Fed Judge OKs Suit by Outed Student

[ILoveTSWomen]

A federal judge in Santa Anna ruled a lesbian student could sue the school for outing her to her parents. I would think this would also apply to a TG student. For what it's worth.

DennisInGA

http://articles.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20051202141509990008&ncid=NWS00010000000001

[ILoveTSWomen]

Here's the text in case you had a problem accessing.

SANTA ANA, Calif. (Dec. 2) - A federal judge ruled that a lesbian student can sue an Orange County school district and her principal for revealing her homosexuality to her mother.

Charlene Nguon, 17, may go forward with her suit claiming violation of privacy rights, U.S. District Judge James V. Selna ruled in a decision dated Nov. 28 and announced Thursday by the American Civil Liberties Union of Southern California.

The Garden Grove Unified School District had sought dismissal of a portion of the suit, arguing that Nguon openly kissed and hugged her girlfriend on campus and thus had no expectation of privacy. [Read More]

[Cassandra]

A most interesting case Dennis. Thanks for bringing it to our attention. Keep us posted on this.

Cassie

[AmyNYC]

This is the kind of story that makes me feel really good.

Not only did the courts rule in favor of the girl, but the quote from the mother warmed my heart, "The person to decide when and how to talk with our family about this should have been my daughter, not her principal."

I hope the principal gets what's coming to him.

Amy

[beth]

     It sounds good, I hope it can be worked out in an appropriate way.  What if a female student is sexually harrassing another female student.  How do we tell the parents?  Just an example of how it can get complicated.



beth

[Shelley]

I'll probably be howled down on this one but here goes.

What about the rights of the parents, we seem to be forgetting that when we talk about children it is the parents who have responsibility for their upbringing.

My daughter dropped a subject in her last year of school that meant that she could not go to Uni. We had discussed the matter with her and had refused  to sign a document allowing this to occur as we wanted her to meet her agreed aims for Uni. The school not only allowed her to drop the subject knowing we would not sign the form but also chose not to tell us. We found out to late of course.

Consider this:

We were financially supporting her through school.

We allowed her to go on provided she could show some tangible achievement from it.

She was under eighteen

She now regrets her decision and has spent the last three years trying to qualify as a mature age student.

She would have been finished Uni now.

I actually find it annoying that there are do gooders out there who seem to think I'm incapable as a parent of making a decision as to the needs and welfare of my children.

Interestingly I can't make a decision for my child once over sixteen as she is old enough to know what is good for her but according to social security I am financially responsible for her until she is twenty three.

So that means I have the responsibility for her upbringing but I am considered not responsible enough to take part in her decision making processes.

Who would want to be a parent these days. (Well actually me as I have six and would consider more but I really think I need to be working until they are twenty three if I'm going to be supporting them!!!!)

Shelley

[RachelW]

What about the rights of the parents?

I'm not a parent, but hopefully my perspective as a relatively recently emancipated adult will be beneficial.

Shelley, in your particular case, I think you have a right to be upset. However, there are parents who don't recognize that their children become adults at some point, even if their children start making decisions that the parents don't like. The parental relationship becomes an adult friendship, and the parents are no longer in charge. I've seen this fly over so many parents' heads, and they spend the next five years baffled and angry because they can't control their "kids" anymore. You're probably thinking that this doesn't apply in any way to a 17 year old... I would humbly ask you to reconsider, bearing in mind that this transition doesn't happen all at once.

I think Charlene knows best what her parents should and shouldn't know about her sexual orientation. Charlene's mother agrees: "The person to decide when and how to talk with our family about this should have been my daughter, not her principal." If Charlene were caught smoking crack, this would be a different story. But Charlene was "caught" expressing something that she has every right to express, regardless of what her parents think.

[ILoveTSWomen]

Shelley,

I have to agree with Rachel. I'm a parent as well, not SIX kids like you  but a parent, so I do know where you're coming from, but there's a difference here. I'm thinking sexual/gender orientation is not the schools business.

How many hundreds probably of posts have there been here about how to come out to family... lots of stressing over it. How many would like the school, church, office, etc.. to out them to their family?? Few I'd imagine.

DennisInGA

[Shelley]

Good points both Rachel and Dennis,

But if the school principal knows then I would assume that others know. I may be different in my approach to my kids. We negotiate a position and personally I don't find being gay all that big an issue (I know some would). My concern is that if I don't know how can I underatke my responsibilities as a parent. There are areas of society that pray on kids who are vulnerable and I would consider a child or even teenager without the support of his or her parents vulnerable.

I suppose the big piont here is that not all parents are the same. I have a number of very close gay friends so homosexuality is nothing big nor would TG be for me. (obviously) Some parents however would see this as a disaster and create all sorts of problems so for that reason I think there is probably some validity in what you say.

A bit of a dilemma when you try to take a general approach.

Shelley

[M-F]

She was openly making out with her girfriend in the hallways.  The other students knew, the teachers knew, & the principal knew.  He had to make out a discipline report for the conduct. 

When a student is disicplined at school, the parents need to be told.  If they want to know why their child had to be disicplined then they have to be told the reason.  In this case she was making out with another girl.

The girl was not outed by the principal, she did it herself by her open public conduct. 

I think this is just another money grabbing lawsuit.  By filing the law suit she told the entire world she was gay.

People need to be held accountable for their public actions.

[Dennis]

And that's where the wrong begins. Why should some students (gay and lesbian) be singled out and disciplined for actions that other students can engage in with impunity?

The principal was wrong to discipline her for public displays of affection when the same policy doesn't apply to heterosexual couples.

The fact that it was a "disciplinary" matter is discriminatory in the first place. Then to be outed to her family by the same discrimination is adding insult to injury. Her sexual orientation has nothing to do with her school performance and should be left up to her to tell her parents imo.

Dennis

[Leigh]

The principal was wrong to discipline her for public displays of affection when the same policy doesn't apply to heterosexual couples.

This not only happens in schools but to adults in public.

I have a good friend who is str8.  We were talking about discrimination and she made the comment that she hasn't seen any.  I asked if she would like to really know what people really thought of PDA between same sex couples.  She said sure and did she find out.

We went out, shopping, and to a restaurant as a couple.  Holding hands, kissing and sitting beside each other in a booth.  Its obivious when you see it everyday of your life.   It was a lesson that she will hopefully never forget,  The behind the hand comments, the dirty looks and is a few cases really rude service. 

Why did the school treat her different?  Because they thought they could enforce their morals and get away with it.  I hope she cleans out the school bank account!!

Leigh << who will not put up with that type of nonsense!

[Shelley]

Now we have a totally dofferent set of circumstances to that which I first commented on. As I have said elsewhere I have a number of gay friends who have to curb their affections in public to avoid exactly what Leigh described. I'm not talking about "making out" as tenagers do but simple hand holding or reaching out to touch each other. I hate this part of society that feels that they can decide what others can and can't do.

Back to the school. If the disciplinary action was even handed then I would have supported the school as the parents would then be entitled to know why the disciplinary action were taken. If as described it was however part of descriminatory action then bring on the lawyers and lets demote the principle who is obviously incapable of handling the job allocated.

Shelley

[Dennis]

Exactly Shelley, if public displays of affection were against the rules for everyone, then fine, it's disciplinary action and the parents should be told. But if it's one-sided, then it's discriminatory.

Dennis