I'm afraid of North Korea

[sarah1972]

I actually saw one of those films from the 50s on the history channel. They have kids at school duck under their desks.

Bad enough: we trained that in school in the early 80's. You would think people at that time had figured out it does not help much.

[Deborah]

I can't imagine it would ever be shown in movie theaters but it must have been at sometime.

Back then, right up until the fall of the Soviet Union, the threat was very real.  We actually came very close a couple of times to launching at each other.  So that sort of stuff from the movie was a constant thing just under the surface in the mind.

We had a drill in the Army for actions to take in case we came under attack from tactical nukes.  That also was a real possibility had war ever occurred in Europe.  Basically the drill was to lay on the ground face down, eyes closed, and hope for the best.  We also carried around radiation dose meters that would tell us how much radiation we had absorbed.

Fortunately none of that ever happened.



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[Julia1996]

Back then, right up until the fall of the Soviet Union, the threat was very real.  We actually came very close a couple of times to launching at each other.  So that sort of stuff from the movie was a constant thing just under the surface in the mind.

We had a drill in the Army for actions to take in case we came under attack from tactical nukes.  That also was a real possibility had war ever occurred in Europe.  Basically the drill was to lay on the ground face down, eyes closed, and hope for the best.  We also carried around radiation dose meters that would tell us how much radiation we had absorbed.

Fortunately none of that ever happened.



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That must have been awful. I don't really give much thought to a nuclear war. To me it's like one of those possible but totally unlikely things like a gamma ray burst or a black hole coming close to earth. I can't even imagine having it hanging over your head as something that could very easily happen. That would totally freak me out.

[sarah1972]

This brings back bad childhood memories. Growing up in (West) Germany, there was this constant fear. Emergency drills, tests of the public alert systems (sirens), we had to learn the different types of alerts for different kinds of attacks. It was expected that Germany would get caught in the middle.

Marches and rallies to protest adding more nukes on German soil.

It was a great relief when that finally was over and nuclear missiles did get dismantled. (START I and START II treaty)

Is it comparable to today? No. Not yet. I really hope they find a quick diplomatic solution to end this craziness.

Back then, right up until the fall of the Soviet Union, the threat was very real.  We actually came very close a couple of times to launching at each other.  So that sort of stuff from the movie was a constant thing just under the surface in the mind.

We had a drill in the Army for actions to take in case we came under attack from tactical nukes.  That also was a real possibility had war ever occurred in Europe.  Basically the drill was to lay on the ground face down, eyes closed, and hope for the best.  We also carried around radiation dose meters that would tell us how much radiation we had absorbed.

Fortunately none of that ever happened.



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[Deborah]

I think most of us back then, at least in the Army, expected that if war broke out that we would die.  That was particularly true in Korea.  I was on a small outpost located about 10 meters from the border on top of a small bald hill.  We were in range of several thousand NK artillery pieces and expected to be one of the first targets. 

We joked about it and didn't really worry about it though because there wasn't a thing we could do about it.


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[MaryT]

...
And why lie and tell people they could survive a nuclear blast when they didn't have a prayer of living through it? It makes no sense.
...

I'm sure that the authorities were well aware that the "precautions" would have little effect.  I think that the advice was issued so that the plebs would think that their needs were being addressed while the V.I.P.s and their families were evacuated to the really safe bunkers, deep underground.  Whether there would be anything worth coming out of the bunkers for, even after many years, is another matter.

[Jenntrans]

I think most of us back then, at least in the Army, expected that if war broke out that we would die.  That was particularly true in Korea.  I was on a small outpost located about 10 meters from the border on top of a small bald hill.  We were in range of several thousand NK artillery pieces and expected to be one of the first targets. 

We joked about it and didn't really worry about it though because there wasn't a thing we could do about it.


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Exactly. NOKO can't afford enough nukes and maybe not even afford an efficient way of delivering them. Right now they are testing us and gauging our reaction. I don't see Kim Jun Un and North Korea as much as a threat as just a nuisance. To me it is almost like a mosquito buzzing in your ear. Eventually China will get tired of having to reign him in and Russia will get tired of reigning him in and the People in NOKO may get tired of seeing a fat man in ruling them while they are starving to death while he eats really good. He probably has spies and operatives in South Korea that bring him Big Macs and French fries on a daily basis.

Yeah Deborah I was stationed in South Korea too and everything that South Korea and the US military does in South Korea does is for defensive purposes instead of offensive. I have seen many University demonstrations and I won't talk too much about it but North Korea had a lot of "Implants" that preached reunification on the Universities.

But I will say if they ever do strike a US city with a Nuke then it will probably be NYC or LA. That will cause the most damage so outside of there the rest of the country is pretty safe. Hell all they are doing is testing right now. Maybe it is time to nip it in the bud to keep it from blooming.

It was bad back in the '50s but we beat them back way past the 38th parallel until the Chinese got involved then we came under and Armistice but still at technically at war. But now with Russia, China and the US having the most nukes? China and Russia don't want that. So maybe one of these countries will take him out before he launches a real nuke. That may even be in the works now as we speak. So to me not too much to be afraid of. I have serious doubts that he has the capability to strike the US with a Nuke because if so this man would be crazy enough to use it. So far it has just been missile tests and that is it.

[Alenko]

You know I gotta say that I'm not a fan on Nation-building and the consequential effects that follow through, but when it comes to North Korea it feels like engaging the country is The One Ring and I'm Gollum. There's so much intellectual potential that's being kept from the world. It's truly sad.

[Cassi]

Wow, I didn't even know this thread existed.
As others have said we use to have air raid drills and would have to duck and cover. 
I remember as a kid in the 1950s having nightmares and looking out the window and seeing a mushroom cloud.

North Korea's leader is insane and sadly the people of north korea have been told and they have no way of knowing otherwise that south korea and the us attacked them.

Their technology is still a lot weaker than ours, the soviets, china, etc.

[Dani]

North Korea's leader is insane ...

That is not the only country with an insane leader.

Their technology is still a lot weaker than ours, the soviets, china, etc.

Where do you think that North Korea is getting all the latest missile technology? Their launchers look very similar to Russian mobile missile launchers. They managed to develop long range missiles very rapidly, faster than the US or Russian missile programs. North Korea is getting help from someone.

[Cassi]

You know, now that you mention it, I'm beginning to see how the Greys kinda look like North Koreans.

[Deborah]

North Koreans are no different than South Koreans other than that they have been denied information and propagandized since birth, Fox News on steroids.  Since South Koreans are really fine people and have always been extremely friendly toward us, I'm sure that the North Korean people are fine people too. 


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[Paige]

North Koreans are no different than South Koreans other than that they have been denied information and propagandized since birth, Fox News on steroids.  Since South Koreans are really fine people and have always been extremely friendly toward us, I'm sure that the North Korean people are fine people too. 

And to extend this excellent point a bit, I would say most people on this planet are really fine people.  If we could just keep sociopaths and narcissists out of positions of power we would be in much better shape.

[barbie]

I am reading the popular and inspiring book, "Guns, Germs and Steel" by Jared Diamond, thinking about a  state and its people. Fear and violence has been the essential tool for a state to control its own people or even subjugate other people. It has been universal, although the degree can differ greatly depending on the time and the place.

Ignorance leads to fear, fear leads to hate, and hate leads to violence.

The following YouTube video is very informative in sketching what ordinary North Koreans have been educated to fear.



Here in S. Korea, I was the same, incessantly reminded of a sudden invasion from N. Korea. N. Korean leaders fear any possible attack from the U.S., as much as some ordinary Americans did with the Soviet Union and now with N. Korea.

The first engagement of the U.S. with the Korean problem (or issue) traces back to as early as 1905, when the secret, Taft–Katsura agreement was made between the U.S. and Japan, just after the Russo-Japanese war. A very few Americans may be familiar with this historical context regarding not only the conflicts between S. and N. Korea, but broadly the Pacific war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taft%E2%80%93Katsura_agreement

barbie~~

[Tessa James]

Thank you Barbie,

One of the values of this Place is our international membership and engagement.  All of us are subject to our early socialization and the continued propaganda that is now digitally incessant.  I appreciate the varied perspectives that are shared here and the advocates for better understanding and peaceful collaboration.  I trust that we can still learn from each other.

[Roll]

The first engagement of the U.S. with the Korean problem (or issue) traces back to as early as 1905, when the secret, Taft–Katsura agreement was made between the U.S. and Japan, just after the Russo-Japanese war. A very few Americans may be familiar with this historical context regarding not only the conflicts between S. and N. Korea, but broadly the Pacific war.

Though back then, the US was very much just interested in the Philippines and any of Japan's potential ambitions towards them. I'd be surprised if they gave much of any consideration to Korea beyond just being happy to let Japan focus on the continent.

[barbie]

I appreciate the varied perspectives that are shared here and the advocates for better understanding and peaceful collaboration.  I trust that we can still learn from each other.

Sure! We can learn from each other.

Though back then, the US was very much just interested in the Philippines and any of Japan's potential ambitions towards them. I'd be surprised if they gave much of any consideration to Korea beyond just being happy to let Japan focus on the continent.

While history is not a must in the US, it is a required course here in Korea from elementary school to college.

Before 1905, while the U.S. was seeking a isolationist, other European countries once tried to take Korea as their colony (e.g., France and England) in the late 19th century. But the major players were China, Russia and Japan that are geographically very close to the Korean peninsula: the first Sino-Japanese war in 1894, followed by the Russo-Japanese war in 1905, and the second Sino-Japanese war in 1937. The US was not any major player, which was confirmed by the Taft–Katsura agreement.

The major engagement of the U.S. in the Korean peninsula started in 1945 after the defeat of Japan. The first human tragedy after the US engagement occurred here in Jeju island where I currently live.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeju_uprising

Most of the survived local people here still remember it, and it has been traumatic and dark history. Near my house, there are several abandoned villages, as all of the residents were killed or evacuated in 1948.

barbie~~

[Julia1996]

Too bad south Korea is attached to north Korea. It would save a lot of time and stress to send a couple of missiles to north Korea and turn it into a huge sheet of glass. But there's no way to do that without killing everyone in south Korea at the same time.

[Dena]

Too bad south Korea is attached to north Korea. It would save a lot of time and stress to send a couple of missiles to north Korea and turn it into a huge sheet of glass. But there's no way to do that without killing everyone in south Korea at the same time.

Remember that its not the people but the government that's the problem. Most of the people suffer and only obey because the alternative is death. The government is a third generation dictator who retains power by fear. Removing just a few high level officials would be sufficient to end the current government.

[Roll]

Or, and hear me out, kidnap all their unicorns. Okay, I guess there's really nothing to hear me out on, that is the whole of it.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/nov/30/unicorn-lair-discovered-north-korea

(Seriously though, that is the sort of government we are dealing with unfortunately. Not that I am going to throw too many stones in this house made out of glass. Also unfortunately, it is the North Korean people who have to live that reality on a daily basis. :/)