Soooo glad it's not me! No photos please!

[Julia-Madrid]

I figured out that I was transgender and definitely more attracted to men when I was in my 20s, but I tried a traditional role, and almost managed it.  After I got divorced 3 years ago I decided that I needed to at least try living as a gay man, to see whether it would fit me well enough.

It was ok for a while, I guess, and I had a couple of wonderful boyfriends who remain close friends, even though their ex-boyfriend is now an ex-girlfriend (poor things - how do they cope? )

But the thing that left me absolutely baffled was the general attitude to casual sex.  "Forget about relationships; go out and have sex, lots of it" was the almost unanimous advice I got from my gay friends.  So, rather reluctantly, I tried it.  By the time I got to the doped-out hairdresser where the entire experience - from Grindr to finding myself back on the street - lasted a whole 20 minutes, I knew this was definitely not for me.  Plus, I was gradually letting go of two decades of mental repression, and The Girl was starting to flex her eyelashes (is that even possible?)

Last night a dear gay couple, my oldest friends in Madrid, celebrated 13 years together.  And after dinner at a place I recommended, they were going to return to their hotel suite where "Two boys" were waiting for them.  And then they sent me the pictures.

Aaaaaargh!  Not only was this a clear case of way too much information, but also made me see how far I've come, and how impossible it would have been for me to continue trying to be gay. 

Phew!

Anyone out there with a similar experience??

xxx
J

[Ms Grace]

Ha! Can't say that I have. My friends are a bit more discrete than that!

[Coolsummer121]

I definitely can identify with the whole "well maybe I'm just gay" scenario, and I can't even begin to describe how much worse that made the whole scenario for me when I was younger. It's true that I gained some sense of femininity from the experience, but OH MY GOD the gays I were around (not making stereotypes here) were so judgmental! I could not handle it at all. But now that I know I'm a woman, I've actually noticed guys coming on to me in bars and clubs and it's really interesting to me.

[big kim]

I hung about on the gay scene in the late 70s thinking I might be gay,it wasn't for me.I disliked it from the music to the casual sex and bitchiness.

[Julia-Madrid]

He he... yes, when I lived in Johannesburg, the bitchy judgmental look-how-pretty-I-am scene was insufferable.

But here in Madrid I have a wonderful bunch of gay friends.  Kind, intelligent normal guys whose only difference is that they dress a little better than average.

And they make an effort to include me - I guess I've become their "->-bleeped-<- hag" 

[melanie maritz]

You live in SA too? That's awesome!  . I had a phase where I wondered if I was just gay because I heard of transexuals who went through the whole process of transitioning only to realize that they are actually gay.

[Brenda E]

Phew!

Anyone out there with a similar experience??

Phew indeed!

No similar experiences - thanks, in part, to the experimentation of others such as yourself and the results of your research: we can skip the intermediate maybe-I'm-just-gay step and go "straight" from being unhappy guys to being happy girls.

[Ash]

My best friend in a school, who is gay kissed me a few years back.
I liked it so I went with it. Thought it might have been enough.
But I think it forced the trans issue even more. As I started going very effeminate and wearing girls skinnies. I always felt quite different to even the very fem gay guys.
Although I do love the gay scene. But I'm only a young baby queer still.
Don't have too many gay guys friends. And the ones I have are mostly drag queens. Lots of lesbian friends mainly though.

But it certainly helped me build up a network of good girlfriends, many of whom have been super helpful and understanding.
And also I can act super girly and people just think I'm super gay, not trans so I don't have to out myself fully.
Although I think it may be harder to come out to some people who know me. Cos they get a little confused with the whole girly gay, or a girl and all sorts.

And you're not a ->-bleeped-<- hag, we're fruit flies.
Or fairy dust.
And everyone knows gays would be useless without his girlfriends
Behind every good gay is an ever greater lady.

[Eva Marie]

When I was trying to figure out who I am the thought that I might be gay entered my mind. I knew no gay people and I was married so I never experimented with living as a gay person/dating gay people.

Now I go to a church that consists predominately of gay people and I have a lot of gay friends and I love them all - but i'm not one of them 

[Julia-Madrid]

You live in SA too? That's awesome!  . I had a phase where I wondered if I was just gay because I heard of transexuals who went through the whole process of transitioning only to realize that they are actually gay.

Hiya Melanie

I used to live in JHB, but now I'm in Madrid.  Where are you living, girl?

I think it's a fair point you make, and that's why we really need our psychologists.  But I remember when I was doing therapy in the 1990s in Johannesburg, my therapist actively lead me towards discussing gay issues rather than trans ones.  I think she believed that it would be no fun being trans in the old South Africa, and I would largely agree with her!   

And you're not a ->-bleeped-<- hag, we're fruit flies.
Or fairy dust.

Could I be a fruit butterfly pleeeease! So much prettier! 

[Jessica Merriman]

I know myself I do not fit into the recognized trans life where I live. You know, hard partying, lot of random sex, drugs, etc. I a just a simple woman trying to run a house, raise my son and wait for the one who truly deserves me mind and soul. Not fitting in with the crowd almost made me feel I could never be trans because I could not be like a majority of them here. I think I understand you totally girl. 

[LizMarie]

My first endo visit went on for some time, because even with the letter from my therapist and six months of therapy, he wanted to be sure I was not gay. My doctor has been handling trans patients since 1975. And since then he's seen a huge decline in gay men trying out being trans to see if they can "get by" that way. And he actively discourages that as well. So we spent quite a bit of time discussing me, why I wanted to transition, etc. And in the end he wholeheartedly agreed with me and prescribed my HRT (and still does). But apparently gay men trying to be trans as a way to escape the social stigma of being "queer" back in the 1970s and 1980s was fairly common, and accounts for some of the cases of regret back then when regret rates were estimated at 5%-7%. (Current regret rates are estimated around 0.5%.)

[Frank]

I find myself with quite a few gay and questioning friends (as I tend to prefer men too, wow the flirting could kill) and I find the attitude a bit funny. If someone gets laid, he gets badgered for the details. If a friend thinks he might remotely like it, kissing must immediately happen. Gay couples also don't seem shy about inviting extras in. Are guys on the whole, just that much more casual about sex than women?

[Tessa James]

I am queer/bisexual and have many wonderful friends who are gay and have enough personal experiences with men to know myself.  Therapists back in the 80's told me i was gay and fighting it but being trans just didn't seem to be on anyones radar then.  I don't want to contribute to the stereotype of easy/casual gay hook ups and know plenty of people of all kinds that are sexually promiscuous.  That said I too have friends that are only too happy to display their baskets to the users of Grindr or engage in door bell or restroom encounters.  I'm not judging but it didn't work for me and too many guys found me too girly, nellie or shy for their taste.  I don't like the term but could also be called a ->-bleeped-<- hag now.  Sometimes our transitions contain a process of elimination?

[Wild Flower]

I need love not sex. Sex is a frigid thing for me.

[Julia-Madrid]

I am queer/bisexual and have many wonderful friends who are gay and have enough personal experiences with men to know myself.  Therapists back in the 80's told me i was gay and fighting it but being trans just didn't seem to be on anyones radar then.  I don't want to contribute to the stereotype of easy/casual gay hook ups and know plenty of people of all kinds that are sexually promiscuous.  That said I too have friends that are only too happy to display their baskets to the users of Grindr or engage in door bell or restroom encounters.  I'm not judging but it didn't work for me and too many guys found me too girly, nellie or shy for their taste.  I don't like the term but could also be called a ->-bleeped-<- hag now.  Sometimes our transitions contain a process of elimination?

And, Tessa, I think this is probably true for some of us.  It was definitely true for me.  I was still a boy in January of this year, in a gay relationship with an exceptional man, and something clicked in my head and I said "I want this, but I want it as a woman." 

It was part of a very slow evolution towards self-acceptance.  From where I am now, I have the perspective to see this.

[GnomeKid]

hahaha I'm sure there are plenty of gays who would have been put off by that situation, but i definitely agree.  Soooo glad none of my friends would ever think that appropriate to send me pictures of that sort.

[Tessa James]

And, Tessa, I think this is probably true for some of us.  It was definitely true for me.  I was still a boy in January of this year, in a gay relationship with an exceptional man, and something clicked in my head and I said "I want this, but I want it as a woman." 

It was part of a very slow evolution towards self-acceptance.  From where I am now, I have the perspective to see this.

Yes, our hindsight is a bit closer to 20/20 vision eh?  Loving and being loved by a man was wonderful for me.  I was able to feel more of my shadow girl in a real sense no matter what I looked like on the outside.  I do miss being seen and desired by men who are gay/queer and am a bit less secure about how straight guys see me now.  Some of those looks are unnerving.  Kind of academic tho as monogamy is currently our way as a married couple.

[Jess42]

You know Julia. You do what you are comfrotable with. No more and don't be pressured. You are in charge of yourself and saying, "No thank you" is just as easy as saying, "Let's Go". Your comfort level and what you are comfortable with is the important thing.

No matter what I do and the lifestyle I live. Menage a' Tois is not my thing. I want intamcy and love for me and one other alone. Not to say if I fell for both and so on but one at a time please. Two is company and three is a crowd. Of course please me one at a time and then knock yourselves out together. I don't get jelous.

But seriously do what you are comfortable with and nothing else. There are other people in the world. And there are pople that will love you. Settle for nothing less. If it is two people that love you then so be it. As long as you are comfrotable with it. But being called a "->-bleeped-<- hag"? I think I would have demanded them to call me Miss "->-bleeped-<- Hag".

[Ash]

Yes, our hindsight is a bit closer to 20/20 vision eh?  Loving and being loved by a man was wonderful for me.  I was able to feel more of my shadow girl in a real sense no matter what I looked like on the outside.  I do miss being seen and desired by men who are gay/queer and am a bit less secure about how straight guys see me now.  Some of those looks are unnerving.  Kind of academic tho as monogamy is currently our way as a married couple.

I had that kind of shadow girl feeling with my ex boyfriend. It was wonderful. But I kind of knew the whole time that as a gay relationship, it just wasn't working.
Although I'm a little worried about when I go full time. Cos my interest is leaning way more towards pretty gay guys than boring smelly straight boys  And that is never going to end well. Both attraction physically and personality wise.
I just love the whole gay scene that I've been involved with. Even get to see my favourite Drag Queen Willam on Friday.
I'll end up being Princess ->-bleeped-<- Hag. Bit of a change from my current Alcoholic Aunty title.


Queen Bee, Fairy Godmother and Fairy Princess are some alternatives to the ->-bleeped-<- hag term.
I absolutely detest Fruit Fly though. I use it as an insult. It just sounds so ick.