A transgender child’s journey

[stephaniec]

A transgender child's journey

http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2016/jun/03/being-rachel-a-transgender-childs-journey/

Spokesman/By Eli Francovich   0/03/2016

"Eight-year-old Rachel White's transgender journey has only begun. Despite support at home and school, there is no easy path ahead.

The little girls are dressed up and made up, hair sprayed, curled and twirled into intricate patterns, playing at being models. All 15 of them sit closely together on the floor while older women sit and stand, checking themselves in the mirrors, last-minute fixes in preparation for their grand entrance."

[alex82]

A transgender child's journey

http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2016/jun/03/being-rachel-a-transgender-childs-journey/

Spokesman/By Eli Francovich   0/03/2016

"Eight-year-old Rachel White's transgender journey has only begun. Despite support at home and school, there is no easy path ahead.

The little girls are dressed up and made up, hair sprayed, curled and twirled into intricate patterns, playing at being models. All 15 of them sit closely together on the floor while older women sit and stand, checking themselves in the mirrors, last-minute fixes in preparation for their grand entrance."

I'm sorry, I think beauty parades for children are disgusting, and I have no sympathy for any parent who dolls their child up in hairspray and make up.

[stephaniec]

I'm sorry, as far as I can tell it's a common theme for a child with severe dysphoria at an early age. I started when I was 4 years old , but I was too embarrassed to   enlist the aid of my parents. I'm 64 years old now and I've lived and suffered all my life because I was born in an era of electo shock treatment that was the  cure for a child with severe dysphoria like I had. I see more hope in a story like this in that the child can freely choose the life they need rather than suffer unnecessarily. This is just my opinion and is not meant to harm anyone else's view. I just see more hope for children like I was.

[alex82]

I'm sorry, as far as I can tell it's a common theme for a child with severe dysphoria at an early age. I started when I was 4 years old , but I was too embarrassed to   enlist the aid of my parents. I'm 64 years old now and I've lived and suffered all my life because I was born in an era of electo shock treatment that was the  cure for a child with severe dysphoria like I had. I see more hope in a story like this in that the child can freely choose the life they need rather than suffer unnecessarily. This is just my opinion and is not meant to harm anyone else's view. I just see more hope for children like I was.

Yes, I have gender dysphoria too.

That is aside from painting and preening a young child into a doll. I don't care whether they are born female, becoming female, born male, becoming male, it's a hideous thing to do to a child. 'Sprayed, curled, and twirled' - oh god.

Note, I did not say it wasn't normal for little girls to play with make up or wear their mothers shoes. That is very different from buying a child their own adult accessories and sending them down a catwalk to be judged on their looks. Applicable to all children, regardless of whether they are born in the right body or the wrong one.

[cindianna_jones]

At three years old, this is what I wanted more than anything else in the world. As far as I knew, the big difference between girls and boys was what we wore. I didn't have any close friends at that age. I just saw the world through very young eyes at church. I would have loved to be in a beauty pageant. I do admit that the negative aspects are numerous. But the experience could be self affirming. I don't know. I couldn't do it.

I found this to be a most excellent article. It puts a real face to this bathroom issue and paints the haters in a broad stroke of stupid. I might bookmark it and pass it on when people ask me what I think about the bathroom bills. It's unfortunate but we tend to see this issue as it has been spoon fed to us. We fail to see it through the eyes of a small child. And.... it IS all about the children. It REALLY is.

[alex82]

I'm sorry, as far as I can tell it's a common theme for a child with severe dysphoria at an early age. I started when I was 4 years old , but I was too embarrassed to   enlist the aid of my parents. I'm 64 years old now and I've lived and suffered all my life because I was born in an era of electo shock treatment that was the  cure for a child with severe dysphoria like I had. I see more hope in a story like this in that the child can freely choose the life they need rather than suffer unnecessarily. This is just my opinion and is not meant to harm anyone else's view. I just see more hope for children like I was.

So many of these children become teenagers with eating disorders.

They are not adults, they shouldn't be treated like adults. There are few sights more hideous than a little girl done up in make up and with her hair sprayed and lacquered into place.

If I had a daughter, then apart from when she was playing around, she'd be told to wipe it off and read a book or go out to play with her friends instead.

And the answer to "when can I start wearing it out?" would be "when you can afford to go to the MAC counter and be properly kitted out".

One of the things British schools get right is a bottle of nail varnish remover and a bar of soap for children who come to school with make up and nail polish. One they start getting through high school, and the eye make up begins around the age of 14, fine. Otherwise no.

[alex82]

At three years old, this is what I wanted more than anything else in the world. As far as I knew, the big difference between girls and boys was what we wore. I didn't have any close friends at that age. I just saw the world through very young eyes at church. I would have loved to be in a beauty pageant. I do admit that the negative aspects are numerous. But the experience could be self affirming. I don't know. I couldn't do it.

I found this to be a most excellent article. It puts a real face to this bathroom issue and paints the haters in a broad stroke of stupid. I might bookmark it and pass it on when people ask me what I think about the bathroom bills. It's unfortunate but we tend to see this issue as it has been spoon fed to us. We fail to see it through the eyes of a small child. And.... it IS all about the children. It REALLY is.

I really do understand Cindi.

But there are many things that very young children want to do, and it doesn't mean they should be given a free pass to do it.

As I said, wearing your mums shoes and playing around with make up is one thing. Being sprayed and lacquered to be judged by other adults is something else.

[cindianna_jones]

But Alex, you live in an enlightened country! We're stuck again in the 1950's here in the US.

I completely understand your point of view. Most of these pageants are way over the top.

[alex82]

As I say, little girls who were born girls were treated the same way. Wash it off.

Regular occurrence until we got to age around 14 when they were certainly allowed some eye make up.

Daily in registration, some precocious twelve year old girl would be taken off to the bathroom if she was lucky, or the sink in the corner if she wasn't, to remove the lot. As you can imagine, I took some interest in this - more than a child without gender dysphoria would've done.

[alex82]

But Alex, you live in an enlightened country! We're stuck again in the 1950's here in the US.

I completely understand your point of view. Most of these pageants are way over the top.

Your sarcasm is noted and appreciated 

It'd be interesting to see if people from very enlightened countries see things differently from those of us from the US or the UK.

I would guess that they probably do. I can't imagine kids in Sweden or the Netherlands are encouraged to have their hair 'sprayed, curled, and twirled'.

I think we forget sometimes that little girls who were born girls were also prevented from doing things they might have quite liked doing. Largely for their own good.

[cindianna_jones]

I grew up in a Mormon culture in Utah. Had I been born cis female, I wouldn't have been able to wear makeup, heels, or hosiery until I was 15 or 16. Anything strapless, halters, or bikinis would have been strictly off limits even in late teens.

Did that help make my female classmates any better balanced members of our society? I'd have to say no. We had way too many teen pregnancies. I think that the young kids were constantly looking for a crack in the fence or an unlocked gate.

Me? I was a virgin when I got married. It was a horrible mistake. Had I been able to experiment a bit, I would have figured this trans thing out a lot sooner. I could have prevented much heartache for my virgin bride.

I think it's a mixed bag. But I still agree with you. These pageant companies exploit little girls to the max. I don't have a problem with the pageantry of a simple and local presentation that focuses not just on beauty but the other talents that children may have. It's all a matter of context.

When I was 13, I performed in a church play. I was a "prince" and got to wear tights. I nearly died with elation.

[stephaniec]

At three years old, this is what I wanted more than anything else in the world. As far as I knew, the big difference between girls and boys was what we wore. I didn't have any close friends at that age. I just saw the world through very young eyes at church. I would have loved to be in a beauty pageant. I do admit that the negative aspects are numerous. But the experience could be self affirming. I don't know. I couldn't do it.

I found this to be a most excellent article. It puts a real face to this bathroom issue and paints the haters in a broad stroke of stupid. I might bookmark it and pass it on when people ask me what I think about the bathroom bills. It's unfortunate but we tend to see this issue as it has been spoon fed to us. We fail to see it through the eyes of a small child. And.... it IS all about the children. It REALLY is.

ditto

[stephaniec]

 Just being a little kid expressing them selves the way they need to. What I would of given to have the chance to be open and free.

[stephaniec]

"So, White, who had just started a graduate program in Public Administration at Eastern Washington University, decided to write a paper about what it means to be transgender. In the course of her research, she came across some sobering facts: 41 percent of transgender people have attempted suicide.

"At that point I had a decision to make," White says. "I could support my child or I could bury my child.""

[alex82]

I grew up in a Mormon culture in Utah. Had I been born cis female, I wouldn't have been able to wear makeup, heels, or hosiery until I was 15 or 16. Anything strapless, halters, or bikinis would have been strictly off limits even in late teens.

Did that help make my female classmates any better balanced members of our society? I'd have to say no. We had way too many teen pregnancies. I think that the young kids were constantly looking for a crack in the fence or an unlocked gate.

Me? I was a virgin when I got married. It was a horrible mistake. Had I been able to experiment a bit, I would have figured this trans thing out a lot sooner. I could have prevented much heartache for my virgin bride.

I think it's a mixed bag. But I still agree with you. These pageant companies exploit little girls to the max. I don't have a problem with the pageantry of a simple and local presentation that focuses not just on beauty but the other talents that children may have. It's all a matter of context.

When I was 13, I performed in a church play. I was a "prince" and got to wear tights. I nearly died with elation.

That's very sweet re: you at 13.

I wasn't raised religiously, so I can't comment on that.

I'm certainly not saying middle to late teens shouldn't be allowed to have boyfriends and girlfriends of whatever combination they choose. The opposite.

Here is a short debate on a lunchtime chat show about little girls wearing make up, led by a well known glamour model and her children...



The only one speaking with sense is the little boy whose sister wears it, and the other panelists whose sympathy is rather with him.

Stephanie, I have not said, anywhere, that little girls - whether born or transitioning - shouldn't be allowed to play around and explore. That is categorically not what I've said.

[alex82]

"So, White, who had just started a graduate program in Public Administration at Eastern Washington University, decided to write a paper about what it means to be transgender. In the course of her research, she came across some sobering facts: 41 percent of transgender people have attempted suicide.

"At that point I had a decision to make," White says. "I could support my child or I could bury my child.""

I don't think I said children should be buried rather than supported in their best endeavours. That's very far from what I said.

[cindianna_jones]

I wish I could watch the video but my internet service sucks rocks. I can't do any streaming. It's hard to get some web pages to load. But I pay full price just like everyone else. Ah, the luxuries of country living!

[stephaniec]

I'm sorry if I'm misinterpreting your views, I'm just saying little girls do that kind of thing.I was a extremely introverted  child which caused me problems throughout childhood. I could never have gotten in front of people much less my parents dressed how I needed to, but I never could of been a movie star either. Some people can and some can't. You wouldn't deprive Jazz of I am Jazz to have her own TV show.

[alex82]

Just being a little kid expressing them selves the way they need to. What I would of given to have the chance to be open and free.

That's your generation and all kinds of other things, of which being trans is only one aspect. Like Cindi - had she been born female, she still wouldn't have been allowed to express herself in that way.

I did the same Stephanie - I used to wear my mothers mascara. There were two reasons I wouldn't have gone to school wearing it - one was the trans reason. The other more major one was because I would've simply been told to scrub it off anyway. And I'd have been lining up behind all the cis girls to do so, because they were removing it too.

By the time I was 15 or so, I did used to wear fake tan and tinted moisturizer to school, as well as having my eyelashes and eyebrows dyed darker. But 15 is not a young child.

If I had a daughter, whether cis or trans, she would not be leaving my house wearing make up, until she was old enough to apply it properly, old enough to buy good quality stuff, and old enough to not simply be told to wash it all off anyway.

And I would, being honest, be quite upset if my daughter wanted to be entered into beauty pageants. I'd rather see her report card, hear that she was a nice person, wrote an interesting essay. And then in middle teens, with some kind of brain developed, started dating her choice of person, and wearing some tasteful make up that people would say "doesn't she look lovely" rather than "look at that sex offenders dream".

[stephaniec]

These are your personal views which are totally fine, but not all people are like that and our stories are so different even though the core issue is Dysphoria.