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Socialization and Societal Expectations

Started by Shantel, January 10, 2014, 11:22:35 AM

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Shantel

I had been having an email discussion with one of the FtM guys which was somewhat about socialization and how it affects us. This morning as I was thinking about that conversation a long forgotten experience came back to me. I recall being beat up when I was just a little boy. I ran home crying and as my mom tried to console me my dad said, "We aren't going to turn him into a sissy, boys don't cry come here son, I am going to show you how to make a fist!" I loved my dad and know that he meant well, but that was the start of the process that carried me up through high school and later into a war zone. The real war however was going on in my heart all the while and the rest is history.

Perhaps there are others who would like to share their own insights into how societal expectations has suppressed their gender self identity and how they managed to deal with it.
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Adam (birkin)

Quote from: Shantel on January 10, 2014, 11:22:35 AM
I loved my dad and know that he meant well, but that was the start of the process that carried me up through high school and later into a war zone. The real war however was going on in my heart all the while and the rest is history.

The truth, isn't it?

My socialization was mixed. My mom and dad never really stopped me or my brothers from doing the things we wanted (playing with certain toys, wearing certain clothes, etc). The one thing that I think has given me a challenge is actually the opposite of what you said. When my brother was bullied, he was encouraged to go and punch one of the kids to establish that he wasn't a target. When I was bullied, I was just told to keep note of it, avoid those who did it, etc. I was never taught how to stand my ground and respond physically (if I needed to). I wish I was taught how to throw a punch, because I find myself now, as someone who appears to be a young, overweight, somewhat effeminate teen boy, as more likely to be targeted by young guys. I've been pushed and called a "->-bleeped-<-got" twice already, and I worry about what might happen if some kids took it farther. So it would have been really nice if someone told me it was OK to get aggressive and push back.
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Shantel

Quote from: caleb. on January 10, 2014, 12:07:17 PM
The truth, isn't it?

My socialization was mixed. My mom and dad never really stopped me or my brothers from doing the things we wanted (playing with certain toys, wearing certain clothes, etc). The one thing that I think has given me a challenge is actually the opposite of what you said. When my brother was bullied, he was encouraged to go and punch one of the kids to establish that he wasn't a target. When I was bullied, I was just told to keep note of it, avoid those who did it, etc. I was never taught how to stand my ground and respond physically (if I needed to). I wish I was taught how to throw a punch, because I find myself now, as someone who appears to be a young, overweight, somewhat effeminate teen boy, as more likely to be targeted by young guys. I've been pushed and called a "->-bleeped-<-got" twice already, and I worry about what might happen if some kids took it farther. So it would have been really nice if someone told me it was OK to get aggressive and push back.

I think the fight or flight instinct comes naturally to anyone that is continually thrust into something that uncomfortable.
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Adam (birkin)

My instinct was "freeze." I just kinda went still and they walked away.
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suzifrommd

Insane what we teach kids.

My dad told me I needed to be willing to fight to stand up for myself.

I got really badly beaten. I was a skinny kid with no coordination. There was no way I was going to win a fight with anyone.

My dad meant well, but I wish he'd thought more carefully about all this.
Have you read my short story The Eve of Triumph?
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FalseHybridPrincess

I never had an experience as such...kinda

I grew with my mom every time I was bullied or something Im pretty sure my mom would come to school to talk with the other kids...
:-\
http://falsehybridprincess.tumblr.com/
Follow me and I ll do your dishes.

Also lets be friends on fb :D
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Ltl89

Aww, I'm sorry you went through that Shantel.  Nonethless, this is a great topic. 

Yes, I was pressured to be a "man" by family and peers.  Like you, I was bullied pretty harshly for being different than the other kids.  Most of my friends in Kindergarten and 1st grade were girls.  It wasn't until the boys confronted me about cooties and how it was effecting my behaviour that I stopped doing so.  In fact, I really became a shy kid and had difficulty expressing myself, though I did have friends and enjoyed doing typical girl and boy stuff.  However, I was always seen as different and was bullied at times for this reason which made me shy and scared some of the other kids. Later on in my life (teenage years), I was bullied for being "gay" (even though I wasn't out as such).  I remember really vicious things happening like having my face  pushed into a urinal and just really nasty rumors (like grabbing a male classmates ass) and words and nicknames going towards my way.  The one that hurt the most, though, was one time after work I went into my car someone had wrote "->-bleeped-<-got" on my foggy windshield.  It was very hurtful and it has stuck out to me even to this day.  Honestly, there is too much for me to write about and some of it is way too painful.  A lot of this stuff made me fear expressing myself.  But when I think back that time the boys confronted me about how boys are supposed to be and how girls are really made me more shy around my peers and more cautious about how I interacted with them.  It's weird how such a small event can impact us in big ways.

My family allowed me to do some gender bending, but as I got a little older they started to push me (gently) into a certain direction.  I remember having to play sports and going to baseball camp even when I had no desire to do so and would often crt.  In fact, my mom didn't even believe I broke my arm at baseball camp, so she sent me in the next day only to be shocked.  I hated playing sports, but my mother insisted that I do normal little boy things to build character and socialize with other kids my age.  That's what all mothers do and I have no problem with that.  Also, she tried to prevent me from doing "female" social activites.  As a kid, I remember wanting to do ballet like my sisters did, but my mom wouldn't allow me to do it because I was a "boy"  Instead, I got to do tap dancing and later on stole my sisters costume in order to dress up as a fairy princess in our home.  Interestingly my mom was okay with that and the other times I dressed up as a young kid at home.  She saw that as childhood expression.  While she steeered me into one direction, she was somewhat liberal with things as long as they were in the home and private.  However, I knew my mother and father saw me as their little boy and wanted me to be just that.  My father would always tell me I had to "man up" but it was done with love not anger or frustration.  I think he gave up at a point because he saw how sensitive and different I was.  It's hard to explain.

What really made me afraid to express myself as a child was all the rules I had to follow that my sister enforced.  If I had my TV on, it had to be on volume 2.  Now way could it go on volume three or I would be yelled at for the entire night.  And every 5 minutes she would make sure to check.  If this was the only thing, I'd been okay.  However, she did this with many things (including my cd player).  I remember being terrified of doing the wrong thing because it would cause a lot of drama and it would be my fault.  My parents had no idea what to do.  Even though it was terrible with how controlling she was, we also got along really well. I always looked up to my sister and she was my best friend growing up.  It was a complex relationship, but honestly she definitely made me afraid to break the rules or go out of bounds because she would yell and scream at you if you did.  I think this is why I've always been fraid of confrontation or doing "the wrong thing".  While this may sound bad, I really love my family and there is a lot of good to share, so the negatives are outweighed by the positives. 

I have no doubt my childhood and teenage years had an impact on me, but I don't know how or why.  There are so many events that could have had an impact, yet I have no idea.  In any case, I am who I am and can't let the past or my fears define me.  However, I've done just that for a long time and certainly can see how my past did mold me into who I am today. 
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Nero

#7
Quote from: caleb. on January 10, 2014, 12:07:17 PM
The one thing that I think has given me a challenge is actually the opposite of what you said. When my brother was bullied, he was encouraged to go and punch one of the kids to establish that he wasn't a target.

I got a little of this kind of thing from my dad, but there's a lot more I wish I would have been taught as well. And I got some flak for being too masculine, but not from my parents, luckily. But it wasn't the kind of 'beat it into you' kind of thing that trans girls go through. I was bullied pretty heavily by girls, but nothing physical. Mostly I just learned that I wasn't acceptable and started to believe that if I could just be a normal girl, I would be ok. So I spent a lot of time trying to be like other girls. It didn't work and I sort of became a two dimensional person, a character. In public anyway. Now that I don't have that anymore, I feel kind of stripped and weird in public.

Anyway, I see some blessings in my socialization. I'm not as repressed or self-conscious at displaying emotion as most guys. And I like that.
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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Shantel

LTL...I remember the fear of getting a "swirly," being beat up in the boys locker room and getting your head stuffed in the commode while someone flushed it, or some big jock giving me such a hard a wedgie that my feet came off the floor. I had to toughen up for my own survival back then.

@FA "Two dimensional" Yes I fully understand the feeling. These things have affected us all until something inside clicks and we discover that we weren't designed to be this way.

@ Princess you haven'e lived yet honey, you are no doubt a real princess because your guardian angel has been watching over your young life so far.
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Lavender

Hrm, it wasn't necessarily drilled into me I suppose. My father was very avid in sports, and I really wanted to make him proud. I went through practice with a sprained arm for like, an hour or more lol. I just couldn't do it, I hate anything physical. Same advice for my bullies, but at the last minute I would just not be able to do it, and it made things worse for me. I think now it really isn't an issue however, and they have come around to accepting their "son" isn't hyper masculine or anything.
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Shantel

I suppose that once we come to the point where we decide that being a pleaser and bowing to everyone else's whims as to who we are and how we should present ourselves so as not to be an embarrassment to them, then we can begin to live our own lives and be real for the first time in our lives.
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