Caitlyn Jenner's politics spark debate in transgender ranks

[stephaniec]

Caitlyn Jenner's politics spark debate in transgender ranks

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_TRANSGENDER_POLITICS_CAOL-?SITE=CAANG&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Hosted/By DAVID CRARY AP National Writer   03/11/2016

"NEW YORK (AP) -- Since coming out a year ago, Caitlyn Jenner has not always been a unifying force in the transgender community. Her latest political remarks - underscoring her conservative outlook and praising Republican presidential candidate Ted Cruz - ignited a storm of criticism from supporters of transgender rights, who view most conservative Republicans as adversaries."

[suzifrommd]

I have an unusual take on this.

I don't think the problem is Ms. Jenner's politics. I strongly disagree with them, but she's a citizen and is permitted/obligated to make up her own mind.

I think the problem is that the rest of us care so much about what one transwoman thinks.

[kira21 ♡♡♡]

As an outsider I find it curious that republicans manage to market themselves as the  hands off option for government where people manage their own issues, whilst being the main driver behind limitations on civil liberties, restrictions on gay rights and regulations on who can pee in which bathroom.  It definitely seems like the opposite is true.

[Deborah]

The ironic thing about this is that she said she won't support the Democrats because Hillary is a liar.  While I think there is substance to that charge I don't understand how throwing your support to another who has serious integrity issues of his own is a legitimate decision.

If she was really concerned about honesty she would see that the sole candidate right now that appears to possess that attribute is Bernie Sanders.  Her lack of support for him tells me then that honesty really isn't at the root of her position.  It's just an excuse.

From my own perspective, viewing conservative republicans as adversaries seems like a pretty logical conclusion.  When a group says they want to kill you it's not a bad idea to take them at their word.


Sapere Aude

[Dee Marshall]

From my own perspective, viewing conservative republicans as adversaries seems like a pretty logical conclusion.  When a group says they want to kill you it's not a bad idea to take them at their word.

This, absolutely! If the only other party was absolutely abhorrent to me this argument would sway me. Luckily I agree enough with the Democrats and their track record that I don't have to make that Devil's Bargain.

And no, before this election cycle I was not a Democrat. I was a small "l" libertarian and an independent. I started to doubt the Republicans when McCain picked Palin for a running mate.

[SophieD]

I think the problem is that the rest of us care so much about what one transwoman thinks.

I'm not sure how many of us really care about what she thinks.  Celebrities are famous for being famous, not necessarily because of the value of their insight. 

[Dayta]

I find it curious that republicans manage to market themselves as the  hands off option for government where people manage their own issues, whilst being the main driver behind limitations on civil liberties, restrictions on gay rights and regulations on who can pee in which bathroom.  It definitely seems like the opposite is true.

I believe that this is an indication of the somewhat uneasy coalition that was formed between the small-government libertarians and the fundamentalist Christians, initially by Nixon and then built further by Reagan.  The most recent manifestation of this is the Trump phenomenon, where the leadership of the Republican Party had found itself significantly off-target with their base and unable to influence the selection of a presidential candidate.  I wonder whether the "small 'l' libertarians" in the party wouldn't align better with the moderate Democrats (e.g. Hillary Clinton) if we all weren't so invested in maintaining a two-party system.  We may yet see some transformation in the Republican party, especially if they end up losing in November. 

I think the problem is that the rest of us care so much about what one transwoman thinks.

It makes me wonder who is deciding to report Caitlin's opinions in the first place.  Note the way Al Sharpton is often quoted or depicted on the news to speak for issues affecting the black community, despite his not holding any office or position, elected or not.  He is derided by many in white America, and some think he is granted his platform to speak simply BECAUSE he a divisive figure in that sense.  Perhaps Caitlin's "sponsorship" by the media is influenced by the fact that she will NOT promote the best interests of the transgender community.  I know it sounds like a conspiracy theory, but something to think about anyway. 

[Stevie]

  Perhaps Caitlin's "sponsorship" by the media is influenced by the fact that she will NOT promote the best interests of the transgender community.  I know it sounds like a conspiracy theory, but something to think about anyway.

Caitlyn is promoting her own interests. If they are at odds with what would be best for society is not her concern, its about her bottom line.

[Jenna Marie]

I don't especially care what she thinks, personally... but I do wish she'd stop saying things like she's a "transgender ambassador" and a spokesperson for the trans community. Basically, she's entitled to her own opinions, but I admit it does annoy me when she presents herself as speaking FOR me. (Because I admit I do tend to disagree!)

[BeverlyAnn]

Caitlyn Jenner is worth somewhere around one hundred million dollars and lives in a mansion on top of a hill.  Of course she's going to be a Republican, it's in her own self interest and, let's admit it, almost all of us act in our own self interest.  Of course she has no concept of what it's like to be a homeless trans person who has to resort to sex work to live.  Or a trans person who is working but scrimping to save pennies toward surgeries.  But she does have the right to choose her political party, to support whoever she wants and say she supports them.  Yes, it sets my teeth on edge when I hear her say the stupid things she's said but, as before, she has a right to say them.  I hope Jenny, Kate, Candis, et. al. can talk some sense into her but I doubt it. 

"I don't agree with what you said, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

[Dayta]

Of course she's going to be a Republican, it's in her own self interest

I hear her talking a lot about how great friends she is with Ted Cruz, but I haven't heard Ted reciprocating.  In fact, I suspect that should she ever come up in an interview with Ted, she'd not get the same treatment.  Not that I'm wishing it on her, I do wish her the best.  But she's certainly very lucky not to have to face many of the challenges that many others do. 

[Deborah]

That's the problem as I see it.  It's not that she's misguided nor is it that she doesn't have the right to support whoever she chooses.  It's that she simply appears to be completely oblivious to life in the real world.

Even if Ted Cruz were her good friend he would never admit it.  His supporters wouldn't stand for it.


Sapere Aude

[Kylo]

Not sure about her and the details of her political affinities, but it's a problem that a person might support certain views or courses of action typically thought of as conservative or republican but the only way to support that would be to support the republican parties and candidates and then be lumped with them. Either that or run for President yourself and good luck with that. I suppose Jenner has enough money she could actually attempt that, lol.

I mean I don't not support a welfare state for example but I can see that the whole reason all of our countries are in unsustainable debt is because of the cost of the welfare state. Something has to be done about that, but how can anything be done without supporting the people who actually want to do something about it, i.e. the conservatives or republicans? The finer details of political problems and how to solve them get lost in this political tribalism. I'm not a conservative myself but I do appreciate some of the preservatory measures some of them want implemented and I've come to appreciate how "big government" isn't so great for everyone. I have friends and family who think public money is endless, don't care where it comes from or for how long. It's that kinda attitude that's gonna bring us all a lot of pain.

Now I don't even call myself a conservative but I know what countries really need to reduce the bloatedness of the state and the debt and get back to running countries that can actually pay their bills, and conservatives typically have an outlook closer in line with this view than socialist parties. This isn't going to turn me into a conservative but it is a problem - how the hell can I vote for what I want, for what's best for my country since all the choice there is is one extreme or another - people who want to spend even more money we don't have to woo voters, or people who don't give a crap about the poor. If I actually wanted to FIX any of that problem, I'd probably be lumped in with the conservatives, and then be criticized for that because they're the kinda people who'd want my sort denied surgery or recognition.

It's a mess.

[Eevee]

I think the problem for me is that she represents me in the public eye whether I want her to or not. Anything a celebrity like her does reflects on me because of the state of this country, and she is making me look bad to anyone who doesn't know me yet. Normally I wouldn't care what she did. Unfortunately all eyes are on her instead of the number of other transgender celebrities who do represent me better, like Laverne Cox.

[Tysilio]

I hope Jenny, Kate, Candis, et. al. can talk some sense into her but I doubt it. 

And so do they. Jenny Boylan has a recent blog entry on this subject that's worth reading. Her major point is that if the best we can do is to learn to listen to each other, that could go a long way.

I'd add that bringing compassion to such conversations would also go a long way. I watched S2E1 of IAC, and what I saw in Ms. Jenner was terror, intense fear of having her worldview challenged. There's no doubt that she's rich, shallow, and clueless, but she's gone through some very big changes in a short time. It doesn't surprise me that she'd cling to what she thinks she knows, and I do feel some compassion for her in that regard.

That said, I also wish she'd bloody well shut up and listen.

[itsApril]

It's a long way from Reality TV to reality.  That's all I can say about her.

[Devlyn]

I don't especially care what she thinks, personally... but I do wish she'd stop saying things like she's a "transgender ambassador" and a spokesperson for the trans community. Basically, she's entitled to her own opinions, but I admit it does annoy me when she presents herself as speaking FOR me. (Because I admit I do tend to disagree!)

Can you show us where you think you found that information? Because Caitlyn has specifically said she isn't a spokesperson for the transgender community: http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/caitlyn-jenner-i-am-cait-season-2-politics-republican-1201680517/

While you have a right to choose who represents you, you have no right to misrepresent others.

Hugs, Devlyn

[Eevee]

Can you show us where you think you found that information? Because Caitlyn has specifically said she isn't a spokesperson for the transgender community: http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/caitlyn-jenner-i-am-cait-season-2-politics-republican-1201680517/

While you have a right to choose who represents you, you have no right to misrepresent others.

Hugs, Devlyn

It really is tough to see where she stands on that. While she has allowed herself to be the most visible trans person in the media, she also said that she is not a spokesperson for the transgender community after plenty of backlash. However, she also called herself the "trans ambassador" to presidential candidate Ted Cruz. That is where I personally draw a line in the sand and say "you do not represent me to anyone."

I personally just wish she'd stick to what she said before about focusing on her own journey. I am at least happy that she has faced that challenge because I know the difficulties as well, but I do not appreciate her involvement in politics as an "ambassador".

[Jenna Marie]

Devlyn, it appears to be a matter of interpretation. I do not intend to misrepresent her, but I don't feel that my own interpretation is unsupported.

I actually do appreciate that she explicitly disclaimed such a role in the link you provided, which I had not seen before. On the other hand, this is her referring to herself as a "trans ambassador" in precisely those words : http://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2016/mar/05/caitlyn-jenner-ted-cruz-trans-ambassador [this quote is also in the article linked here, but it's buried.] The quote which I attributed to her directly, in other words, is in fact widely documented as having actually come from her verbatim.

And it's hard for me, at least, to interpret a desire to be an ambassador to a presidential candidate, followed by an equally explicit discussion of trans issues that affect people beyond herself, as anything other than stating that she is - at least in this context - a spokesperson.

(Before the article that you posted, and back when I was paying more attention to her, she also did at least strongly imply that she was *one* spokesperson for the community : http://www.ew.com/article/2015/07/27/i-am-cait-supertease-caitlyn-jenner That's the official site for her show, btw. It appears that she may have learned better since then, and that I do appreciate.)

[stephaniec]

I just speculating because I don't know Cait personally. She's had a gifted life since she was 20 at least . For one she won the Gold  and she kept going .   hiding the same secret we all do. I use to have such nightmares of someone finding me out and to be in the public the way she was all these years , wow ,what a horrendous nightmare it would of been for me to have to face my truth in the public eye . Cait obviously doesn't come close to representing my life , she is a trans the same as me and has gone through the same turmoil I presume since a child and in that way we are sisters. As far as I'm concerned she has every right to be who she is. My father was a Republican and his ancestry is from England the birthplace of Calvinism.  I never agreed with my fathers view as a Republican but my love never changed. To me Cait is someone I respect even though I think some of her views are off  and she hopefully will learn that there are a lot of trans that aren't any way near as lucky as she is.