bottom dysphoria and jealousy

[elapse]

i'm new here and i basically just joined to read, and feel less lonely and learn.
i'm 19, pre-everything and ftm. if you're wondering.

it may have some trigger warnings.

something recently have been bothering me and i know how to kinda deal with it (no) but i guess i'm seeking understanding and people who can relate to me because i sometimes feel very lonely. i have no friends whatsoever in my life that's trans who can sort of just be able to relate, rant or in general just know that we're not alone and be there for each other. i have one cis girl who is the most amazing person ever, i love her so much and she have helped me through so much and i'm not kidding but i own her so much but sometimes i do feel lonely.

in the beginning when i realized i was trans, i had a lot of chest dysphoria but it seems like everything have moved down to the bottom now. i can't stand it. i'm very jealous of cis guys but even more jealous of cis children (boys). i know i shouldn't waste my time being jealous but the knowledge that a baby's penis will and are forever bigger than mine until i might have surgery but it still gets me every time but i try to think "not every guy have a penis, theres intersex, and there's micro penises and there's trans people that may be stealth." but i'm still so jealous. lately i have been crying a lot. at least once a week up to thrice a week when no one hears because of the dysphoria. i so badly want a penis. i want to be able to be hard and be able to ejacuate but no, i will never know and it makes me sad and depressed. i also know all the "embarrassing boner stories" cis guys tells and what do i have "embarrassing bleeding through my underwear stories?" it sucks.

i'm a perfectionist so i put the goal very high, and i'm super hard on myself even if i shouldn't but it's hard to not. i'm very happy i have learned so much, i have experienced so much due being trans but i wish i could be reborn as a cis guy  or knowing earlier to stop the female puberty.

another thing, sometimes it feels like i'm stuck in time. i see all those guys i used to be with in school and they're all grown up. masculine and deep voice. they're very tall where i live and my heigh is extremely short so it feels like i'm just a little boy that got stuck in time.

i have ranted enough, on the positive aspect. i do pass about 80% if i keep my mouth shut.

Mod edit: No swears thanks

[Ms Grace]

Hey Elapse

Welcome to Susan's Great to have you here - looking forward to seeing you around the forum.

I understand it can be very hard indeed. You'll find other trans guys here who are going through similar. As you say yourself though there's no point in being jealous, it will only eat you up and make you feel wretched. Have you considered talking to a counsellor to help you find ways to deal with your grief and sense of loss?

Please check out the following links for general site info...

• Site Terms of Service and rules to live by
  
• Standard Terms and Definitions
  
• Post Ranks (including when you can upload an avatar)
  
• Reputation rules
  
• Photo, avatars, and signature images policy
  

Cheers

Grace

[FTMax]

I've never experienced any body jealousy towards cis-guys. The only jealousy I ever felt was in regards to the ease with which they can approach dating. Nothing to disclose, no awkward discussions about what everything looks like and what is/isn't okay to do with it.

But in a lot of ways I'm luckier. Being socialized female for so many years I feel has helped me "navigate" women more effectively. Cis guys by and large don't understand a lot of women's issues unless they've been raised around a lot of women. Those are all things that I inherently understand that they never will.

I'm not sure if you've considered testosterone at this point or not, but that would do a lot for you in terms of masculinization. Like you, I passed around 80% of the time if I didn't speak. Now, I'm even gendered correctly on the phone.

[RaptorChops]

Look into a packer/prosthetic. It's not going to make your bottom dysphoria go away 100% but it will help you feel a bit more whole I guess you could say. It's nice to feel like you have something between the legs.

[CMD042414]

I feel for you! I'm so sorry that you are going through this. Some of the issues you brought up can be rectified with T. The voice, the bleeding, your appearance to name a few. I too find it depressing at times to live with knowing that I will never have a natural functioning penis. And I'm getting the sense that you tie having one to being a man. Which makes sense. But what I've realized is that manhood is so much more.

There are so many cis males with huge dongs maybe, that are absolutely wretched men. There are cis males with micro penises. Or smaller than average. Or erectile dysfunction. Or can only last 5 minutes. Or sterile. And many other things. Maybe it would help to slowly alter your definition of what it means to be a man. As transmen I do think we are in a unique position to show the world a different presentation of male-ness. And as was stated being socialized female gives you so much more of a clearer view of human interaction than a cis guy.

I know this will be controversial to alot of guys in here but I wonder if we do ourselves a disservice by steadfastly declaring ourselves as MEN(!) What if we are somewhere else on the spectrum of gender? Something entirely different altogether. That is not defined by chromosomes or genitalia. I always refer to myself as a transman, not a man. That's who I am. I am a transman with a vagina. And that is OK. This is who I was born as. I know that helped me.

[Mitternacht]

Hello and welcome.
Just wanted to say I definitely know how you feel. I am pre everything as well. The majority of people I enjoy being around are men and I always get jealous of them in some way or another. I don't mind my height so much but I get lots of bottom and top dysphoria. The worst part is that I have only really had one person to talk to about it and he has been very understanding and good to me but I do still get lonely. Hopefully you will be able to find some help here. If you ever need to chat feel free to message.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[makipu]

I have to say that as I was reading,  I was very surprised to see you literally using the same words to describe my feelings.   I just want to say that I can definitely relate to your jealousy. I am also aware of the negativity that it causes so I've been avoiding to look down there for years. More than the jealousy I had, my hatred towards the female anatomy was even greater so all in all, more negativity anyone can imagine.  I am also a constant crier.

Maybe you can get a packer to see how you would feel about it? I am not sure if it will make it better or  spike the jealousy because of the fact that it's not real but at the very least, it may feel good because it's looks right.I recently bought one and it at least gave me some positive feelings...

[harlee]

I can relate to this so well and nothing helps All I can do is pray that lab grown penis's or penis transplants come our way soon!

[Kylo]

Jealousy's nothing but a self-destructive emotion unless you plan to do something to get what it is that you want. I no longer really feel jealousy. I think I just beat it out of my head when I was younger because it was doing nothing good.

Perfectionism as a general trait isn't bad but remember, there is and never will be such a thing as a perfect body or a perfect person. They don't exist.

You probably won't wanna hear this but the sooner you accept that yeah, nature gave us a raw deal and you're just going to have to make the best of it, the better you will start to feel and the more you can concentrate on fixing the problem than just feeling crap about the cards you've been dealt. Concentrate on winning the game, not the bad start, as it were.

I guess I'm lucky because I don't feel all that bad about being a Peter Pan type stuck in time.

[elapse]

Hey Elapse

Welcome to Susan's Great to have you here - looking forward to seeing you around the forum.

I understand it can be very hard indeed. You'll find other trans guys here who are going through similar. As you say yourself though there's no point in being jealous, it will only eat you up and make you feel wretched. Have you considered talking to a counsellor to help you find ways to deal with your grief and sense of loss?

Please check out the following links for general site info...

• Site Terms of Service and rules to live by
  
• Standard Terms and Definitions
  
• Post Ranks (including when you can upload an avatar)
  
• Reputation rules
  
• Photo, avatars, and signature images policy
  

Cheers

Grace

thank you for answering and thank you so much for having me. that meant a lot! and yes, i have wondered if i should but it's a bit tricky to find the right one. I guess i will have to try a few times or maybe i'll get lucky the first time.

[elapse]

I've never experienced any body jealousy towards cis-guys. The only jealousy I ever felt was in regards to the ease with which they can approach dating. Nothing to disclose, no awkward discussions about what everything looks like and what is/isn't okay to do with it.

But in a lot of ways I'm luckier. Being socialized female for so many years I feel has helped me "navigate" women more effectively. Cis guys by and large don't understand a lot of women's issues unless they've been raised around a lot of women. Those are all things that I inherently understand that they never will.

I'm not sure if you've considered testosterone at this point or not, but that would do a lot for you in terms of masculinization. Like you, I passed around 80% of the time if I didn't speak. Now, I'm even gendered correctly on the phone.

thank you for answering and i understand and that's great! i also like that i can understand women but i'm a bit nervous i stick out from other men when i can't relate to them sometimes. i do want hormones but i'm on "the waiting" so there's nothing i can do except going on meetings to get there and well, wait. 

[elapse]

Look into a packer/prosthetic. It's not going to make your bottom dysphoria go away 100% but it will help you feel a bit more whole I guess you could say. It's nice to feel like you have something between the legs.

thank you for answering and i will definitely do! a bit short with money and not sure how to explain for parents when a penis will arrive in a box but i have thought about it!

[elapse]

I feel for you! I'm so sorry that you are going through this. Some of the issues you brought up can be rectified with T. The voice, the bleeding, your appearance to name a few. I too find it depressing at times to live with knowing that I will never have a natural functioning penis. And I'm getting the sense that you tie having one to being a man. Which makes sense. But what I've realized is that manhood is so much more.

There are so many cis males with huge dongs maybe, that are absolutely wretched men. There are cis males with micro penises. Or smaller than average. Or erectile dysfunction. Or can only last 5 minutes. Or sterile. And many other things. Maybe it would help to slowly alter your definition of what it means to be a man. As transmen I do think we are in a unique position to show the world a different presentation of male-ness. And as was stated being socialized female gives you so much more of a clearer view of human interaction than a cis guy.

I know this will be controversial to alot of guys in here but I wonder if we do ourselves a disservice by steadfastly declaring ourselves as MEN(!) What if we are somewhere else on the spectrum of gender? Something entirely different altogether. That is not defined by chromosomes or genitalia. I always refer to myself as a transman, not a man. That's who I am. I am a transman with a vagina. And that is OK. This is who I was born as. I know that helped me.

thank you for answering and thank you for understanding. i do tie that part in the back of my mind with "manhood" but i'm trying to not do it since i know that it's not true at all. it's still difficult but i know it's not true. i just gotta work on it.

i agree and i feel that trans people in general do have a better view of life, since we have seen the life from two points of view and not only one.

i get what you mean and the way you're thinking is not wrong however i just want to be seen as a man personally because a lot of personal reasons. But i get how you think and i have a lot to discuss about this because it is interesting but i rather not do it here and if you want to label yourself transman then no problem.

[elapse]

Hello and welcome.
Just wanted to say I definitely know how you feel. I am pre everything as well. The majority of people I enjoy being around are men and I always get jealous of them in some way or another. I don't mind my height so much but I get lots of bottom and top dysphoria. The worst part is that I have only really had one person to talk to about it and he has been very understanding and good to me but I do still get lonely. Hopefully you will be able to find some help here. If you ever need to chat feel free to message.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

thank you for answering and thank you for having me here! I prefer being around guys too but i have none irl atm. I understand, know that they probably are jealous of something else too might help but i feel you, trust me. I'm happy you found one who was/is very understanding. that is very important and the same goes for you. Hit me up anytime if something's wrong and you feel like talking/ranting.

[elapse]

I have to say that as I was reading,  I was very surprised to see you literally using the same words to describe my feelings.   I just want to say that I can definitely relate to your jealousy. I am also aware of the negativity that it causes so I've been avoiding to look down there for years. More than the jealousy I had, my hatred towards the female anatomy was even greater so all in all, more negativity anyone can imagine.  I am also a constant crier.

Maybe you can get a packer to see how you would feel about it? I am not sure if it will make it better or  spike the jealousy because of the fact that it's not real but at the very least, it may feel good because it's looks right.I recently bought one and it at least gave me some positive feelings...

thank you for answering and i'm sad to know that you had (and are ?) going through it. you really don't deserve that pain, it's indescribably and very unfair but i hope you're feeling better today or at least have some days with peace. Not many can go through what we have to put up with every day but we're still breathing, we are warriors at heart. if there's something, feel free to hit me up if you want to talk/rant.

And yes, i will look more into those packers, hopefully they will help! and i'm happy it gave you a bit of the positive!

[elapse]

I can relate to this so well and nothing helps All I can do is pray that lab grown penis's or penis transplants come our way soon!

I think it will take a while so don't get too attached to them but i also badly wished it will come true one day and faster. Also a lot of research about surgery might help. I'm scared I will bring hopes up for those lab grown penises or penis transplants and then realize it will take longer than expected but there's a lot of great surgery results too. Don't ever look at "a few weeks after surgery" pictures. Look at the one year pictures if possible, even up to five years after surgery. And stay strong.

[elapse]

Jealousy's nothing but a self-destructive emotion unless you plan to do something to get what it is that you want. I no longer really feel jealousy. I think I just beat it out of my head when I was younger because it was doing nothing good.

Perfectionism as a general trait isn't bad but remember, there is and never will be such a thing as a perfect body or a perfect person. They don't exist.

You probably won't wanna hear this but the sooner you accept that yeah, nature gave us a raw deal and you're just going to have to make the best of it, the better you will start to feel and the more you can concentrate on fixing the problem than just feeling crap about the cards you've been dealt. Concentrate on winning the game, not the bad start, as it were.

I guess I'm lucky because I don't feel all that bad about being a Peter Pan type stuck in time.

I see, jealously is an emotion just like happiness is. it's nice to know some have been able to see the light through it and being able to control it rather than that controlling you and hopefully i will be able too one day.

i'm much aware of a "perfect" something doesn't exist and i'm fine with that but i'm trying to work as close as possible to make myself comfortable in my own skin.

i'm at the "waiting" stage atm. So i'm kind of trying to fix the problem but it takes a lot of time. Thank you for the advise, i'll try to focus on the positive aspects instead even if it might be difficult while waiting.

i guess. maybe it's not bad, but i'm not sure.

[elapse]

and one thing more, sorry for the swearing. and i don't know how to edit the post to remove it but i think you removed it anyway.

[Kanzaki]

Well, I made my account to reply to the post, but now that I'm actually typing, I hardly know what to say...

Possible trigger warnings? Not entirely sure, never lurked in these kinds of forums before, nor do I know many trans people. (Actually, yeah, trigger warnings, now that I'm actually typing the rest.)

I really understand where you're coming from. I feel exactly the same way. (Also pre-everything, by the way.) I'm constantly jealous of people who have XY chromosomes and were born with a fully functional penis. It really doesn't help that the person I'm dating happens to be a cis male, and that he happens to have a thing for so called "traps" (men who crossdress and successfully pass as women, NOT trans. Don't be insulted by the word I use, it's commonly used in the sort of "community" I'm in, it's definitely not a derogatory term). In other words, I'm exposed to penises often, and seeing these traps in their girly clothes and with their penis out (obviously I am referring to pictures here, not real life) just makes me feel even worse. I'm starting to understand why many trans men might not be willing to date cis men. While I know being jealous accomplishes nothing, I just can't help it and feel really bad about myself more and more often lately. I guess a good solution would be to cut my partner out of my life, but I really love him and don't want to even think about the idea of leaving him.

Speaking of height, I feel like even though most ftms have it hard already finding clothes and shoes, I probably got even more unlucky (yeah, all that self-pity, it's so lovely). My height is about 5'1, I think? Not sure. It's 155 in centimeters, either way. I'm extremely small even among females, who are generally around 170cm-ish here. Not entirely sure about this either, but I think that's about a 6 inch difference? Obviously, men around here are even taller than that. Because of that, literally the only place I can buy clothes (or shoes, for that matter of fact) is the kids section. While I technically can fit into women's shoes, I've noticed they all have disgusting color combinations or just look bad, I'm still forced to get kids shoes. I don't even fit into women's clothes here, other than the absolutely smallest size (only in some select stores, others only carry about 4 sizes larger than that as the smallest), and even that generally doesn't fit well (not that i want to wear women's clothing in the first place though). Unfortunately, the kids section has a very small (and bad) selection of clothing, so I'm pretty much stuck wearing two shirts every day.

Either way, I've gone way off track and ended up ranting about my own problems, sorry for that. Back to the point I wanted to make at the beginning; you're not alone in how you feel. I'm pretty sure there's a lot of other people who feel the same way, other than you, me, and probably some other people who have replied in this thread.

[elapse]

Well, I made my account to reply to the post, but now that I'm actually typing, I hardly know what to say...

Possible trigger warnings? Not entirely sure, never lurked in these kinds of forums before, nor do I know many trans people. (Actually, yeah, trigger warnings, now that I'm actually typing the rest.)

I really understand where you're coming from. I feel exactly the same way. (Also pre-everything, by the way.) I'm constantly jealous of people who have XY chromosomes and were born with a fully functional penis. It really doesn't help that the person I'm dating happens to be a cis male, and that he happens to have a thing for so called "traps" (men who crossdress and successfully pass as women, NOT trans. Don't be insulted by the word I use, it's commonly used in the sort of "community" I'm in, it's definitely not a derogatory term). In other words, I'm exposed to penises often, and seeing these traps in their girly clothes and with their penis out (obviously I am referring to pictures here, not real life) just makes me feel even worse. I'm starting to understand why many trans men might not be willing to date cis men. While I know being jealous accomplishes nothing, I just can't help it and feel really bad about myself more and more often lately. I guess a good solution would be to cut my partner out of my life, but I really love him and don't want to even think about the idea of leaving him.

Speaking of height, I feel like even though most ftms have it hard already finding clothes and shoes, I probably got even more unlucky (yeah, all that self-pity, it's so lovely). My height is about 5'1, I think? Not sure. It's 155 in centimeters, either way. I'm extremely small even among females, who are generally around 170cm-ish here. Not entirely sure about this either, but I think that's about a 6 inch difference? Obviously, men around here are even taller than that. Because of that, literally the only place I can buy clothes (or shoes, for that matter of fact) is the kids section. While I technically can fit into women's shoes, I've noticed they all have disgusting color combinations or just look bad, I'm still forced to get kids shoes. I don't even fit into women's clothes here, other than the absolutely smallest size (only in some select stores, others only carry about 4 sizes larger than that as the smallest), and even that generally doesn't fit well (not that i want to wear women's clothing in the first place though). Unfortunately, the kids section has a very small (and bad) selection of clothing, so I'm pretty much stuck wearing two shirts every day.

Either way, I've gone way off track and ended up ranting about my own problems, sorry for that. Back to the point I wanted to make at the beginning; you're not alone in how you feel. I'm pretty sure there's a lot of other people who feel the same way, other than you, me, and probably some other people who have replied in this thread.

thank you for answering and yes, i feel you in this. I don't feel offended, so don't worry. And i'm not sure about the trigger warnings that is why i just wrote "trigger warning", if someone would feel triggered in any way.
I understand! Tbvh, well. i would love to be able to be in a dress and feel good but with a cis body... not like this. I actually trashed everything that could make me look as a woman completely since it will just cause problem and probably get me misgendered a whole more. And that sucks since i find men who have dresses also pretty. I like the thought of breaking the "binary box" and i would love to also be able to break it but atm, no. Actually been thinking about "cosplay." since there's no such thing as gender there, be whoever you want, dress whoever you want, kind of feel.

As for your partner, i really don't think you should break up with him due jealously since jealously tend to destroy a lot of things and it would be sad if it destroyed what you guys have just because of this, so be strong. Maybe try to talk with him about how you feel if you already haven't. I bet you two could figure something out. I'm into men as well and I have had a lot of thoughts about dating a cis guy. I'm a bit scared since i tend to be jealous a lot and I'm not sure how i would feel doing that but i believe it would work out. It's either that or another trans man, I'm not into women unfortunately so I know i'll have to deal with this later on as well, if I want a partner and of course I want to find someone too later on.


Yeah, the clothes issue and especially the shoes and jeans. I'm 5'3 - 5'4 ish. Not that tall either and women tend to be around that height here too, so i'm always the small one among women too. I think there's online pages of clothing for ftm. I haven't used them because I tend to fit into the smallest of men's clothing but it is definitely a struggle to find something. Try to google after ftm stores. I'm sorry about the height. I always tell myself a lot of cis guys tend to be shorter than me too, i just haven't found them yet. sometimes I use to google after cis guy height issues to feel less bad about the height given to me. I use to shop in women's shoes. My feet can fit kid's too.... so yeah. Try to look for gender neutral, I'm surprised I manage to find something nice eve if it's like once a year. Also use insoles if you can it's not expensive at all if you buy it from ebay. I do that. It wont make you a giant but at least 2-5cm taller (even taller if you can find a pair of shoes to fit it all. hehe.) I bet you just need to look somewhere else, guys comes in all shapes and i hope you will find something that fits you. (I'm very bad giving advise, I'm sorry.)

And thank you, I feel better and don't worry, if there's something just hit me up.