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Unsure how to respond

Started by WaterGirl, January 26, 2016, 01:26:39 PM

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SueNZ

Quote from: WaterGirl on January 26, 2016, 05:42:55 PM
As always, thank all you wonderful women for your insight, empathy, advice, and knowledge.  I am most grateful for the responses, and they helped me clarify my thoughts and send the following response:

Gallations 3:28
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."



I have a question for you, and want your thoughts on something.  You know I was raised in the church, believe in God wholeheartedly and I'm wondering how He fits into your being transgender?
He doesn't "fit in to my being trans."  ​ ​I struggle to understand how me being trans is part of His plan, but it is.  I know His love is unfathomable, unconditional, and all-embracing. ​I doubt God sees gender​ at all, since it is merely a social construct.
If our society were one in which the outward appearances betwixt the two ​sexes was the same, would being trans be any big deal?

God gave us our bodies, ​And our brains. ​He chose them for us for a reason.  Do you think He made a mistake?
I don't. Do you think viruses, or cancer, or birth defects are His mistakes?​ ​  ​
Do you really believe He wanted you to be a woman?
​I know he wants me to be honest.​ ​​
I am struggling because I don't think He did make a mistake.  He meant for you to be a man ​Really? How do you know? ​as He meant for me to be a woman and to marry a man and procreate in His image.
Which we did​.
How does that fit in with your feelings of TG?  ​Unfortunate. ​I wonder if you're denying Him His chosen path for you?​I feel quite the contrary, I have finally admitted that I must explore something that has always been a fundamental part of me, something that I have denied, but is as present as the nose on my face. ​  You were meant to play that fiddle, would you be willing to give that up to be a woman? ​Why would I have to give up music? ​ The son He gave us has a path too...do you feel you're being transgender would alter Wyatt being the man he needs to be for God
If anything, for the better.  He won't grow up with ignorance and negative stereotypes​. 
...for his future wife and children?​ I have no idea how my being trans has anything to do with Wyatt's wife and children.​

Again, thank you all!
Katie
Katie,
I think your response was awesome. You have not been confrontational and at no time have you belittled her.
Our Lives are defined by what we do not who we are.
Cheers
Sue
Treat life's difficult times as if they are normal moments, this makes the normal and special ones even more fantastic.
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Stevi

WaterGirl,

Just an acknowledgement of your PM.  Thank you.  (I do not have PM Sending privileges)

Stephanie
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Stevi

DenaliBe,

Thank you for the accurate amplification of my thoughts.

Stephanie
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Qrachel

Dear Watergirl:

Hi:

Full Disclosure:  I am not a religious person and do not recognize any deity, though there is much about life I don't understand and I have to deal with that daily, moment to moment. 

You have raised a truly great and perplexing question that our community all to often is asked to answer: Are you as a creation of life a mistake?  I'm going to respond with a bit rigor here, because I'm loath to entertain emotional pleadings of one sort or another that have little or no basis in fact.

Here's a true fact: There's absolutely no evidence that you or anyone else's creation was a mistake and we don't need to invoke god to have the discussion.  Rather, you and all of the life are created via a set processes and inputs that occur having a certain level of repeatability and uncertainty.  It is intellectually and morally abhorrent to assign correctness or mistakenness to the natural process of procreation in this context.  It's far more honest to accept that some procreation outcomes occur more often than others and each outcome brings with it a set of unique circumstances even given the law of large numbers.  Humanity has written volumes on this subject and yet we still struggle to separate fact from belief.

So it seems as a species we are not well suited to handle uncertainty, and thus, we have created many belief systems and explanation's to account for our discomfort from uncertainty.  One aspect of these attempts to deal with uncertainty has been to give us a belief system that incorporates the existence of a supreme, omnipotent being.  This particular aspect of the human beliefs typically involves surrendering critical thinking at some point in order to create a perceived order to our lives and purposes therein that currently escapes our abilities to reason and know.  This surrender is often referred to as faith, and much of life and its creating seems to occur without any untoward consequences because of these beliefs.  All in all, faith serves us well enough until of course it doesn't, and even just a quick review of history will verify that.

It is not surprising then that whenever a set of circumstances occurs out of the inherent uncertainty and lack of knowledge associated with creation and life itself, e.g. being a transgender person, many try to justify the veracity of their belief system with questions, answers and actions that aren't grounded in fact, rather in faith.  This occurs for two fundamental reasons: 1) Attempting to maintain the belief system, and/or 2) Attempting to leverage the dissonance that the belief system is confronted with for some ulterior outcome.  In either case it would be easy to make these people wrong, but I look in the mirror too often to seriously entertain that thought.

I deeply respect any and all people who hold religious and spiritual beliefs, even envy them at times; however, when a discussion such as the one here is viewed from the perspective noted above, then dealing with the uncertainties of creation and life become far more manageable . . . or at the least understandable, including the necessity to accept that sometimes we just don't know and aren't going to ever know.  If this frightens and/or angers you, I am deeply sorry and offer hope and freedom from them by following a path of living that is largely based upon critical thinking, which doesn't require you to give up religion or faith.  To the extent you embrace them try to understand where the line is drawn that you have to suspend critical thinking.

Fortunately, in your case we do know, and what we know leaves no doubt for the veracity and existence of you as a person that is whole and complete.  You may stretch the current social boundaries here and there of society, but without a doubt the reality in time and space is that you are as you are and not a mistake.  Any discussion that your creation was a mistake or some untoward physical or mental happenstance is pure balderdash.  There is simply no credible evidence whatsoever that you as a trans-person are less than in some way or another, i.e. in a way that each and everyone of us aren't also subject to as a result of being a created through a series of a processes and inputs with a built in degree of uncertainty.

BOTTOM LINE: You are not a mistake.  You are, however, a unique individual with a rare set of characteristics that makes you a unique and profoundly interesting creation.  I say that also makes you beautiful, but then I'm just as committed to my beliefs as everyone else - what counts is what you think.

What you and society does about this is largely in your hands to judge, embrace and share as suits your desires, the results of which await your hand to guide your life to its fullest and most beautiful existence.  Therefore, it seems ridiculous to suggest that the grandeur and complexity of who and what you are should be otherwise assigned the misleading and debilitating context of mistake, either by association or through your own self-degradation.

My dearest fellow human being and friend, you are everything you can be and in so doing become more precious and desirable.

Peace,

Rachel
Rachel

"Courage doesn't always roar. Sometimes courage is the little voice at the end of the day that says I'll try again tomorrow."
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Mavis

Everyone tries to use god as a reason for condemning others who do not fit within their ideal image of the world. I really feel bad for these people as the day they must face god and answer for using his name to spread hate and fear will not be a good one.

If what they believe in was true then why would god want people to suffer their entire lives? These people have an answer for that as well, to be happy is to be selfish and that is against gods will. RUBBISH!

I have been told that because I am married with children that to transition is trading my happiness for my wifes happiness and that I should remember my vows, not transition, continue to live a life of misery so my spouse can be happy.

I feel strongly against this in that it is complete b.s. these people feel that I should never be allowed to be happy for the sake of someone elses happiness. I take issue with it because I do not want to trade my happiness for hers but they feel I should trade mine for hers. If she can find happiness staying with me that would be amazing, but if she needs to find her happiness elsewhere then she is free to do so.

In argument I used my moms 20 year marriage as an example, my step father was happy but my mother was not. Does that mean my mom should have remained unhappily ever after?

So I googled and was presented with a wealth of biblical rationalizations of why a spouse should suffer through unhappiness to give their spouse happiness because it is gods will.

I know this isn't gods will, again people like to use the name to justify their own weird sense of being, but if it truly was gods will, I for one will gladly look them in the face on my day of judgment and say go f yourself.
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Deborah

#25
Spouses wouldn't be suffering through this anyway if the idiotic Churches accepted the reality of this and didn't convince so many of us that Jesus would cure it and we would live normal married lives.  Jesus does not cure it and that lie is why so many don't accept their situation and do something about it before they have spouses that have to suffer for it.  I lay responsibility for all that spousal suffering right on who it belongs, on the Church.


Sapere Aude
Love is not obedience, conformity, or submission. It is a counterfeit love that is contingent upon authority, punishment, or reward. True love is respect and admiration, compassion and kindness, freely given by a healthy, unafraid human being....  - Dan Barker

U.S. Army Retired
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