Caitlyn Jenner's politics spark debate in transgender ranks

[Devlyn]

I must be the only one looking at the Ted Cruz thing as satire? A challenge to Cruz to stop the discriminatory rhetoric? I mean, she mentioned a position that is entirely fictional.

Hugs, Devlyn

[AnonyMs]

I have an unusual take on this.

I don't think the problem is Ms. Jenner's politics. I strongly disagree with them, but she's a citizen and is permitted/obligated to make up her own mind.

I think the problem is that the rest of us care so much about what one transwoman thinks.

As usual I pretty much agree with this.

I won't say I strongly disagree since I'm not really sure what her views are, but from the little I've read I think I'd disagree. But so what, she's welcome to disagree with me if she cares to.

[Eevee]

I must be the only one looking at the Ted Cruz thing as satire? A challenge to Cruz to stop the discriminatory rhetoric? I mean, she mentioned a position that is entirely fictional.

Hugs, Devlyn

I highly doubt this since she flat-out said she likes Ted Cruz and she is firmly Republican. She may disagree with his religious ideals, but she supports him politically. She's also just not known to make satirical claims. It's a bit of a stretch to say that it was satire at all since there's nothing to support that idea.

Again, she can support anyone she wants, but she's going far beyond that by claiming to be an "ambassador".

[Jenna Marie]

Devlyn, I suppose it's possible. I agree with Eevee that she is a conservative Republican who supports Cruz and has not previously been prone to satire, but nobody but her knows what's in her head.

I stand by my statement that I wish she hadn't said that, though. Even if it IS satire, I wish she hadn't, because it's clearly muddying the waters.

[Devlyn]

I believe she is just poking him. Just my opinion.

Hugs, Devlyn

[stephaniec]

I think part of the solution to all this craziness is for all the Munchkins to come out of hiding like after Dorothy came out of her house after killing the witch. Make your voice count and don't let others speak for you without affirming their authority to speak for you.

[stephaniec]

How Caitlyn Jenner Went From Icon to Outcast

http://www.thewrap.com/how-caitlyn-jenner-went-from-icon-to-outcast/

The Wrap/TV | By Itay Hod on March 11, 2016 @ 2:42 pm

""Someone needs to tell Ms. Jenner she's transgender," activist Zoey Tur tells TheWrap"

[diane 2606]

...I can see that the whole reason all of our countries are in unsustainable debt is because of the cost of the welfare state.

Actually the cost of your so-called welfare state is significantly less than the cost of handouts, in the form of tax breaks to individuals and corporations who don't need them. And let's not forget Military procurement for weapon systems that are unnecessary since the Cold War ended 27 years ago. By being Republican, Caitlin Jenner supports sending your tax dollars to those who are gorging themselves at the public trough.

I've come to appreciate how "big government" isn't so great for everyone.

Big government? Essential services are now controlled by price-gouging corporations. There are regulatory agencies for industries that really do need to be regulated, but congress won't fund them. And what about public infrastructure projects that congress won't fund—employment  would increase, which would lead to a stronger economy and a more secure country? By being Republican, Caitlin Jenner supports price gouging for essential services, deregulation of industries whose by-products are a major cause of climate change, and denies repair/rebuilding of crumbling roads and bridges and the power grid.

Caitlin should stick to her fun little bus trip with people who should know better than to participate.

[Tysilio]

...I can see that the whole reason all of our countries are in unsustainable debt is because of the cost of the welfare state.

Actually the cost of your so-called welfare state is significantly less than the cost of handouts, in the form of tax breaks to individuals and corporations who don't need them. And let's not forget Military procurement for weapon systems that are unnecessary since the Cold War ended 27 years ago. By being Republican, Caitlin Jenner supports sending your tax dollars to those who are gorging themselves at the public trough.

Just so. In fact, if you look at total national debt as a percentage of gross domestic product (GDP), it's far higher in the US than in countries we think of as "welfare states." To use just a few examples, the Scandinavian countries, which are usually touted as among the most "socialist," have much less national debt than the US:

Total government debt as % of GDP, 2014
   
Norway    30%
Sweden    41% 
Denmark  45%
Finland     57%
US         106%

So it seems that it's not those pesky social programs that are causing the problem. (That's if one accepts that it IS a problem; many reputable economists argue that it's not.)

In the US, there are two main contributing factors: absurdly bloated military spending (this currently accounts for about 57% of the US' discretionary spending), and the endless tax cuts bestowed on corporations and on the rich since Ronald Reagan became President.

So, yes, Ms. Jenner would do well to move her head out to somewhere better lit and try to learn about the real world, instead of spouting clichés she's picked up from Fox News and her capitalist friends.

[Deborah]

I need to object to one point above and that is the one on military spending.  Yes, there is waste but that waste is not the primary driver.  Three other things are.

The first is the demand by particularly politicians, but also the American public, that we intervene everywhere in the world for nearly any reason.  Maintaining a force that can do this is expensive mainly because we live an ocean away from everyone else and have to have systems that can be moved quickly and in large numbers.  It also requires a force large enough to do the task and then to sustain the task. 

The second, and this is a big one, is the American aversion to American Soldiers being killed.  So we spend a lot of money on developing systems with which they can fight and not die.  This includes continually improving weapons systems to maintain overmatch, continually improving vehicle and personal protection systems to protect against changing threats, and training a lot.

The third is the American insistence on an all volunteer military and no draft.  That too costs a lot of money in pay and benefits.  Soldiers are patriotic and do like what their doing.  But those two things will not maintain an all volunteer military when people still have pay to eat and take care of their families.  Attracting and retaining good people in sufficient numbers costs a lot of money.  Of course being a large nation we could get sufficient numbers cheaply with a draft but long term quality would decline and the American people would object very strongly.

The only way to make a significant reduction in military spending is to make a significant change to our foreign policy and maintain a much smaller and differently composed force that stays close to home.  Changing foreign policy is not the purview of anyone at all in the military.  That responsibility belongs to the people themselves and those they elect.

Or we can get used to just sending Soldiers all over the place with inferior equipment and training so they start dying in large numbers again like they did in earlier wars.

Blast away on my statements if you want but I do this for a living and do have some idea of what I'm talking about.  Plus the ones that have to die or get maimed I work with and see every day.  So I do feel very strongly on the subject.


Sapere Aude

[itsApril]

Can you show us where you think you found that information? Because Caitlyn has specifically said she isn't a spokesperson for the transgender community: http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/caitlyn-jenner-i-am-cait-season-2-politics-republican-1201680517/

While you have a right to choose who represents you, you have no right to misrepresent others.

Hugs, Devlyn

Well, how about here:

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/caitlyn-jenner-ted-cruz-trans-ambassador/

"In fact, Jenner said she'd like to play a role in Cruz's administration should he get elected. "Wouldn't it be great -- let's say he goes on to be president, and I have all my girls on a trans issues board to advise him on making decisions when it comes to trans issues. Isn't that a good idea?" Jenner said. "Trans ambassador to the president of the United States, so we can say, 'Ted, love what you're doing but here's what's going on.'"

Really, this is what she thinks.  No fooling!

[Zumbagirl]

Caitlyn Jenner's politics spark debate in transgender ranks

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_TRANSGENDER_POLITICS_CAOL-?SITE=CAANG&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Hosted/By DAVID CRARY AP National Writer   03/11/2016

"NEW YORK (AP) -- Since coming out a year ago, Caitlyn Jenner has not always been a unifying force in the transgender community. Her latest political remarks - underscoring her conservative outlook and praising Republican presidential candidate Ted Cruz - ignited a storm of criticism from supporters of transgender rights, who view most conservative Republicans as adversaries."

A trans person who isn't a liberal democrat. Wow, someone call the cops. Why can't Caitlyn have a mind of her own and make up her own mind and decide for herself. You think there's no such thing as non-liberal LGBT people? How about the log cabin republicans or the pink pistols a group of LGBT gun owners many of whom are staunch libertarians. One of the original founders of pink pistols is a transwoman by the way. My own brother is a married gay man who is 100% behind Donald Trump, both he and his husband. I mean big time. A lot of LGBT people have been having an epiphany about liberal democrats and the support is being chipped away while liberals who at one time were the party of civil rights have now evolved into the party of anti-civil rights.

[Adchop]

As an outsider I find it curious that republicans manage to market themselves as the  hands off option for government where people manage their own issues, whilst being the main driver behind limitations on civil liberties, restrictions on gay rights and regulations on who can pee in which bathroom.  It definitely seems like the opposite is true.

I think that's the issue that republicans are going to have to face & change if they intend to move forward as a party. If they really believe in limited government, then having the government dictate which individual can marry another is definitely big government intrusion on the rights of individuals.

The smartest move the republicans could have made was a push for all marriages to labeled civil unions by the government. That way it would strictly be left to the different branches of Christianity to determine what marriages are sanctified by God, without the government having to decide that.

[Tysilio]

Deborah, I wouldn't dream of blasting you for that post. I agree 100% with everything you said, and, yes, the answer is that we have to rethink our entire approach to foreign policy.

When I wrote "bloated," I didn't mean "waste." I meant exactly what you just articulated so perfectly: the whole thing is wrongheaded in every possible way.

Actually, bringing back the draft might not be such a bad idea; what we have now is essentially an economic draft, in which the military is the employer of last resort for a lot of young people, especially minority and working class youth. (And how outrageous is it that 25% of military families depend on food pantries and other charities for basic needs, according to this NBC report?)

If we had compulsory military (or other social) service, it would mean that the upper classes, including the political class, would have their kids' skin in the game...  perhaps that might make them think twice about perpetual war.

[/thread hijack] 

[Deborah]

Deborah, I wouldn't dream of blasting you for that post.

i didn't take any offense.  . There would be one consequence if we brought back the draft and that is that quality would decline.  It's not that regular citizens would be poor Soldiers but rather that most wouldn't stay in any longer than they had to.  With today's complexities it takes a long time to train people to the standards that we have been accustomed to since around the mid 1980s.  For that reason alone even the military does not want a draft.  Another factor is that the physical fitness of average draft age Americans has reached such an abysmally low level that the vast majority do not today possess the physical attributes to even start basic training.  Fixing that with people who have absolutely no fitness is beyond what the military can do in several months of basic training.  It's something that in previous times was developed over years of outdoor play and physical education classes in school.

[Tysilio]

Good point.

[stephaniec]

the draft is essential in time of all out war. The problem is that it isn't fair. the rich get exemptions or get sweet deals. The congressional sons get to go into the officers ranks. You do end up with the poor fighting in  the front lines. Abrahams Lincoln's  son was given sweet duty away from the front lines. War is nothing , but hell. If you chose to fight for honor or nation that's great. You don't chose to be in  the draft. Honestly there hasn't been a draft because of the Viet Nam insanity. Go ahead congress put a draft into effect without  world war 3 and see what happens , We don't need children dying because some moron in congress decides to play with the lives of the innocent . Go ahead sweet government and see exactly what will happen if you implement  a draft for foolishness .

[Adchop]

I must be the only one looking at the Ted Cruz thing as satire? A challenge to Cruz to stop the discriminatory rhetoric? I mean, she mentioned a position that is entirely fictional.

Hugs, Devlyn

I was a bit confused as well. In terms of moderate to extreme, Cruz is much farther on the extreme side of the conservatism spectrum. Kasich would classify as the most moderate, so I'm not sure why she wouldn't show her support for him.

[michelle]

Hey,  I am just waiting for Ted Cruz to ask Caitlyn to waltz or do the tango at some big Republican shindig.   Or the way Donald Trump goes through wives she will become Donald's fifth wife, and God forbid, someday First Lady of the United States.   I know, I know they will be ice skating in Hell when that happens,  but a girl can only dream.

Caitlyn has the right to be who she is.   Transitioning doesn't change your politics or even your lifestyle.  Think about it when she was butch and Bruce the Stud how she pruned and preened her public image,  now Caitlyn the diva is not much different.

The only time in pictures she let herself image was in one picture I saw from the Kardashians when she looked depressed probably because she was not carrying on like one of the other women.

I think that she if running point into the valley of the bigots and we will see if like Sarah Palin she becomes the Vice-Presidential candidate for her favorite Ted Cruz, or not (Ice skating in Hell).

We trans people spend too much of our lives in little boxes of public expectations before we come out and transition.  I don't think we should be building little boxes of expectations for other trans people once they go public.  Nor should we build a little box of expectations for ourselves.

Just thoughts from an aging trans granny.

[Adchop]

Actually the cost of your so-called welfare state is significantly less than the cost of handouts, in the form of tax breaks to individuals and corporations who don't need them. And let's not forget Military procurement for weapon systems that are unnecessary since the Cold War ended 27 years ago. By being Republican, Caitlin Jenner supports sending your tax dollars to those who are gorging themselves at the public trough.

Big government? Essential services are now controlled by price-gouging corporations. There are regulatory agencies for industries that really do need to be regulated, but congress won't fund them. And what about public infrastructure projects that congress won't fund—employment  would increase, which would lead to a stronger economy and a more secure country? By being Republican, Caitlin Jenner supports price gouging for essential services, deregulation of industries whose by-products are a major cause of climate change, and denies repair/rebuilding of crumbling roads and bridges and the power grid.

Caitlin should stick to her fun little bus trip with people who should know better than to participate.

That's the frustrating part about the republican party. They claim to be fiscal conservatives, but they spend like a drunken sailor after getting elected. The defense budget doesn't need to be expanded, & if it does the debt they claim to want to lower will skyrocket.