Susan's Place Logo

News:

Please be sure to review The Site terms of service, and rules to live by

Main Menu

Feeling frustrated after a year HRT, low hormones?

Started by Saki, January 20, 2016, 09:31:37 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Saki

Quote from: SamKelley on January 22, 2016, 06:57:56 PM
Oral estradiol passes through the intestinal tract and is first processed by the liver; most of it is lost. If you've been taking oral pills (not sublingual or transbuccal) for a year much of the estradiol will have been broken down into less effective metabolites (e.g. estrone) by the liver. There is a blood test which tests estrone levels vs. estrogen. Oral estradiol can also increase the risk of blood clots in some people. One pathology test for this is the thrombophilia screen but there are other indicators too.

I would expect a well informed endocrinologist to be testing at least every 3 months for LFT (liver function test), clotting (thrombophilia), androgens (free and bound testosterone), estrogens (as well as estrone). Other tests which are recommended are lipids, hsCRP, LH, FSH and prolactin. These are pretty basic pathology indicators for your health while on HRT and well understood. I may have missed a few too... If an endo isn't testing for all of these I would have to wonder why?

Second, some endocrinologists take a conservative approach because of their concerns with complications, especially clotting. However these risks are mainly associated with the older estrogens (ethinyl estrogen and conjugated estrogens). The newer estrogen synthetics (estradiol hemihydrate and estradiol valerate) are bio-identical and a lot safer. The latest study oh MtF HRT declared it to be safe (I can't post citations yet, but you should find it by googling "largest study to date: transgender hormone treatment safe"). By contrast one of the original studies on Premarin, a conjugated estrogen, was aborted part way through due to complications and deaths!

My last comment is that estrogen 17-beta itself is an androgen antagonist. There is arising evidence to suggest that for many people E will suppress T to female levels, but this is still relatively new thinking.

I think the moral of HRT is you need to be well informed, because the endocrinologists may vary wildly on approaches, conservatism, and how up-to-date their knowledge is.

Now you're on estradiol IM/subcutaneous you should see E levels improve a great deal. I agree with the 200-300 range for E, and your T should be in the low to mid female range.

Sami

Thanks for the advice!


  •  

Ashley3

Quote from: SamKelley on January 22, 2016, 06:57:56 PM
Oral estradiol passes through the intestinal tract and is first processed by the liver;
...
Oral estradiol can also increase the risk of blood clots in some people.
...
I think the moral of HRT is you need to be well informed, because the endocrinologists may vary wildly on approaches, conservatism, and how up-to-date their knowledge is.

I agree with the 200-300 range for E, and your T should be in the low to mid female range.

Really great points. My primary concern prior to starting HRT was the potential for negative side effects, especially clotting and it being too hard on the system (liver processing).

One thing I like about patches (which I personally no longer use but still appreciate) is I'd heard they were connected with lower probabilities of clotting. A great thing about both patches/injections, they bypass the liver. Despite the convenience of pills, I'm glad to not be taking that path. Actually, one injection, which I expect to get down to 5 or 10 minutes per week, is that it's once a week, not daily... so I guess pills may not be as convenient as they seem.

Thanks for your great overall info.
  • skype:Ashley3?call
  •  

KayXo

Quote from: SamKelley on January 22, 2016, 06:57:56 PM
Oral estradiol can also increase the risk of blood clots in some people.

I have only read one study that reports blood clots or DVT/pulmonary embolism from taking oral bio-identical estradiol and that was on VERY high or smaller doses given to women who had advanced breast cancer. I have never heard from any transsexual woman blood clot issues from taking estradiol orally. I'm not saying it can't increase risks but so far, the reports are practically absent which makes me think it's pretty safe. Please don't mix estradiol with other forms such as Premarin and ethinyl estradiol which HAVE shown to produce blood clots on many occasions.


QuoteI would expect a well informed endocrinologist to be testing at least every 3 months for LFT (liver function test), clotting (thrombophilia), androgens (free and bound testosterone), estrogens (as well as estrone). Other tests which are recommended are lipids, hsCRP, LH, FSH and prolactin. These are pretty basic pathology indicators for your health while on HRT and well understood. I may have missed a few too... If an endo isn't testing for all of these I would have to wonder why?

I personally disagree and not all endos/doctors test all these parameters. It depends on your HRT regimen, your personal health history, etc. It is important to understand how hormones affect body and the differences. Some values don't reveal much and are unnecessary. It's a case by case thing and all these things shouldn't always be measured, especially clotting, estrogens/androgens (you can tell physically and psychologically), LH/FSH, etc. Blood tests are expensive for some and the doctor should discern what is essential from what is not.

QuoteMy last comment is that estrogen 17-beta itself is an androgen antagonist. There is arising evidence to suggest that for many people E will suppress T to female levels, but this is still relatively new thinking.

Estrogen sends a negative feedback to the hypothalamus/pituitary gland, hence reducing their signals (LH/FSH) to produce testosterone and sperm. Enough E in the body, the body stops producing T/E. Enough T in the body, the body stops producing E/T. This is just how the body works and we have known this for quite some time, decades or even more. This is the thinking behind birth control pills which have existed since the mid-1900's and estradiol treatment in transsexuals during the first decades we started treating them.

Also, within cells, E has various effects on androgen sensitivity, metabolism, etc. This has been verified by studies.

Quote from: Kao3 on January 23, 2016, 05:40:38 AM
My primary concern prior to starting HRT was the potential for negative side effects, especially clotting and it being too hard on the system (liver processing).

These concerns stem from issues with older forms of estrogens that were not bio-identical. Estradiol itself has very rarely and never (to my knowledge) been shown to affect clotting and liver health, respectively. Search through articles and studies and I challenge you to find just one study where oral estradiol in humans caused liver problems. Clotting seems quite rare as well. So these concerns, in my opinion, are over exaggerated in the case of bio-identical estradiol. I've personally been prescribed by my doctor quite high dosages of oral estradiol throughout the years with not one single clotting or liver issue.
I am not a medical doctor, nor a scientist - opinions expressed by me on the subject of HRT are merely based on my own review of some of the scientific literature over the last decade or so, on anecdotal evidence from women in various discussion forums that I have come across, and my personal experience

On HRT since early 2004
Post-op since late 2005
  •  

SamKelley

Quote from: KayXo on January 23, 2016, 07:52:53 AM
I have only read one study that reports blood clots or DVT/pulmonary embolism from taking oral bio-identical estradiol and that was on VERY high or smaller doses given to women who had advanced breast cancer. I have never heard from any transsexual woman blood clot issues from taking estradiol orally.

In the most recent study I cited Largest Study to Date: Transgender Hormone Treatment Safe, they state "The primary serious side effect, venous thromboembolism, occurred in 1% of persons undergoing male-to-female (MTF) transgender transition and was due to estrogen treatment." However they don't seem to distinguish the comorbidity by transdermal / oral / parenteral which is unfortunate.

Quote from: KayXo on January 23, 2016, 07:52:53 AMPlease don't mix estradiol with other forms such as Premarin and ethinyl estradiol which HAVE shown to produce blood clots on many occasions.

I didn't - I specifically separated the different forms in my post.

Quote from: KayXo on January 23, 2016, 07:52:53 AM
I personally disagree and not all endos/doctors test all these parameters.

No, not all endocrinologists will test everything, and not all tests are of equal importance. However the tests I referred to are taken from the Endocrine Treatment of Transsexual Persons paper written by the Endocrine Society.

Quote from: KayXo on January 23, 2016, 07:52:53 AM
Estrogen sends a negative feedback to the hypothalamus/pituitary gland, hence reducing their signals (LH/FSH) to produce testosterone and sperm. Enough E in the body, the body stops producing T/E. Enough T in the body, the body stops producing E/T. This is just how the body works and we have known this for quite some time, decades or even more. This is the thinking behind birth control pills which have existed since the mid-1900's and estradiol treatment in transsexuals during the first decades we started treating them.

Yes however the currently recommended regimen for MTF hormone treatments is anti-androgen(s) plus estrogen. So the treatment you're referring to isn't actually used afaik. With ethinyl and conjugated estrogens it was too dangerous to get high enough estrogen levels to suppress T in most people - why anti-androgens were used.

I'm not sure if I'm not communicating properly or I've said something to annoy you :)

xox
Sami
  •  

KayXo

#24
Quote from: SamKelley on January 23, 2016, 09:52:47 AM
In the most recent study I cited Largest Study to Date: Transgender Hormone Treatment Safe, they state "The primary serious side effect, venous thromboembolism, occurred in 1% of persons undergoing male-to-female (MTF) transgender transition and was due to estrogen treatment." However they don't seem to distinguish the comorbidity by transdermal / oral / parenteral which is unfortunate.

Estrogen can also include not bio-identical such as Premarin and ethinyl estradiol. Cyproterone acetate is also known to increase this risk and if taken with estrogen, DVT cannot be attributed to one or the other as there is more than one factor involved. I'm reading the study as we speak. Will dig more deeply into it to try and find out if DVT was noted with oral bio-identical estradiol only. You have to be careful not to jump to conclusions too fast and read between the lines.

Quotethe tests I referred to are taken from the Endocrine Treatment of Transsexual Persons paper written by the Endocrine Society.

That doesn't mean they are necessarily right. I think it's important to always question and rely on science hen formulating recommendations. I find some of their assertions and guidelines don't always follow scientific findings.

QuoteYes however the currently recommended regimen for MTF hormone treatments is anti-androgen(s) plus estrogen. So the treatment you're referring to isn't actually used afaik. With ethinyl and conjugated estrogens it was too dangerous to get high enough estrogen levels to suppress T in most people - why anti-androgens were used.

But we aren't using ethinyl or conjugated estrogens any longer. Times have changed. :)

Please understand that I'm not aiming my comments directly at you but rather at these guidelines that need to be updated, elaborated on, based on more extensive science that is available as I've browsed through it so that transgendered patients can receive a better treatment.

I am not a medical doctor, nor a scientist - opinions expressed by me on the subject of HRT are merely based on my own review of some of the scientific literature over the last decade or so, on anecdotal evidence from women in various discussion forums that I have come across, and my personal experience

On HRT since early 2004
Post-op since late 2005
  •  

KayXo

#25
About this study, one interesting statement is this:

"Gooren et al. (2008), reported no increase in VTE among 2236 male-to-female (MTF) transgender individuals on HT from 1975 to 2006 compared with controls, with the exception of those who used ethinyl estradiol, for which there was a 6–8% incidence [4]."

This would confirm my earlier statement.

Also...

"Additionally, while Wierckx et al. (2013) observed 5% of 214 MTF individuals to have a VTE within the first three years of estrogen therapy, 10 out of 11 of these women had at least one VTE risk factor such as smoking, immobilization due to gender confirmation surgery, or a hypercoaguable disorder [5]."

HRT consisted of

- cyproterone acetate (n=2)
- oral EV + CPA (n=2)
- oral EV only (n=1)
- transdermal estradiol (n=3)
- ethinyl estradiol (n=1)
- conjugated equine estrogens (n=1)
- unknown (n=1)

So, 4 out of the 11 only took bio-identical estradiol and nothing else. But, out of those 11,

- 7 smoked
- 3 were immobilized due to surgery
- 1 had a clotting disorder

In reviewing all cases of DVT/pulmonary embolism and cardiovascular complications in this study, the first thing one notices is that smoking is quite prevalent, 14 of 19 being smokers or former smokers (n=1). 11 out of 19 ppl were 50 yrs of age or older. 6 out of 8 ppl with cardiovascular problems were 50 yrs of age or older.

The smoking frequency or presence/absence is not noted in the control groups so we have no way of knowing whether transsexual women smoked more, as much, or less than the control groups. This is unfortunate as this would have elucidated the role of HRT in the etiology of DVT/CVD more clearly.

One must not also ignore the fact that some transsexual women supplement by taking more estrogen illegally (self-medicating) after realizing that the doses prescribed are too low and aren't producing satisfactory results. The type of estrogen and dose may be adversely affecting their health. This not factored in so who knows? And are they reporting accurately and honestly what they are taking?

Cancer was also not more prevalent among transsexual women. Ten transpersons (9 women, 1 man) died. 6 because of suicide which seems quite prevalent among our population, sadly. 2 from CVD, 1 from cancer and 1 unknown.

They state in the discussion section

"The incidence of venous thrombosis and/or pulmonary embolism in this study (5.1%) was lower than that reported by Van Kesteren et al. (7), who showed that 6.4% of their sample experienced this during hormone treatment. The use of high-dose oral ethinyl estradiol (*μg OD) may explain the higher incidence in the latter study, as the type and route of administration of this estrogen are known to affect the coagulation system negatively (5, 17, 18). However, Ott et al. (19) did not observe any venous thrombosis and/or pulmonary embolism incidents during their follow-up study of 162 trans women (mean age 36 years) who received transdermal 17β-estradiol therapy for an average of 4.4 years. This may be a safer type of estrogen and route of administration, although 37% of the trans women who experienced venous thromboses in our sample received transdermal 17β-estradiol therapy. The older age of the participants and the longer follow-up period in the present study may also contribute to the higher incidence of these events."

How about maybe those women on transdermal having a venous thrombosis experienced this because of their smoking  (or immobilization due to surgery or genetic predisposition) or because they didn't reliably report what they really took as a result of supplementing outside or were assumed to follow protocol when they really didn't because they found the doses too conservative and not enough to produce results. These are all important factors to consider.

"the majority of trans women who experienced myocardial infarction or CVD were aged over 50 years, had one or more cardiovascular risk factors (mainly smoking), and had undergone cross-sex hormone therapy for a short duration."

"We discovered that both trans men and women had a higher prevalence of type 2 diabetes than the control men and women, with almost all diagnoses being made before starting hormone therapy in trans women."

In an earlier study by Wierckx
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22906135 (no control group)

of those transsexual women who had a thromboembolic event and cardiovascular problems (n=6), it is interesting to note that of those women

- 5 were smokers or former smokers with years of smoking ranging from 18-45.
- all but one (or two, the second not specifying which type of estrogen) were on estrogens that were NOT bio-identical AND cyproterone acetate (n=2)

It is also stated

"a quarter of the transsexual women had osteoporosis at the lumbar spine and radius."

which strongly suggests the estrogen doses prescribed were too low, increasing the likelihood that transsexual women supplement outside their protocol due to unsatisfactory results. Doctors don't realize they are harming their patients by underprescribing because for one, they are increasing health risks due to insufficient sex hormones in the body AND because they are giving women more incentive to source estrogen from outside sources which might increase risks. Underprescribing also increases likelihood that feminization will be less than optimal and that FFS will be resorted to, with all the risks associated with this type of surgery.

Furthermore, it is stated in the original study that

"Venous thrombosis events (VTE) were reported in MTF individuals as early as 1976, when a 29-year old transgender woman with no history or risk factors for VTE presented with pulmonary embolism after beginning estrogen therapy of diethylstilbestrol (DES) [7]. A 1978 paper also observed an occlusion of the middle cerebral artery during estrogen therapy in a transgender woman, where the patient was reported using mestranol, a 3-methyl ether of ethinyl estradiol [8]."

In both cases, the estrogen taken is not bio-identical.

"Wilson et al. (2009) also observed increases in inflammatory markers (cytokine IL-6, IL-1 and IL-8, clotting factors FV11 and FVIX and superoxide dismutase) consistent with this hypothesis for MTF individuals taking oral estrogen, but not for those taking transdermal estrogen [14]."

In this study, those taking oral estrogen were taking Premarin (moderate dose). NOT bio-identical estradiol.

On a positive note

"While some guidelines for transgender medical care express concerns for elevated cancer risk with certain hormone regimes, current data suggest that the risk of cancer may not rise."

"Although studies are small, overall cancer incidence in transgender men and transgender women to-date has not been found to be different than their respective male and female controls [5]. There are no reports of change in breast cancer specific risk among transgender individuals on estrogen compared to secular trends of male breast cancer incidence. Rates are lower relative to secular trends of female breast cancer rates."

"A comprehensive study among the medical records of 2306 orchidectomized MTF individuals reported an overall rare but possible incidence of prostate cancer of 0.04%"

"Additionally, there are ten case reports of breast cancer development among MTF individuals on estrogen since 1968"
This is VERY low.

"The three largest studies to date on mortality and transgender hormone therapy suggest no direct increased risk in mortality." Although suicide seems to be more prevalent among this population.

"Roberts et al. (2013) (n = 55) reported elevated median triglyceride levels of 120 mg/dL among MTF adults compared to both male (80 mg/dL median) and female (60 mg/dL median) control groups, with the range of participant values spanning from 34.2 to 242.6 mg/dL [46]. Cholesterol (LDL) levels among MTF individuals resembled female controls."

We don't have any information about their HRT.

"Roberts et al. (2013) reported that for MTF adults on estrogen therapy the values of hemoglobin and hematocrit were similar to female controls [48]."

"In Roberts et al, 2013 among MTF individuals, alkaline phosphatase, potassium and creatinine values resembled male controls [48]."

"Roberts et al. (2013) reported no difference in blood urea nitrogen values"

"Yahyaoui et al. (2008) found that fractional excreted of uric acids (FEUC) levels increased among 22 MTF individuals"

Of those 22, 18 took conjugated equine estrogens.

"Most studies on glycemic control in transgender individuals on HT report increased insulin resistance and fasting glucose."

Whether these are caused by cyproterone acetate, non bio-identical estradiol, smoking or bad eating habits in transsexual women, who knows? In all these studies, most women had been on estrogen that wasn't bio-identical.

"Studies with the greatest statistical power show increased rates of osteopenia in transgender women on HT, however these may be limited by including participants who used anti-androgens for one year before starting estrogen therapy."

What did I say about only taking anti-androgens? And underprescribing?

"There are reports of enlarged pituitary glands among MTF individuals on HT [60], as well as six case reports of prolactinoma [61], [62], [63] and [64]. Prolactin levels have also been reported to be elevated among MTF individuals during long-term HT [60]."

All these cases included estrogen that wasn't bio-identical and/or cyproterone acetate which both stimulate prolactin to a significant degree and abnormally. One case involved extremely HIGH doses of injectable estrogen, unheard of, combined with EE and CPA.

"There are two case reports of systemic lupus erythematosus occurring in MTF individuals with no prior history of autoimmunity deficits; one case presented with SLE 1 year after starting estrogen injections, and another after 20 years on HT [68] and [69]."

In the case of estrogen injections,

"He had been taking "hormone shots" to induce feminization for at least 1 year prior to admission. He was evasive about the injections, and declined to give information on how he acquired them, and the brand and formulation used. He had developed obvious feminine features, including a higher pitched voice and gynecomastia."

Vague information and researcher bias and ignorance as they call the woman a "he" and reported higher pitch due to HRT which cannot happen. LOL.

In the second case, where HT was taken for 20 yrs, the hormone was Premarin (moderate dose).

"Hypercoaguable risk factors, including the use of a thrombogenic estrogen, ethinyl estradiol, have been associated with many of the cases of reported VTE, and as such the risk of these adverse events may continue to decline as the usage of this drug diminishes [3]."

"The Standards of Care (SOC) released by the World Professional Association for Transgender Health (WPATH) report that the greatest risk factor of MTF HT to be VTE and increased triglycerides, which is supported by this literature review [70]."

VTE should be an non-issue if all TS women were given bio-identical estradiol (oral and non-oral), without exception. I think we would then find no difference between this population and the general population IF the factor of smoking is controlled for (same in both populations).

Triglycerides, I suspect, could be caused by cyproterone acetate as well as non bio-identical estrogen. If CPA was discontinued as a treatment and substituted instead with either a GnRh analogue or just estrogen, I think this would greatly improve things.

To conclude, this study does not really fully address health risks with bio-identical estradiol only, without CPA, without estrogens such as ethinyl estradiol and conjugated equine estrogens.

There are only four cases where VTE was associated with the use of bio-identical estradiol but other factors such as smoking, age, clotting predisposition and immobility were present and as such, we cannot conclude with certainty that bio-estradiol CAUSED VTE/DVT. There is also the issue of supplementation that cannot be verified.

Interestingly, there are two studies from Germany (1998 and 2005) where all except 2 out of 103 took bio-identical estradiol (orally and non-orally), where doses on average were not conservative, sometimes combined with cyproterone acetate or GrNh analogue. There was only one case of DVT due to a genetic predisposition (mutation) and one case where clotting factors were abnormal but we don't know what type of estrogen was used and if CPA was taken.

I intend to reread several times this study and other related studies to really get a clear picture of it all. :)




I am not a medical doctor, nor a scientist - opinions expressed by me on the subject of HRT are merely based on my own review of some of the scientific literature over the last decade or so, on anecdotal evidence from women in various discussion forums that I have come across, and my personal experience

On HRT since early 2004
Post-op since late 2005
  •  

KayXo

#26
...and lastly, I realized that...

smoking not only increases DVT to a greater extent when estrogen is taken orally, more so if the estrogen is NOT bio-identical BUT also interferes with its metabolization, decreasing concentrations of estrogen in the body which may be the reason why in some, not enough is circulating in the body, causing bone problems, other health issues related to not enough sex hormones in the body including mood disorders (i.e. suicide, probably affected more by other social factors) and causing some to supplement/self-medicate.

I suspect a few, at least, were smoking and taking oral estrogen at the same time.

But, OVERALL, in the big scheme of things, liver function was never adversely affected AND there was only one case where the use of oral bio-identical estradiol taken alone was associated with DVT. Since DVT was also associated with transdermal estrogen (3 cases), known not to affect coagulation, one can likely attribute this incidence not to estrogen but to some outside factor such as smoking, immobility, supplementation or genetic predisposition which is probably the case for oral bio-identical estradiol as well.

Individuals in this forum often express concern about the risk of liver damage and clotting when starting HRT (which almost always includes bio-identical estradiol these days) but this concern is not supported by the evidence. One should be more concerned about other factors like smoking, excess alcohol consumption and excess carbohydrate intake which affect much more significantly coagulation, liver and triglycerides. One should also be somewhat concerned about progestins such as medroxyprogesterone acetate, cyproterone acetate AND other medications they may be taking. Enough said. You make up your own mind. ;)
I am not a medical doctor, nor a scientist - opinions expressed by me on the subject of HRT are merely based on my own review of some of the scientific literature over the last decade or so, on anecdotal evidence from women in various discussion forums that I have come across, and my personal experience

On HRT since early 2004
Post-op since late 2005
  •  

SamKelley

KayXo I don't think we necessarily disagree with each other, however this is a complex topic and happy to continue this friendly argument in private :)  xox
  •  

SamKelley

Quote from: KayXo on January 23, 2016, 03:58:36 PM
But we aren't using ethinyl or conjugated estrogens any longer. Times have changed. :)

According to whom? I don't think this statement is true. I've spoken to several people who are using conjugated estrogens. Also both conjugated estrogens and ethinyl estradiol are still manufactured and for sale, implying there is market demand.
  •  

KayXo

It is extremely rare these days to see transwomen use conjugated equine estrogens or ethinyl estradiol. Doctors, for the most part, have finally understood the risks involved. But, ciswomen are still prescribed birth control pills containing EE and menopausal women, to a greater degree, conjugated equine estrogens and Provera although doctors are also slowing changing their ways in that respect due to recent studies and more informed patients requesting bio-identical homones. It may also be the case that in less developed countries, where people are poorer and riskier estrogens are cheaper that they are more in demand and used more frequently coupled with the fact that there is less knowledge about their risks.

We can continue this friendly discussion in private, I agree. :)

I am not a medical doctor, nor a scientist - opinions expressed by me on the subject of HRT are merely based on my own review of some of the scientific literature over the last decade or so, on anecdotal evidence from women in various discussion forums that I have come across, and my personal experience

On HRT since early 2004
Post-op since late 2005
  •  

Ashey

I don't think anybody has really pointed this out but your T-levels are actually very low, so there is that. E is on the low side though. I can only speak on the (cis) female reference ranges provided by the lab I use, but here are the averages I calculated:

Averaged Estrogen Reference Range Across Menstrual Phases
High: 291 pg/mL
Mid: 169.5 pg/mL
Low: 47.3 pg/mL

Also worth noting, the extreme low in the reference ranges was 12.5 pg/ml in the follicular phase, and the extreme high was 498 pg/ml in the ovulation phase.
  •  

KayXo

To quickly come back to that earlier study (Wierckx et al. (2013)) where DVT/PE (deep vein thrombosis/pulmonary embolism) was observed in 11 cases and cardiovascular complications in 8 cases, where most were on bio-identical estradiol,

it is noteworthy to mention that the group of transsexual women differed in some important respects from the control group which makes this study much less reliable and could account for the increased prevalence of thrombosis and cardiovascular events

- Before the start of HRT, there were already more transsexual women who had had DVT/PE (9/1,000) vs. the control groups (0/1,000). Hence, TS women were already more at risk compared to other groups.
- Before the start of HRT, there were already more transsexual women who had Type 2 Diabetes (37.3/1,000) vs. the control groups (between 6.2 and 14.9/1,000). Diabetes is a risk factor for cardiovascular complications and DVT/PE.
- As mentioned before, smoking prevalence was high in those who had complications and smoking habits were not compared between the group of transsexual women and control groups, which is a factor that is lacking in this study.
- TS women were less employed than control groups, less often in relationships and poorer which could account for higher stress levels on top of their situation as transwomen, which as we all know, stresss increases the likelihood of cardiac events.

So, to summarize, in this study, the TS population is more diabetic, more DVT/PE prone, perhaps bigger smokers (we don't know), more stressed and less fortunate psychosocially than our control population to begin with, even before the start of HRT. Can we really attribute later complications to HRT when those groups differ in so many other respects? The answer is a clear no.

This is why it is so important to read studies fully, look at details so that when the time comes when authorities tell us certain things, we can more intelligently and critically assess what they are saying. We don't just blindly accept their assertions.

I plan to write to the researcher and explain to them the flaws I found with this study. :)


I am not a medical doctor, nor a scientist - opinions expressed by me on the subject of HRT are merely based on my own review of some of the scientific literature over the last decade or so, on anecdotal evidence from women in various discussion forums that I have come across, and my personal experience

On HRT since early 2004
Post-op since late 2005
  •  

Saki

Quote from: Ashey on January 24, 2016, 04:55:58 AM
I don't think anybody has really pointed this out but your T-levels are actually very low, so there is that. E is on the low side though. I can only speak on the (cis) female reference ranges provided by the lab I use, but here are the averages I calculated:

Averaged Estrogen Reference Range Across Menstrual Phases
High: 291 pg/mL
Mid: 169.5 pg/mL
Low: 47.3 pg/mL

Also worth noting, the extreme low in the reference ranges was 12.5 pg/ml in the follicular phase, and the extreme high was 498 pg/ml in the ovulation phase.

So I should be higher? I'm taking E pills and spiro. I have already increased the dosage and it only affected me a little.


  •  

Ashey

Quote from: Saki on January 24, 2016, 11:33:53 AM
So I should be higher? I'm taking E pills and spiro. I have already increased the dosage and it only affected me a little.

Well, your T-levels are fine, but your E should definitely be higher. So I would talk to your doctor about that.
  •  

Saki

Quote from: Ashey on January 24, 2016, 03:07:35 PM
Well, your T-levels are fine, but your E should definitely be higher. So I would talk to your doctor about that.

I kinda did but they wanted to up the dosage again. I told them I wanted injections but nope. This is how the VA treats transgender veterans. Hey at least its free for me.


  •