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Am I just fooling myself?

Started by cindy16, February 03, 2015, 11:05:26 AM

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Michael17

Hi Cindy,

Thank you for your thoughts on this! I admit that I feel almost exactly the way you do. My situation also feels not "typical". I sometimes beat myself up because I feel I might be overthinking it in the first place. But, I then tell myself if I am questioning it in the first place, there must be some validation. This doesn't always work and one day I might know it's right and the next it isn't as urgent. Do you ever feel this way? Just keep your head up and know that others are feeling like you, I know this helped me a lot. :)

Michael
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cindy16

Hi Michael,

Thanks for your message. I know about your situation from your first post a few days ago.

Yes, I have been oscillating between feeling really convinced about my identity and feeling that I am overthinking it and fooling myself, but so far, I have not been able to really convince myself of the latter since I seriously started thinking about this a few weeks ago.
And come to think of it, all my memories right from childhood and also the growing questions and thoughts over the last few years which led me to this stage all seem to fit in so well with the gender dysphoria explanation that I can't see any other reason for it now.

I also read elsewhere that a therapist can only help you accept yourself, and check whether you have any other conditions or personality disorders which might be driving the gender issues. At least that is what a good therapist is supposed to do, and not diss you based on your sexuality or late onset or anything else. I have never had any other psychiatric issues or symptoms, so I see no other solution to it except to transition at some point. The only questions are how long can I hold on as my current self and how far I'll need to go.

I had initially thought that late onset cases like mine are probably 'milder' and can be 'managed', but the last few weeks have told me that even if it starts late, it just occupies your mind very quickly and can drive you off the cliff very soon if you don't do anything about it.  :-\

Cindy
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cindy16

Tessa, about that video, I just realized it may seem to some that I have made the video or am somehow related to it. That's not the case. I just came across it on youtube while searching for other info. The video has actually been made by the same trans girl that I mentioned a few posts ago.
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Sheila Grace

Quote from: cindy16 on February 03, 2015, 11:05:26 AM

And after all this, I justify my attraction to women as my being lesbian. And I thought my wife had a 'lesbian side' too. But then, she says she is practical enough to know that is just her fantasy, and she is otherwise happy being hetero. And she doesn't want me to transition, because the cost for our social, professional and family life may just be too much. So why can't I be practical like her and put these thoughts out of my head?


Cindy- Your eloquent post is the reason that I am so glad to be a member of this community. It is open and honest, and strikes at the heart of many of the issues that I have struggled with. What is more, it seems from my brief time in this forum, to be very common that such similar ideas, unease, and restlessness plague so many of us. The question that your wife asks about "why can't you be practical" is certainly one that I have faced in my early transition. And, since I am 64, it is accompanied by the supplimentary barrage: "Why now? How did you not know this before? How could you do this to us?" And, when I have tried to explain my perplexities to a cis-friend, I have started out with, "I know this is wierd, and may sound crazy, but.... I know I am a woman." Fortunately, I had a wise person answer that statement with something that is profound and terribly helpful to me, and maybe it will be to you. Paraphrased, she said, "Sheila, the best evidence, as odd as it may seem from the outside, that you are right where you need to be? You are asking these questions. Do you think cis-males ever even think of these issues; much less agonize over them and make decisions based on the answers?" I think that she is onto something that resonates for me: that this has appeared in my life is something that may have always been there, but for whatever reasons, it's meaning and importance has surfaced and now it is a large conscious part of my day to day. I really believe that many of us have gotten here in this life for some inexplicable purpose and are awakening to  and grappling with these "odd" issues. For me, I am as perplexed as you are, and struggle mightily at times with the construct and its' implications and the energy it requires and the loss and the unknown and the fear. Sometimes I feel lost and alone. Who would understand this mystery????? Well, it so happens that lots of humans are awakening to this. Maybe we are the vanguard of something new with some new way of being. I don't know, but what I do know, is that when I see someone like you that is so bluntly honest and as perplexed as I am, that I somehow feel better. I am not doing this alone, and there are many others that are going through a similar initiation. Is it right? Is it practical? Is it fair to others? I don't know that I will ever be able to reconcile these questions, but I see others further down the road in this transition process that assure me that there is some peace in the exploration. So, all I can do is put one high heel infront of the other and try to stay open to what wants to be revealed in my journey.....Thank you so very, very much for your openess. Sorry for the long reply, but it really strikes a chord this morning. Blessings to you, Sheila Grace
I am an older MTF in transition. Currently negotiating this time of life with my SO of many years. I am PT and on HRT.



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cindy16

Sheila, thank you so much for your really kind words.
What you have written really resonates with me too, especially the part about how asking these questions to ourselves is itself some sort of indication that we are probably not cis-men. And I have not just asked myself questions, I have gone on and tried to find answers, landed up here and am sticking around for now. From what I know, most cis people would probably treat a lot of the stuff we discuss here as TMI or even freak out over it. All of this indicates that there is obviously something different about us.

Fortunately, my wife has not exactly asked me those questions which I mentioned, or demanded any other answers as such. Those are questions that I keep asking myself. Though she is not at all supportive right now of me transitioning, she has given indications that she may come around eventually, and until now, she has been incredibly supportive and understanding about my mental / emotional issues regarding this. I understand her fears about me transitioning - we are yet to start a family, have high-stakes careers and live in a fairly conservative country, so it can be really problematic for both of us.
But I do feel we can work it all out. My wife and I have both had some indication about my feminine side all along, and are both dealing with it becoming dominant now, and are both trying to find explanations which could convince me that I am male after all, but are realizing it may not work, and we may have to do what we need to do.
It's just the other external factors in our situation which are troubling us right now as I've mentioned above.
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Christa Michelle

In a lot of ways you remind me of myself when I first started questioning about a couple years ago. Even as recently as early 2014, I was still thinking I was simply a boy who liked to wear girl's clothes because it felt nice.

I don't know if you keep a journal, but I've been writing in mine for a long time, and it holds every major shift in my attitude toward being trans and wanting to transition. I've gone back and forth on the issue repeatedly, sometimes thinking myself a girl and other times a boy with an odd habit. The first piece of overtly feminine clothing I ever bought was a black blouse with floral lace sleeves, and I remember writing in my journal the day I got it that wearing it made me feel as free as air, and that I could transition if I wanted to.

I didn't know I was trans until over 3 or 4 weeks ago, and that was also the same time I decided to seriously explore transition, and what led me to being here. For me, the clothes are more than just clothes, they're the only tangible, physical link I have to my inner girl, and I have to let her express herself sometime, or else it gets uncomfortable.

Not every trans person suffers from dysphoria. I've been quite happy with my male life, given it's been all of my existence until now, but now that I've looked inside myself and found a girl waiting to make herself known, why shouldn't I embrace her? I could continue as I am relatively easily, but to do so would be to deny a part of myself.

My fondest hope for you is that you find the identity that matches you best, and I wish you all the luck in the world. :-)
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cindy16

Quote from: Christa Michelle on February 11, 2015, 08:16:11 PM
I didn't know I was trans until over 3 or 4 weeks ago, and that was also the same time I decided to seriously explore transition, and what led me to being here. For me, the clothes are more than just clothes, they're the only tangible, physical link I have to my inner girl, and I have to let her express herself sometime, or else it gets uncomfortable.

Not every trans person suffers from dysphoria. I've been quite happy with my male life, given it's been all of my existence until now, but now that I've looked inside myself and found a girl waiting to make herself known, why shouldn't I embrace her? I could continue as I am relatively easily, but to do so would be to deny a part of myself.

My fondest hope for you is that you find the identity that matches you best, and I wish you all the luck in the world. :-)

Thanks Christa, what you have written in these lines is almost exactly what I feel. I also thought initially that I'll be happy with just the clothing, but very soon, it was no longer enough. It was not about being 'turned on', it wasn't just about comfort, it wasn't something I could simply wear for a while and then forget about, it went deeper than all this. It was only after a few days of being here that I began accepting what it meant.

And it has now changed my attitude towards clothing. Earlier, I would dress up in private, look at myself in the mirror and feel happy at the slightest hints of femininity that I saw. Now, I want to try something out in public but stop myself saying I have to bide my time (except women's jeans, which pass off as gender-neutral to most people) and I now feel a bit upset with the mirror because it is no longer about 'hints of femininity', but about not being feminine enough.

Anyway, I think I am just going in loops thinking about all this. Enough about me for now. :)

I hope you too find the right path ahead for yourself, and I wish you the best.
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stephee72

Finding where to begin is always a process, but at least u have the support of your wife to work through this. Its important to know who you are and why you are doing it. Therapy can be great, the fact your trying to figure it out means your taking it seriously.
I have been struggling with letting out my secret my entire life, I have spoken to internet friends and even had a trans friend who worked near my work. I never told him about me, but always listened to him go on and on about transistion. So i think he may have guessed my interest. I also know of a gay male roomate he had that thought it
would be fun to take hormones too.  So he could crossdress at a rainbow bar they would frequent. After about 4 or 5 months he stopped taking them and had a breakdown. Didnt like what they made him feel like. My trans friend is fully gg today and very happy. So maybe in the end your soul will let you know where you belong in this world. Keep your options open and ask yourself does it make the inner you feel right, the outter you is just a face we put on for others to believe in. When you can put the two in harmony that is real happiness. 
I am being honest with myself and others here at all times, because I cant be honest in other parts of my life, just want honesty, support  and kindness for all.  :-*
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cindy16

Quote from: stephee72 on February 11, 2015, 10:32:58 PM
So maybe in the end your soul will let you know where you belong in this world. Keep your options open and ask yourself does it make the inner you feel right, the outter you is just a face we put on for others to believe in. When you can put the two in harmony that is real happiness.

Thanks stephee, those words are really thought-provoking. I hope you too find a way to resolve your struggle.
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i_are_kim

Quote from: cindy16 on February 11, 2015, 02:34:41 AM

But yes, for regular stuff like therapy right now and possibly HRT later, I need to find someone within India and I am having a tough time trying to find where to begin.

Have you found anyone ?
If not , there is a fb group called india LGBT and find for a doc named lgbt friendly therapists
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cindy16

Hi Kim,

Well my current therapist referred me to a psychiatrist a couple of weeks back. I wrote about it in https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,183446.msg1628231.html
Neither of them are specialists in gender issues, but they have been helpful so far, so I don't feel the need to go anywhere else right now. If I do need letters etc for HRT later and I can't get those from them, then I'll see what to do.

Thanks for asking.
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stephee72

Cindy,
Just checking in. Hoping you are still strong no matter what the therapists do or say, Just remember your happiness comes from that inner voice. What it tells you to do is ok, just dont be rash and make any mass changes overnight. Just tr uh t k sm k le and laugh each day. Hope your weekend is filled with joy.
Love Stephee
I am being honest with myself and others here at all times, because I cant be honest in other parts of my life, just want honesty, support  and kindness for all.  :-*
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cindy16

Stephee, thanks for asking. I am doing fine mostly, and the therapist has been quite helpful all along.
I know that being rash or making overnight changes isn't the way to go about it, because I want to preserve my marriage and career while I am at it, so it's going to be one small step at a time.
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stephee72

Cindy,
I am in the same boat as you, your just further along, im not all out, I desperately want to keep my wife and family, and I need my job. Its so hard to juggle what this does to you and your life. I am rooting for you and look forward to seeing how it all works out for you. Just keep trying to find something each day to make you happy, kinda balances out the bad.
Love Stephee
I am being honest with myself and others here at all times, because I cant be honest in other parts of my life, just want honesty, support  and kindness for all.  :-*
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cindy16

Thanks Stephee. Although if you are going to wait to see how things work out for me, it might be a long wait. :P
e.g. even HRT (if at all) is at least a year away for me, perhaps more.
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stephee72

Cindy,  Im not going to wait, Im going at my my own pace, Ive actually been on and off hrt before, but I never broke completely through the closet. Trying to lose weight now, to get to the next step and slowly find my way where I know I have to be. Your ahead in the fact that you are at least seeing a therapist and the wife knows and supports. Either way thats what this forum is for support of each other.
I am being honest with myself and others here at all times, because I cant be honest in other parts of my life, just want honesty, support  and kindness for all.  :-*
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cindy16

Oh, I didn't know that you had been on and off hrt. At least you know what that would have felt like. That's another example to me of how there is no one definite path, and each one can be ahead or behind the others in various aspects of transitioning.
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Jen72

I admit watching your posts a lot sounds you are thinking a lot like me including the should I or fooling myself thing. Of course I am different as far as I am single and different country/culture but in some ways so alike. Anyway I guess I am stalking out of common thoughts of what where am I going. I am guessing I will be trying hrt before you and will definitely let ya know how I feel etc. I know not your answer but it might help figure this am I fooling myself or not. Or I haven't  a clue either.

What is funny in not a ha ha manner is the wait I am on is good in that I really think on it then again the wait also feels like I am thinking on it too much. I hope we both find that balance of mind versus heart to find the peace we deserve:) May your roads be not so bumpy and to find that next road at your pace:)
For every day that stings better days it brings.
For every road that ends another will begin.

From a song called "Master of the Wind"" by Man O War.

I my opinions hurt anyone it is NOT my intent.  I try to look at things in a neutral manner but we are all biased to a degree.  If I ever post anything wrong PLEASE correct me!  Human after all.
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Tessa James

I want to briefly address that "just fooling myself" concept a bit more as so many of us have been plagued by the nagging doubts that often result.  I wonder how many of us, as children, looked down and said to ourselves that i must be fooling myself, my anatomy clearly says I am a boy or girl.  Couple that with some cultural attitudes about rigid gender ideas, transphobia and few objective resources it's no wonder we may feel we are crazy or an alien being.  But we also know that being transgender or transsexual or a crossdresser is accepting membership in club that has largely been scorned, derided, ridiculed and subject to murderous discrimination.  Unless we are terribly masochistic or have a martyr complex i can fathom no reasonable explanation other than this is our truth.  Anatomy is not destiny and the availability of successful peers and therapists to help us determine what is going on is a priceless advance for us.

Yes, our memories can be muddled and conflated.  Police, psychologists and trial attorneys are well aware of our imperfect recollections even when it comes to life and death matters.  For most of us, however, this is not a single episode but typically years and even decades of anguish or feeling our very body is wrong and doesn't fit.  Many have learned to cope and thrive despite the obstacles while denying our true selfs.  It is the persistence of this certain feeling that "I am not what I appear to be" that leads us to explore a greater understanding.  I trust we are smart and may recognize that we fool ourselves even more by denying, hiding and repressing our true selves.  I once thought no one could know and was surprised after coming out and having so many people say that "i knew that you were gay or trans" or "that makes sense now"  Yes, it does make sense and I am grateful to those that have gone before us and paved some paths to understanding.
Open, out and evolving queer trans person forever with HRT support since March 13, 2013
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cindy16

I have this topic, especially the wondering as children part, fresh in my mind because I was talking about it today with my therapist too.
She was listening to me ramble on and then remarked how I often point out that unlike other trans folk, I never felt this way since childhood and that I only realized it very recently. We then went on to discuss how exactly did I even figure out stuff related to gender and sexuality.

Well, I don't really remember wondering about gender or sexuality or anatomy much as a child. I was aware from an early age that males and females look/sound/act different and that in some way it was biologically determined, but the exact difference was not clear until the age of 9-10 I think. By that time, I was already aware of the trans folk that are commonly seen begging in public in India, and that they are considered 'neither male nor female'. This awareness also brings with it transphobia and prejudice against them which is very common in India, and I am still not sure if I am fully rid of it. But what exactly is their situation and how they end up where they are was not clear to me until much later, maybe only as an adult.
Terms like 'transgender', '->-bleeped-<-', 'MtF/FtM', 'queer', 'non-binary', 'genderfluid' etc were also things I understood only as an adult, maybe only in the last few years. I was aware of those who cross-dress occasionally, of which there are many examples in Indian mythology and in Indian movies / television as well, and also in plays performed in single-sex schools, but nothing more than that in terms of anything linked to someone's fundamental identity.
Only some more common terms like 'gay', 'lesbian' and 'sex change operation' were things I heard sometime in my teens, but I never really related to the first two terms and the third one just seemed like some exotic thing that exists either in sci-fi or is maybe experimental or something the very rich can afford. I think in all of this, I just went with this assumption that sex is biologically determined and there is nothing one can do about it. Also, I always linked gender identity and sexuality with each other until a few years ago, so since I have always been attracted to girls, I thought I had nothing to worry about.

At the mental / emotional level, I think I was aware from my early teens that my way of thinking and emotions are probably different from many guys. I came across these pop quizzes which use stereotypes and pop psychology to tell you how male/female are you, and even though I had some stereotypical male traits like being good with numbers or being interested in sports (watching and talking about them, never playing), I would still end up with a score on the feminine side or a mix of both. I just accepted it as a part of myself, and those who know me well have always known me as being 'sensitive' and all, but I didn't think much of that either.
Socially, I was neither the type to play sports or other rough-and-tumble with boys nor wanting to play with dolls etc with girls. Instead, it was always books for me, and I could simply be by myself for hours on end. Though I do remember enjoying board games or anything else that both boys and girls could play together. But being in an environment with limited mixed-gender interaction, I cannot say for sure whether I did or would have preferred interacting with one more than the other. What I am more sure of is that I simply dismissed my being different as being a nerd, and I carried that explanation about myself in my head until very recently when I couldn't carry it any longer in the face of a lot of evidence to the contrary (that nerdy guys are just like other guys in so many ways and I am different from them too).

Then in the last few years, only as I started living by myself and then with my wife and became closer to her than I had ever been to my parents or anyone else, has the full extent of my feelings come out, to myself initially and now to her as well. And it is only with the awareness of how wide the trans umbrella really is, and knowing that there are people who transition and live 'normal' lives including marriage, careers etc that I could begin to relate to it. And then realizing all that actually goes into transitioning has led me to begin to ask myself how much or which parts of it I really want. For example, I did not even know about HRT, how essential it is for transitioning and the changes that it can bring about until a few months ago, and it is only then that I began to think this was something I wanted for myself.

That's my story so far, in short. There are a lot of other mental blocks on the way that I had to overcome to accept myself, but even if some of my recollections are imperfect, I think the direction that most of them point in is now very clear. Whether I end up doing anything about it or not is a different matter.
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