Legal Name change vs gender marker change- Timing?

[Brooke]

I'm nearly full time (within the next month or so) and am trying to figure out timing for legal name change vs timing for gender marker change.

In AZ, there is no prerequisite for legal name change. Though it can take several months with legal heating and all.

Gender marker requires a letter from physician- which I imagine I can get within six months.

What I'm most interested in right now is trying to get the name changed, then all my accounts put in my new name.

The other thing I am wanting is if I'm carded (have a young face- happens often) or ID check- for credit/debit cards. (I hate using cash)

Now my male name is Blake, which has helped over the years as it can be either male/female.

Is it better to do the legal name and gender marker all at once? (Thinking paperwork etc) and maybe just go to the DMV for an updated photo, or get name and accounts out of the way ASAP?

Thanks for the help!
Brooke


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[Laura_Squirrel]

Well, I remember when I changed my name, I couldn't change the marker until I had any sort of surgery. So, I had a female name and male gender marker for a few years. It was really annoying and depressing. I was sooo glad once I had that F on my I.D..

[Obfuskatie]

Money wise, it's cheaper to do it all at once despite the added requirements. Other than that, I think getting your gender marker should be your priority if you plan on being full time as you finish that process. Either way, plan for it taking a few months.


     Hugs,
- Katie
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[Iliana.Found]

I did my legal name change first which took around a two months to complete because there are a few steps to that process here in NY. After my name was finalized, I went and changed my name on my social security card and Drivers License as well as the gender marker on my license. Here in NY you do not need to have surgery to change your gender marker. Only a letter from the physician taking care of your HRT/transition. I had the letter for the gender change months before so I could've changed my license gender then, but then I'd have to change my name separately so I just waited and did it all at once. I still have yet to change the name and gender on my birth certificate. But man what a process when your name is legally changed. You have to change all your credit cards, loans, insurance, bank accounts, and I'm sure lots more, but those are what I had to change. It's so funny changing your name on your credit cards over the phone especially if your like me and refuse to speak in your male voice. Let's just say they get very confused and say that my "husband" needs to call to make a name change lol

[Ashey]

I was going to try to do it all at once but there's a hold up with my name change due to adoption records... Just time tacked on to all that, unfortunately. My first name is also gender-ambiguous so thankfully I can go with that, and I've decided to just change my gender marker, which I'll do next week. It's holding up quite a few things for me. I figure it's not so bad. $30 for a new ID here. I don't mind paying that again in a few months once all the paperwork goes through for my name change.

[Brooke]

Thanks everyone! It looks like the gender marker will take longer for me. Here in AZ the physician needs to have the words "irrevocably committed" in letter, not quite there yet- due to delays in starting hrt die to seizure risks.

But, I did file my paperwork for legal name change today. Woohoo!

Agreed on all of the places names need changing. Figure I'd get that process started.

I was told that birth certificate was as easy as a checkbox, even if I wasn't born in the state I'm filing. Somehow I don't buy it. I'm expecting a lot of time and effort to get everything switched over.

Thanks again!
Brooke


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[allisonsteph]

I changed both at the same time in California. Cali requires a letter from a medical doctor stating the patient has gone through "clinically appropriate medical treatment" to change genders. The law doesn't specify what clinically appropriate treatment is, it's entirely up to the doctor.


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[lisarenee]

I did the name change first for a couple of reasons --

1. I went full time prior to starting HRT. The only significant prerequisites to get a name change were time, money, and no felonies. Even after I started HRT, I still had issues getting my doctor to write the letter. I finally switched to another doctor and got my letter 10 months after my name change.

2. Simply changing my name to unambiguously female helped when using credit cards, etc...where there is no gender marker.

That said, I still wanted the gender marker. If your name is gender neutral already, then a marker change is probably your best path. Unfortunately, some doctors will require a name change to write a letter (not sure if they would drop that requirement if the existing name was androgynous) and many states require a name change in addition to surgery to change the sex on your birth certificate.

[Emjay]

I wanted to do both at the same time simply because I didn't want to go through the hassle of doing everything twice but Indiana threw me a curve ball.

In short, the BMV would allow the gender change with my doctors' affidavit that I am taking permanent steps to change my gender (HRT is acceptable).  The state, however, requires a surgeons' letter stating that I have gone through GCS along with a court order which states the same and grants me a legal gender change.  So until then my birth certificate cant be updated.  Social Security states the same on their website that a court order is required and Indiana won't grant a court order for gender change without GCS.

So for now, I have my name changed on all three but only my drivers' license has the correct gender marker.  I guess of the three that's probably the best one since it's the most common to carry everywhere. 

Out of everything, as far as day to day life, being able to change the name on my bank card was the biggest relief.  I *hate* carrying cash and having to present my bank card every single time I needed to buy something was pretty stressful!

[Ashey]

Got my gender marker changed today!  It was funny, the guy asked '...was this our error?' when looking at the 'M' on my previous ID. I'm thinking 'uhh no it was my mother's error'  He wasn't even going to ask for a letter from my doctor, he was just going to correct an error, lol. But I made sure he looked at the documentation so neither of us got in trouble.

[lisarenee]

Social Security states the same on their website that a court order is required and Indiana won't grant a court order for gender change without GCS.

Social Security only requires a Doctor's letter saying you are medically transitioning. Alternatively (and likely to get less fight), you should be able to present a 10 year US Passport, which can also be obtained with a Doctor's letter (Make sure it meets the requirements).

http://www.transequality.org/know-your-rights/social-security

I had to fight the SSA on this (excuse after excuse why they couldn't change it), but they finally relented and changed my gender marker. I printed and brought with me their rules.

https://secure.ssa.gov/poms.nsf/lnx/0110212200

[Emjay]

Social Security only requires a Doctor's letter saying you are medically transitioning. Alternatively (and likely to get less fight), you should be able to present a 10 year US Passport, which can also be obtained with a Doctor's letter (Make sure it meets the requirements).

http://www.transequality.org/know-your-rights/social-security

I had to fight the SSA on this (excuse after excuse why they couldn't change it), but they finally relented and changed my gender marker. I printed and brought with me their rules.

https://secure.ssa.gov/poms.nsf/lnx/0110212200

Thank you for this.  I was mistaken, I just went back to the SSA site and it does indeed say that.  I had pretty much given up trying to change it until GCS, whenever that happens.  I'll need to revisit this, then all I will have to wait for is my birth certificate.

Thanks!

[Sharon Anne McC]

*
Brooke:

I did my changes here at Arizona back during 1970s and 1980s. Then, the applicant walked into the Courthouse, obtained the change form from the Clerk, paid $25, submitted the application to the Clerk, went to sit in the Courtroom, waited for the judge to call your name, and you presented your case with whatever support documents or testimony you brought; the judge issued the decision right then and there.  Same when I had to do it again in 2007 to comply with still another Social Security Administration glitch.

Those experiences may not count much now.

I spent a couple days last year talking with the lawyers at Maricopa County Superior Court and doing research specifically addressing the legal sex change.

As far as last year, both Maricopa and Pima County Superior Courts provided self-help centers staffed with volunteer attourneys who help you complete simple court petitions such as name change.  The process can take months and the court cost was about $400.

At least as of that time and according to the assisting personnel, Arizona did not provide a specific for legal sex change.  You could check the box to change your Birth Certificate but that only mattered if you were born at Arizona; other states ignore that check-box.  Their legal advice was to add a statement that you are also changing your legal sex.  You might be required to provide some form of documentation when you appear at court.

Changing your name and sex at Social Security Administration (SSA regulation 'RM 10212.200′) requires at least one of four items:  Birth Certificate, U.S. Passport, Court Order, or Medical Statement.

Back to square one and documentation for court. Your medical statement from your physician, endocrinologist, psychologist, or other licenced medical professional can help at court as well as with SSA, Passport Agency, and many other efforts - banks, schools, credit agency, DMV.  Your medical statement must comply with specifics.  The SSA web-site will help; if you can go directly to an SSA office and speak to an agent, then that will help as well.  One key to your medical statement is that you have entered an irreversible course.

If your Birth Certificate is from another state, they may require you to file a petition for change / amendment through their process.  Personal suspicion is that most states that allow legal sex designation changed on your Birth Certificate require actual proof of some form of GCS / SRS, not a mere physician statement.

Unless things have drastically changed since last Summer, Arizona is among the states where it is easier to make your legal name and legal sex changes, though the process is now more involved than in years past.

Good luck!

(I reside at Phoenix.  You can PM me or browse my web-site if you need help.)

*

[Brooke]

*
Brooke:

I spent a couple days last year talking with the lawyers at Maricopa County Superior Court and doing research specifically addressing the legal sex change.

As far as last year, both Maricopa and Pima County Superior Courts provided self-help centers staffed with volunteer attourneys who help you complete simple court petitions such as name change.  The process can take months and the court cost was about $400.

At least as of that time and according to the assisting personnel, Arizona did not provide a specific for legal sex change.  You could check the box to change your Birth Certificate but that only mattered if you were born at Arizona; other states ignore that check-box.  Their legal advice was to add a statement that you are also changing your legal sex.  You might be required to provide some form of documentation when you appear at court.

Changing your name and sex at Social Security Administration (SSA regulation 'RM 10212.200′) requires at least one of four items:  Birth Certificate, U.S. Passport, Court Order, or Medical Statement.

Back to square one and documentation for court. Your medical statement from your physician, endocrinologist, psychologist, or other licenced medical professional can help at court as well as with SSA, Passport Agency, and many other efforts - banks, schools, credit agency, DMV.  Your medical statement must comply with specifics.  The SSA web-site will help; if you can go directly to an SSA office and speak to an agent, then that will help as well.  One key to your medical statement is that you have entered an irreversible course.

If your Birth Certificate is from another state, they may require you to file a petition for change / amendment through their process.  Personal suspicion is that most states that allow legal sex designation changed on your Birth Certificate require actual proof of some form of GCS / SRS, not a mere physician statement.

Unless things have drastically changed since last Summer, Arizona is among the states where it is easier to make your legal name and legal sex changes, though the process is now more involved than in years past.

Good luck!

(I reside at Phoenix.  You can PM me or browse my web-site if you need help.)

*

Thanks Sharon! If you have any clarification re what I was told, it would be greatly appreciated.

I was told that I needed a letter that stated I was "irrevocably committed" to my gender change by the clerk at the law library, and my gender therapist.

"You don't need a lawyer to change your name in Maricopa County.  all
the forms and instructions are available for download through the Self
Serve Center.  You can download the entire packet or each piece
individually.  The instructions will tell you what to fill out, how many
copies to make, and where to go to turn it in.
To get a hearing date, follow the instructions, turn in the application and
pay the filing fees.

GENDER MARK CHANGE
In order to get the gender marker changed, you'll need a letter from a licensed physician saying
two things, one, that you are
that you are "irrevocably committed" to changing your gender,
and two, that you have received "appropriate clinical treatment."   
The signed letter or signed
statement must include the physician's license number. Physician can include licensed medical,
naturopathic and mental health practitioner.
A letter from a doctor is not required if you are doing a name change only."

http://transspectrum.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/PhxTransResourceGuide15-5.pdf (Page 7)

There is a checkbox on the forms I filled out for the birth certificate from out of state. Again the clerk stated that other states typically honor requests.. but I have my doubts still- will believe it when I see it.

In any case, I was told that documentation that you mentioned was not needed when I filed ($319 as of last week). And that once I was on hrt for a bit longer my physician would have no problem writing a letter for gender change with that required wording.

Thank you again for your help and further information on changes with other state/federal organizations.

Hugs!
Brooke