Susan's Place Logo

News:

Visit our Discord server  and Wiki

Main Menu

IRS

Started by Leigh, January 27, 2006, 11:56:22 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Leigh

IRS: Gender Reassignment Just Cosmetic Surgery

by Doreen Brandt, 365Gay.com
Washington Bureau

Posted: January 26, 2006 - 12:01 am ET

(Washington) A transgendered woman who sought a tax deduction for gender reassignment surgery has been told by the IRS that the operation is considered cosmetic surgery and not eligible for a break.

The case is now before IRS Office of Appeals, WebCPA - an internet site for professional accountants - reports.

The Internal Revenue Service's Office of Chief Counsel told the appeals tribunal that gender reassignment is not necessary surgery and therefore cannot be deducted as a medical expense for tax purposes.

The woman, who is not identified, had deducted doctor payment, the cost of  hormone treatments, psychotherapy, health insurance, transportation and lodging in connection with the surgery. 

WebCPA reports that the tax return included extensive medical and legal documentation, but an IRS revenue agent listed the procedure as cosmetic and denied the deductions.

The Chief Counsel upheld the decision citing legislation from 1990 that sets limits on the definition of cosmetic surgery, saying deductions are not allowed for "any procedure which is directed at improving the patient's appearance and does not meaningfully promote the proper function of the body or prevent or treat illness or disease." 

If the woman wins her appeal it could allow dozens of other transgendered men and women also to deduct their medical and related costs from their federal income taxes.



  •  

Shelley

In Australia deductions have to be work related which i think would be a bit harder to justify. :)

Shelley
  •  

rana

My post may offend people?   But my question is why should gender reassignment surgery be a tax deduction? 
It has nothing to do with earning income & so should not be claimed as a deduction.
Even as a social payment - it is like non essential cosmetic surgery - so why should it be allowed.
  •  

Shelley

Hi Rana,

We used to have this system in Australia. Think back to when you were a child and the stress around tax time. This was pre Medicare. If you think about Medicare particularly in it's earleir versions in a similar way the government payed for the medical system. Whether that is by tax deduction or a socialist medical provision system the result is very similar.

Shelley

P.S. I assume that is Newcastle Australia not England.
  •  

rana

hi Shelley :)
You would never guess what I do for a living :)
Its even worse than playing a piano in a bordello - I do peoples tax :)
You dont really want me to argue the differences between deductions & rebates & stuff I'll bet :)

and Yes  I am also from the land of Oz,   but I drive a Toyota not a Holden
  •  

Shelley

It has been said many times to me Rana that I lead with my chin. Once again I've proved the truism. :icon_redface:

Shelley
  •  

rana

Not at all Shelley :)    Actually I agree (sort of)
I just have this belief that people are servants of the state & the State is the servant of the people.
Everybody has responsibilities as well as rights,  we should pay taxes, do military service. Give according to our abilities receive according to our needs (not wants)

I am getting ready to break into singing "The Red Flag"

rana :)
  •  

Shelley

Sing away dear lady. :D

Shelley
  •  

DawnL

#8
Quote from: rana on January 28, 2006, 05:33:54 AM
My post may offend people?   But my question is why should gender reassignment surgery be a tax deduction?  It has nothing to do with earning income & so should not be claimed as a deduction. Even as a social payment - it is like non essential cosmetic surgery - so why should it be allowed. 

Because US tax law allows a tax deduction for medical espenses that exceed 7.5% of family income whether it is work related or not.  I also argue that it is a medically necessary treatment for GID. You have merely demonstrated your ignorance of US tax law and insulted transsexuals who see GRS as anything but cosmetic.

Dawn
  •  

Leigh

Quote from: rana on January 28, 2006, 05:33:54 AM
My post may offend people?

It doesn't offend me, it just gives me a wealth of information about your situation.

     
QuoteIt has nothing to do with earning income & so should not be claimed as a deduction.

If a person is so affected that they have problems functioning because of GID/lack of surgery, would not that help them be a better employee?  If someone can claim the un reimbursed therapy costs for bi-polarism, PTSD, stress and depression why should the costs of sugery be disallowed?  Lost work time, employer payments for "legal" medical treatments are often longer going and more expensive than those related to GID.  It is a known business fact that an employee who is happy, at work and home, is a better more productive employee.

I believe that most who transition on the job and eventually have surgery, work harder for one very good reason.  We know that we do not have the safety net of going back.  If there is a lay off who will be the first to go?  The ones who are less productive, cause workplace problems, anyone the company wants to get rid of.  I/we cannot afford that so I/we do more for the same or in many cases, less money than before.

QuoteEven as a social payment - it is like non essential cosmetic surgery - so why should it be allowed

A burn victim is still breathing, can function completely without having skin grafts to their face, can do every single thing they did before, yet they are allowed to deduct the costs of the grafts.  Why, they are functional?    Even if the scars are not visible the grafts are still a deductible medical expense why so?  They don't affect the persons ability to do their work.

It only non essential to those whose only foray into a womens life or appearence is occasional or non existent.

Leigh




  •  

AmyNYC

I don't understand.  Wasn't the issue already decided in Rhiannon O'Donnabhain's case in 2004?  Or since there's no IRS rules that specifically grant the deductions, can the IRS just challenge the issue case by case?

Amy
  •  

Leigh

http://www.glad.org/News_Room/press83-11-30-04.html

It will get kicked upstairs but its difficult to deny a case when it has been upheld in the past.

Do you suppose a touch of transphobia may be happening here?

  •  

AmyNYC

Quote from: Leigh on January 28, 2006, 09:31:33 PMIt will get kicked upstairs but its difficult to deny a case when it has been upheld in the past.

That's what I thought.

I suppose after enough people win their appeals agents will just stop denying the deductions in the first place or the IRS will come up with a tax code to allow the deduction.

It's hard to imagine that the agent in this latest case didn't know about the decision in 2004.  Granting that, I'd say it's a clear case of transphobia.

Amy
  •  

rana

Dawn,  I wish you had read the two other posts I had made to Shelley.  Oz is not a place other than Kansas its shorthand for another country. And, I admit I am ignorant of US laws and institutions, probably as much as you are of Australian laws & institutions.

I hoped you had some sense of where I stand on things from other posts I have made.  In short I was making a statement of where I stand on things political/social - NOT insulting transexuals.  I wish you had challenged me on this and not just dived in & attacked me (I believe unjustly).

Re-reading my post I admit the "My post may offend some people" sounds smug - it was not my intention :(  My position is:  That if anybody feels that they truely are born into the wrong sex - then they have every right to do somthing about it - whatever it takes. I am aware that it is a long, painful & costly journey, but it is that persons individual journey & though they are entitled to sympathy & support.  They cannot expect as a God given right in all instances to expect other people to pay for it.  And, that is what tax breaks are - somebody else has to step in and pay.

Leigh, you are stating the obvious to say that a persons posts give a wealth of information about them - I agree, I formed a definite opinion of you from your posts and I also am not at all offended by your take on things.

Two points you brought up. The first about income and deductions. I know this is a quibble but, you are mixing social costs and payments up with tax calculations These are always included with tax but are a different matter.  Tax is based on income less the cost of earning it.  Now you tell me what you do for a living and I will then lecture you on that topic - see how that goes over :)

I take your point about surgery for burns victims.  I guess is a misunderstanding about terms.  By cosmetic surgery I ment exactly that.  Say a person had their nose torn off in an industrial accident, dog attack and the like.  No society would be so heartless as not to allow a deduction for surgery to reduce such a disfigurement.  Say a person had a deformed septum in their nose, such a thing may lead to sleep aponea, and indirectly injury to other people by that person falling asleep driving, looking after machinery etc.  Surgery to correct this would reduce the chance of cost to society and so a deduction should be allowed - even thou the surgery as a side effect led to the person having a more pleasing looking nose. Those examples are reconstructive surgery.   Cosmetic surgery is somebody getting a nose job so it looks as sexy as Britney Speers & then expecting society to step in & help foot the bill _ THAT is cosmetic surgery.

I consider that there is a whole continuum re gender reassignment - at one end people who are deeply affected & disturbed by their situation. At the other end (using your own words) those who only foray into a womans life is occasional or non existent. So where do we draw the line re reconstructive or cosmetic surgery?   Your original post seemed to imply that all of it is reconstructive
  •  

DawnL

I am well aware that Oz isn't in Kansas.  It is this statement:

"it is like non essential cosmetic surgery"

that angered me.  It's not, okay?  For many of us, it's life saving so if you're going to post on a board that include transsexuals, you might try and be more sensitive to our circumstances.  As far as taking this as a deduction, US tax law allows such deductions and since the case we're taking about occurred in the US, there is no reason we shouldn't benefit from that deduction.  We're not talking about a God-given right here but a right granted by the US tax code.  If you consider my comment on your ignorance of our tax law an attack, it appears to be a matter of fact by your own admission.  Your reply just continues digging the hole you started earlier.  This thread is about the IRS treatment of one particular case regarding GRS.  If you want to make political or social commentary then go do so in the proper place (not here).

Dawn
  •  

rana

Dawn I noticed you come online & then straight away your post - maybe you should take some time to study what is posted & think about things before you dive in.  I am not attacking you, it just seems to me that you are looking for a fight with me or just want to lecture me?
Whatever, if it makes you happy I will save my political or social commentary for another place
  •  

DawnL

There is at Susan's an area called "Activism and Politics" and that is where your musings belong.  Your comments were offensive, off-topic, and I didn't feel the need to reflect much before stating such.  Since you identify as male, it's interesting that you feel compelled to offer your philosophy on the cosmetic versus medically necessary indications for GRS.  I am neither interested in a fight or giving a lecture.  Based on your last post, you don't seem interested in addressing why your comments were offensive.

Dawn
  •  

Dennis

QuoteTax is based on income less the cost of earning it.

You say this as though it is a universal truth. It is not. It is the specific case in one country, Australia. It is not the case in Canada and it is not the case in the US. Deductions are permitted for medical expenses in Canada, including GRS, provided that they are not purely cosmetic. GRS is not considered cosmetic in Canada, quite rightly in my opinion. In fact, some of it is funded by our medical plan because it is a medical issue.

Leigh is not telling you "your job" when she tells you about US tax structure. She's telling you about her country.

Dennis
  •  

Cassandra

Topic has been split. Please see Posting, Moderators and Site Safety.

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,2182.0.html

Cassie
  •