wants you to suffer for the rest of your life, it is unlikely.  More probable is that she is in the denial phase, believing that you don't know what is best for you and that you can't possibly be the way you describe and that eventually you will grow out of it and be her "son" again, like nothing ever happened, and thank her.

We both know this is not going to happen, but it is very likely she doesn't know this yet.  From what you've written about her, she seems very set on her world view and unshakable in her convictions.  Very certain that she knows what is right and best for you (and everyone else)... This is a defense mechanism, just like your male shell was. It will take some time (maybe years) for her to work past this if she can.  Just remember, as you age and mature so will she.

*hug*

Very good analysis Robin. If I were to sit down and tell her that she is in denial of me being a transsexual, she'd probably deny it. Just like last night I told her that my rage, anger and depression is not a result from my accident but a result from my being a transgender and she told me that my father is on the same medication because he's angry as well and he's suffering because of frontal lobe damage like I am. She always seems to have the answers but is she willing to accept the truth? And if this was a phase I was going through, I would have grown out of it a long time ago. For some reason I feel more drawn to it, so I've just accepted it as part of my life, because that's what my brain is telling me.

Now my mom is 78 years of age, and she's looking forward to her death more than life. I tell her that she should be grateful for the days ahead instead of looking at the days for her death. Continuosly she talks about the day that she coould be gone. Believe it or not, I look forward to that day (and without sounding calous), because it would mean more freedom for me to do what I want to do.

*HUGS*

[JordanBlue]

You made me laugh when I read your post JordanBlue.  I didn't mean to physically hit her with the bible, but metaphorically hit her with my words and make them sting.

Gina:
Yeah, I knew what you meant.  That's still not a good approach.

She just told me that she still believes that my anger, rage and depression is a result from my accident because it's all dealing with frontal lobe damage, so there is an inkling in her that will believe that I am transgendered, but it was more caused from my accident than something I was born with.  So there may be hope for her yet . . .

Hey...Let her believe whatever she wants.  If she believes you being transgender was caused by the accident, so what?  As long as she accepts that you're trans, does it really matter?  If she still refuses to acknowledge that you're transgender, that's her problem - not yours.   It may sound harsh, but this is good advice...you need to surround yourself with positive people - not NEGATIVE people.  You have to cut the negative stuff loose from your life.  This is a struggle I face daily, but I'm determined to stay positive.

[Gina Taylor]

Gina:
Yeah, I knew what you meant.  That's still not a good approach.
Hey...Let her believe whatever she wants.  If she believes you being transgender was caused by the accident, so what?  As long as she accepts that you're trans, does it really matter?  If she still refuses to acknowledge that you're transgender, that's her problem - not yours.   It may sound harsh, but this is good advice...you need to surround yourself with positive people - not NEGATIVE people.  You have to cut the negative stuff loose from your life.  This is a struggle I face daily, but I'm determined to stay positive.

Good advice JordanBlue. I do try to surround myself by positive people. I spent an hour with my friend from the computer store that comes from Thialand on Saturday and she read through this entire thread and she found it very enlightening. And I occasionally see my friend from Wal-mart who works in the jewlery department and I have others that I find that have a positive effect on me, and they don't throw any negativity towards me about what I do, which really helps me out a lot. I just wish that my family would accept me for who I am and leave it at that.

[Gina Taylor]

Went and saw my therapist and my mom had a lot to tell him. She showed him my coming out letter and she told him about what I was like 8 years ago, and she couldn't believe that I would be at it again. She told him about my previous therapists and how they all felt that I was delusional, and that this is all a result from the damage done to my frontal lobe of my brain, becasue it would have shown up a lot earlier in my life. Bottom line is that she will not accept me living full time and living in her house, so I figure that the only way that I can do what I want is to reverse myself and go back to occasional cross-dressing as long as she doesn't see it. This will also be acceptable by my sister as long as she doesn't have to explain it to my niece.  So at least I'm not at a total lose here. But on a good note is that I can still go out during the day (Mon-Fri) as my True Self and do whatever I want without bothering anyone.  Unfortunately I am not allowed to attend the same church, or I must find another church to go to. 

[Constance]

What did your therapist have to say about what your mother had to say?

[JordanBlue]

Bottom line is that she will not accept me living full time and living in her house, so I figure that the only way that I can do what I want is to reverse myself and go back to occasional cross-dressing as long as she doesn't see it. This will also be acceptable by my sister as long as she doesn't have to explain it to my niece.  So at least I'm not at a total lose here. But on a good note is that I can still go out during the day (Mon-Fri) as my True Self and do whatever I want without bothering anyone.  Unfortunately I am not allowed to attend the same church, or I must find another church to go to.

Gina:
And you're really ok with "occasional cross-dressing" ? 
Have you been diagnosed with gender dysphoria?
I'm no expert, but it seems to me, if you did have gender dysphoria, your true self would never be ok with that arrangement.  But hey, it's your life.   And IMHO, that's not a "church", it's a prison.

[Gina Taylor]

What did your therapist have to say about what your mother had to say?

He was surprised at a few of the things he heard. But at least I had told him most of what he had heard from her, so it didn't come at too much of a shock to him.  But he either agreed with me or agreed with her. He never really took sides. He more or less played a referee between us. But when ever I mentioned anyone of you, my mom didn't want to hear about it, because she said that she is only concerned with me and not anybody else.

[Gina Taylor]

Gina:
And you're really ok with "occasional cross-dressing" ? 
Have you been diagnosed with gender dysphoria?
I'm no expert, but it seems to me, if you did have gender dysphoria, your true self would never be ok with that arrangement.  But hey, it's your life.   And IMHO, that's not a "church", it's a prison.

I'll have to be satisfied with it until I can move out and be on my own again. And yes, one of my therapist had diagnosed me with gender dysphoria. Thanks for your concern about the church, but like I said, I can get just as much from staying at home and reading the bible as I can from going to church and listening to a pastor .

[Gina Taylor]

The choices I make are only for the best of me. My mom was talking with my sister, and she has agreed that I can move in with her as long as I keep to my promise that I'll only cross-dress occassionally and that my niece will not be exposed to it. Her concern is trying to explain to her the differences between her uncle and who the woman is.

My mom has also been talking with my cousin, who I had sent my coming out letter to back in October, and she thinks I'm confused. At first she thought I wanted to start HRT and have SRS done, but I cleared that confusion up quickly, and she still thinks that I'm confused.

[Gina Taylor]

Last night I was working on my computer when suddenly my mom comes in and tells me that she hopes that I will not be going to church dressed, for if I do, she may kill me! So I tell her that I won't because she's told me that her church means so much to her and that it's the only thing that is keeping her here. Five minutes later, she comes back and appologizes for the remark about killing me, but I'm sure that if I were to go dressed, she may do soemthing drastic. So it looks like she's forced my hand to find another church if I want to continue listening to a pastor. Being in a bible belt, I have others I can choose from. 

[JordanBlue]

Last night I was working on my computer when suddenly my mom comes in and tells me that she hopes that I will not be going to church dressed, for if I do, she may kill me! So I tell her that I won't because she's told me that her church means so much to her and that it's the only thing that is keeping her here. Five minutes later, she comes back and apologizes for the remark about killing me, but I'm sure that if I were to go dressed, she may do something drastic. So it looks like she's forced my hand to find another church if I want to continue listening to a pastor. Being in a bible belt, I have others I can choose from. 

Gina:
  I just don't get it.  Why do you continue to subject yourself to this?  The solution is pretty obvious.

[Gina Taylor]

I know that the solution is pretty obvious. I'm just bidding my time. I recieved a very nice E-mail today and my TG friend is very interested in me moving in with her, so it's just a matter of going over things, and finding the right place for us to live in, and this girl is gone  >>>

[foreversarah]

If I may say so, Gina, that's a disgusting comment for your mum to make, and again, she still seems rather selfish. Though you can be the bigger person and the REAL Christian and show forgiveness.

His also an interesting verse from 1 Timothy 5:8: 'But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.'

[Gina Taylor]

If I may say so, Gina, that's a disgusting comment for your mum to make, and again, she still seems rather selfish. Though you can be the bigger person and the REAL Christian and show forgiveness.

His also an interesting verse from 1 Timothy 5:8: 'But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.'

I know Sarah that it wasn't right for her to say it. She thinks she's trying to hurt me. But in the end, she's just huting herself and only God will deal with it.

Thank you very much for bringing that bible verse to mind. If she gets out of line again, I'll recite it to her.  Right now I'm making plans with a good friend and member of Susan's on moving in with her. Everything will work out for the best of us.