Decisions on the way to a non-binary identity

[sparrow]

I've been reading about nonbinary folk for a while now, and I'm finding a lot of commonalities between us, in both FT* and MT*.  Many of us begin with a binary assumption -- I think I'm trans, and therefore I must be the opposite gender of what I've been told.  We gradually come to realize that this basic assumption is flawed, and come to terms with a non-binary identity.  What triggered your nonbinary epiphany?

The most pivotal feature for me was my voice.  My dad was a Marine, and he was a shouter.  I remember the day that I Became A Man: I got into a shouting match with my dad, and won.  When I lecture, my voice booms across the room and keeps my audience awake and engaged.  I'm a cyclist, my yell is louder than a car horn, and that's saved my life a few times.  I can sing baritone, and I can very nearly sing bass.  My voice is something that I absolutely love about myself.  When I started trying to present as female, that was a sticking point -- how the heck can I pass with this voice... moreover... do I want to pass badly enough to give up my voice?  The answer is no.

[sigsi]

To me, there were a few things that helped me realized I was non-binary.
I knew that I outwardly wanted to appear more masculine, I knew that I hated how high my voice was, I also knew that I would prefer it if my body was a shapeless/genderless. As a kid (7/8), I had this impression that when I grew up I would be "a girl that looked like a girl and a boy" outwardly. I knew nothing about lgbt* at that point.
At 12, I was obsessed with this really odd book. From What I remember, a girl saw this "beautiful boy" that nobody believed existed. When she found him, he refused to see the town saying it wasn't safe. Then he stripped in the middle of the woods and she saw he had no "sexual" features, which he said was why it wasn't safe. Then he just walked away and she never saw him again. I'm about 90% sure the kid was an alien..?
Anyways, this is when it really sunk in for me. I worked at a restaurant where there were lots of customers, and it was 50/50 whether I was a "miss/mam" or "sir" at first glance. Most corrected themselves after I spoke, but there were a few that kept calling me "sir". At first, I loved "sir" because it meant I wasn't being seen as a girl, and I hated "miss/mam". After a few months though, I started to dislike being called "sir" too.
I knew was asexual since 17, and already read parts of the blog NeutroisNonsense. I thought that I might be on the trans* spectrum, but didn't know for sure if I was FTM or non-binary until working that job. I eventually asked myself if I had to live the rest of my life in a female's body with a female name and pronouns, could I survive? The answer was no. But if I had to live in a male's body with a male name and pronouns, I wouldn't be comfortable either.

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Side note: I'm jealous that you can project your voice. I used to love singing as a kid, but could never project. I would talk to my friends in high school and they would look at me like I was a mime, telling me they had no idea what I said. When I stared my job as a group server, I was speaking loudly and customers/co-workers still couldn't hear me. By the end of that job, I was yelling just so my voice would be heard. Co-workers then commented saying that I sounded angry. It was like there was no win. As a kid I had extreme anxiety though, and was told I didn't talk a lot/spoke quietly. Meh, my voice annoys me.

[Sparky]

Shows how we are all different! I love my voice, I've got a pretty good range (3 and a bit octaves), and I can sing girl or boy pop songs with ease naturally (not a comedy falsetto). Its a big part of my androgeny I guess. I love the strong feminine parts of me, and now I'm finally finding ways to express them I finally feel more at ease after years and years of being lost. While I think I could pass reasonable well as f, to do that really well I'd need to 'fake it' in ways, e.g. false things, or hormones. I'm not even entirely comfortable with wigs. So having faked being a 'normal' guy for so many years, the last thing I want to do is fake being a 'normal' girl. Also I don't fully gel with either sex, never have. I want the freedom to express all of me. Walking into a boys clothes shop makes my heart die a little. Going clothes shopping with/for girls used to make me insanely jealous! 

[Tessa James]

I've been reading about nonbinary folk for a while now, and I'm finding a lot of commonalities between us, in both FT* and MT*.  Many of us begin with a binary assumption -- I think I'm trans, and therefore I must be the opposite gender of what I've been told.  We gradually come to realize that this basic assumption is flawed, and come to terms with a non-binary identity.  What triggered your nonbinary epiphany?

The most pivotal feature for me was my voice.  My dad was a Marine, and he was a shouter.  I remember the day that I Became A Man: I got into a shouting match with my dad, and won.  When I lecture, my voice booms across the room and keeps my audience awake and engaged.  I'm a cyclist, my yell is louder than a car horn, and that's saved my life a few times.  I can sing baritone, and I can very nearly sing bass.  My voice is something that I absolutely love about myself.  When I started trying to present as female, that was a sticking point -- how the heck can I pass with this voice... moreover... do I want to pass badly enough to give up my voice?  The answer is no.

Oh Sparrow i so get this ^^  We were a family of 15 and people were loud or unheard.  I am also a cyclist and do public presentations and can really "wake em up" if need be.  I took speech tx for months and found I could affect quite a lot of change in tone, pitch and more to sound more typically feminine.  I could do a breathless Marilyn Monroe but?  I realized that I felt a conflict about loosing some of my identity with those changes and gradually came around to your same conclusion.  Our voice is more than sounds we project!  Passing is something we do with an "on your left" warning
I thought puberty would be the magic time when "the change" could turn me into a girl.  Reality was less kind and I maintained an ambiguous androgyny most of my life wearing those bike tights and very long hair.

Shows how we are all different! I love my voice, I've got a pretty good range (3 and a bit octaves), and I can sing girl or boy pop songs with ease naturally (not a comedy falsetto). Its a big part of my androgeny I guess. I love the strong feminine parts of me, and now I'm finally finding ways to express them I finally feel more at ease after years and years of being lost. While I think I could pass reasonable well as f, to do that really well I'd need to 'fake it' in ways, e.g. false things, or hormones. I'm not even entirely comfortable with wigs. So having faked being a 'normal' guy for so many years, the last thing I want to do is fake being a 'normal' girl. Also I don't fully gel with either sex, never have. I want the freedom to express all of me. Walking into a boys clothes shop makes my heart die a little. Going clothes shopping with/for girls used to make me insanely jealous! 

Yes, viva la difference!  I share your sense of wanting to avoid "fake" anything and still conclude that some of us trans people are not gong to readily jump from one binary gender straight jacket to another.  Great food for thought all, thanks.

[Satinjoy]

My core is not female.

But I thought mtf transition inevitable.

It was not.  I am a very feminine androgyne.  A nonbinary transsexual.  Genderfluid socially yet the core remains me.

I just knew something was wrong.  And I had brilliant minds from this board guiding me through.

Sadly, they are gone from here.

But offline, they watch over me still.

Nonbinary dysphoria is tough.  Add trans puberty into it and the ride gets nuts.  Once the raging hormones settle down, we see ourselves better.  Truth comes.  Hopefully before transitional collateral damage wreaks havok on our lives and others.

Nonbinary guides know this, and waych out for those in trans puberty's grip.  Helping them stay grounded.

Nails out head up heart wide open.
Satinjoy

[popa910]

I've not yet really had an epiphany on any of this, but I've gradually come to believe that the binary thing (in my case, particularly the expectation that one must be either male or female, but not any combination of both) just feels a bit limiting to me.  I'm certainly not 100% male or 100% female; I've very slowly begun drifting toward a more androgynous expression, trying to find what's comfortable with me.  I like some male aspects of myself, and I like some female aspects of myself.

I don't think I really identify as something beyond the male/female spectrum, as I can't really yet conceive of what that would even mean.

[Tristyn]

At 12, I was obsessed with this really odd book. From What I remember, a girl saw this "beautiful boy" that nobody believed existed. When she found him, he refused to see the town saying it wasn't safe. Then he stripped in the middle of the woods and she saw he had no "sexual" features, which he said was why it wasn't safe. Then he just walked away and she never saw him again. I'm about 90% sure the kid was an alien..?

There is a video of a  teenager on youtube who identifies as a girl who also lacks sexual characteristics. Could she also be an alien? Yeah, I didn't know people like her could really exist either. 

[sigsi]

There is a video of a  teenager on youtube who identifies as a girl who also lacks sexual characteristics. Could she also be an alien? Yeah, I didn't know people like her could really exist either. 

Oh wow, I didn't realize that. Gah I hope that part didn't sound offensive. Most of the books I read at that age came from the Science Fiction/Fantasy "Teenage/Young Adult" area of the bookstore, and a lot of them had aliens and other dimensions in them. I got a little carried away with thought there and started to go into the plot a bit, I meant no harm by the statement.
My main thought was that I subconsciously liked this book because I dreamed of a neutral body as I felt "neutral" in my gender, but didn't realize that until years later.

Edit: I lost this book when we moved, and had to go google it. Apparently he was a ghost or "manifestation of guilt" according to wikipedia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frozen_Fire_(novel)

[Satinjoy]

I've not yet really had an epiphany on any of this, but I've gradually come to believe that the binary thing (in my case, particularly the expectation that one must be either male or female, but not any combination of both) just feels a bit limiting to me.  I'm certainly not 100% male or 100% female; I've very slowly begun drifting toward a more androgynous expression, trying to find what's comfortable with me.  I like some male aspects of myself, and I like some female aspects of myself.

I don't think I really identify as something beyond the male/female spectrum, as I can't really yet conceive of what that would even mean.

For me I feel all of my gender at the same time.  No matter the presentation.

And I am extremely socially fluid.  But always me.

[Tristyn]

I've not yet really had an epiphany on any of this, but I've gradually come to believe that the binary thing (in my case, particularly the expectation that one must be either male or female, but not any combination of both) just feels a bit limiting to me.  I'm certainly not 100% male or 100% female; I've very slowly begun drifting toward a more androgynous expression, trying to find what's comfortable with me.  I like some male aspects of myself, and I like some female aspects of myself.

I don't think I really identify as something beyond the male/female spectrum, as I can't really yet conceive of what that would even mean.

I'm drifting towards the same thing. Though I feel more male than female. Yet I legitimately do not feel like a biological male like FTMs and I certainly am not cis female. I simply prefer male attire, mostly traditional male interests, and male behaviors over female ones. But I don't want to be all that manly. Like part of me has no gender; whatever that means, while the other is completely a guy. I don't feel like a woman at all.

[popa910]

I'm drifting towards the same thing. Though I feel more male than female. Yet I legitimately do not feel like a biological male like FTMs and I certainly am not cis female. I simply prefer male attire, mostly traditional male interests, and male behaviors over female ones.

The thing that is particularly confusing for me is that even though I've come to realize I'm not entirely a cisgender male, my interests are very stereotypically not feminine; I majored in physics, minored in computer science, I enjoy playing sports and video games, and I have no interest in "feminine" hobbies such as playing with dolls and such.

Despite this, I've found that the gender expression that I desire lies outside the cisgender male one that is expected of me.