Advice vs. Support

[Asche]

Back when I was married, sometimes my wife would tell me about some situation that was distessing her, and I would try to be what I thought of as "supportive," and she would get furious.  "I want support, not advice!  I want you to sympathize, I don't want you to fix it or to tell me how to fix it!"  was more or less what she would say.  I later learned (mostly after the marriage was over) that males are socialized to fix things, and aren't encouraged to simply listen and empathize.  BTDT.

Now the shoe is on the other foot.  I'm going through a lot these days (some of which I have shared here), and when I tell people about it, often they want to give me advice, or pull away because they feel they don't have any good advice to offer.  I want to say to them: I don't want advice.  I want to be able to just unburden myself of what I'm going through and have people listen and maybe say things that give me the feeling that they understand, that I'm not alone, that I'm not making it all up.  Or maybe just give me a hug and let me cry on their shoulder.  (Metaphorically -- I haven't been able to do more than slightly tear up since I was a small boy .)

After the Robin Williams suicide, the topic of depression was hot on a number of web sites and blogs I frequent.  When I wrote a comment on one of them, I found myself saying: one of the most soul-crushing things about depression is the way it makes me feel so lonely and cut off from everyone.  It convinces me that no one wants to hear my pathetic whining; they'll say, "ew, gross, get away from me" or "don't be a baby, pull yourself together" or "you just want attention."  (And yes, those were pretty much what people would say to me back in the days when I wasn't as good at hiding my depression.)  Whenever I can't keep up the "I'm fine, life is good" mask, I have to go and hide somewhere so I won't bum people out.

So maybe one of the things I'm doing these days is experimenting with lifting corners of the mask and letting little pieces of what's underneath show.  And maybe practicing putting into words some of the things inside me that have never seen the light of day.  (I think I'm a non-verbal thinker, so it's a real effort -- but doing so also allows me to see these things from a different perspective and relate them to the verbally-focussed world I live in.)  But always ready, like Punxsutawney Phil on Groundhog Day, to scuttle back inside my hole if I see my shadow.

[Satinjoy]

Asche

Interesting thoughts and for me a good topic.

In AA, we have a guideline that we follow in speaking on a floor, where the dialogues are somewhat similar to the style of a forum.  Being an old vet of that, I have a tendency to mimic it.

What I have done in the past and was taught to do was simply share my life experience with others, never tell them what to do, tell of what works for me, empathize with their pain and compare it with mine, share in their victories, and fight to the death for their sobriety, which in here would be their right to be NB trans and be free and authentic.

Sharing what worked for me, admitting it when I am clueless about it, and making sure they know they have been heard.

And if I don't know about something and want help, I seek out my mentors privately here on the forum.

This crosses all the gender spectrum in AA.

Just my own experience, strength, and hope.

Blessings, nails out.....

Satinjoy- SJ...

[Mark3]

I want to say thank you for sharing so much of yourself here, I know its difficult to open up without feeling that others won't understand and accept you just the way you are.. I share many of your same fears here as well, and I can't stress strongly enough that you aren't alone, and no one here will judge you, or push you away, or try to give you unwanted advice.. We're here to listen anytime, about anything, and will gladly and sincerely give you a hug anytime, rain or shine, day or night, someone is almost always here to listen..

Anyways, I'm Mark, welcome to our unicorn forest...
Welcome..!

[Taka]

this is a very important topic, particularly on these non-binary forums.
i will always try my best to not make it sound like i'm offering advice, even when people ask for it.
advice too often comes off as the one solution for all of one's problems, and that really is no solution for dysphoria, no matter in which form it presents itself.

satinjoy has learned a good form of support. sharing our own thoughts and experiences that are related to a theme, is a way that we all can learn, without giving advice. the experience i and many others have with depression, is that the change has to come from within the person who experiences it. so advice really won't work, while support can give just enough peace of mind to find one's own solutions.

i'm really thankful to all the people here who have offered me support without judgement, helped my identify my fears and problems without giving me the solution as well. i was given what i needed to find my own solution, the one that works for me.

i'll still offer all kinds of advice when people ask for it though. just not in the form of "you should". "things that are known to help" are usually more helpful, or "you could try to". giving the option to not follow advice that won't work right now, is just as important as offering the advice. what's even more interesting is giving several different options, showing how there is no one size fits all solution. i always personally get closer to finding my own answers when i get responses from several people about their own different experiences.

it's still a dangerous thing to do though, as not all who ask explicitly for advice actually want it. and not all who complain that they are suicidal want to talk about it. mistakes will be made because i'm unable to read other people's minds. but i'll always do my best to be open and talk about something else, if the person if they just tell me that they don't want to talk about what they started with after all.

doing these conversations in text can be just as challenging as doing them face to face. when seeing the person, it's easier to pick up on visual cues to how comfortable they feel about the direction the conversation is taking. but in text it's also easier to withdraw if the person one is talking to takes the conversation in a bad direction despite the signals that are being sent about discomfort.

if any of you who read this disagree with me, try not telling me about how i'm wrong, but instead offer your own views on the points where our opinions or experiences differ. i really want to learn much more about this, as support is very important, but a difficult thing to do right.

[helen2010]

What I have done in the past and was taught to do was simply share my life experience with others, never tell them what to do, tell of what works for me, empathize with their pain and compare it with mine, share in their victories, and fight to the death for their sobriety, which in here would be their right to be NB trans and be free and authentic.

Sharing what worked for me, admitting it when I am clueless about it, and making sure they know they have been heard.

And if I don't know about something and want help, I seek out my mentors privately here on the forum.

Just my own thoughts..

SJ

Great advice.  I learned early on in relationship counselling that trying to be a better male and offering solutions was counter productive. Understanding that I am NB and benefiting from hrt I now listen more and solution less.

However I have been guilty of answering the question that I hear, rather than the question which is being asked by the OP.  My fear is that this is unhelpful and request that if you see me do this, to please PM me. 

Coaching is a good thing and I welcome it.

Safe travels

Aisla