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The biology of how we all become whoever we are

Started by josie76, June 20, 2017, 07:39:39 AM

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josie76

So I've had more and more trouble dealing with friends of friends on facebook reposting anti-LGBT memes or interviews, articles ect. Yes I know I should grow a thick skin or cut them out but so far I'm still not "out" despite my hair and earrings. I have a number of aquaintences through work across a large geographical area, so I see the more moderates and the bible thumpers both show up. I recently reacted to an article a local older business man posted that started out as an anaylsis of the last election then somehow the interviewee turned to calling "->-bleeped-<-", "subjective feelings" of individuals that should not have any special protections. So I just responded with a long really basic explanation that science had proved brain structure differences, ect. He responded by saying "science" has been argued for centuries and that XX/XY was fact and fact is what mattered. OK so here I know, how does genetics become a fact if it wasn't science, right????? ??? My response was that the job of science was to find facts and that knowledge of facts changes over time as new facts are discovered. I mentioned how the world was once "known" to be flat based on the facts of the day. I also mentioned how if he had family in one of the LGBT groups that listening to the facts becomes easier otherwise its far to easy to put the "unusual" into the box of "undesireable". He did not respond to that one.

In this whole process I started thinking about gathering alot of the research I have done so far in understanding how people become people. How the body and brain develop. I had the idea that compiling a timeline of scientific fact could be useful in the right circumstances to deal with anti-LGBT messages, IF you are talking to an generally non extremist person who just sees the stuff in the news and finds it weird or funny. Maybe some would open their minds. With that preface story, here is what I have at this point. Please let me know if anyone thinks this is a good idea or not. I have a habit of running away with ideas that aren't always useful sooo.








Gender and sex development: how we all become who we are.


Development of physical sex and neural based gender identity is a far more complex process that many who only under stand the concept of XX / XY genetics would like to believe. Fetal development of humans and all mammals is an extremely complex string of events which must happen flawlessly for "normal" gender and sex to happen. Since the Y chromosome is the trigger for male differentation we will start there.

The Y Chromosome:
The Y chromosome is nearly void of anything but replicated genetic information. The exception is the presence of the gene SRY (Sex-Reversal Y). This gene creates a protein called the Testes Determining Factor (TDF). This is the only chemical that can begin the process to create a male child. A secondary gene SOX-9 is nessecary to work with the TDF protein created by the SRY gene. While lack of TDF protein will allow a secondary gene DAX-1 to down regulate gene SOX-9.

Sexual Formation:

Internal Organ Development:
In the beginning of development the gonads form as two sets of cells, forming two regions, a medulla and cortex. The absence of TDF will result in formation of ovarian tissues from the cortex. The presence of TDF will form testes from the medulla. In the male, the newly forming Sertoli Cells of the Testes will make Anti-Mullerian Hormone (AMH). The AMH hormone has two effects. To begin with it will stimulate formation of another Testis cell type, the Leydig Cells. These will begin secreting basic testosterone hormone.

What can happen:
First, a mutated SRY gene can create a perfectly fertile woman with XY genetics by not creating testes. A mutation on the cells receptor for TDF could also cause this. The opposite can also happen where a genetic XX man can develop if one of the X chromosomes from the father received a crossed over SRY gene during sperm generation.
Secondly, any interference with the activity of the TDF activity can cause a delay in the formation of testes cell and have already partially created ovarian tissues. Such a case is called Ovatesties. This can be from external chemical interference such as medications taken by the mother.

The next tissues I will discuss are both present in every fetus. These will form the male or the female organs except for the gonads. Both sets of tissues are formed and waiting by the 8th week.
Wolffian Ducts: These form the male ducts and vas deferns. These will fade away and be absorbed unless an androgen hormone such as testosterone and its much more powerful derivative DHT (dihydrotestosterone).
Mullerian Ducts: These will form oviducts, uterus, and most of the vagina. If AMH is not produced by the Sertoli teste's cells, then these will continue to grow and develop by default. AMH will otherwise cause these tissues to fade and be absorbed. Ovaries are not required for these tissues to develop. They are cell autonomous and are only stopped by the presence of AMH.

What can happen:
Genetic caused Androgen Insensitivity can cause the Wolffian ducts to partially or completely fade away. AIS (Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome) is a genetic condition that can cause mild to full insensitivity of the bodies cells to androgen hormones. AIS is related mutations of the X chromosome located gene AR (Androgen Receptor).
Secondly, chemical / medication caused blockage of AMH activity or late production of AMH can result in a born male child who has partial female internal organs such as a partial or complete uterus. Some cases have shown the uterus being connected through the large intestine.

All of these regulating hormone interactions must take place and have full effect early in fetal growth. Any delay in regulating hormones can allow tissues to develop beyond the point where the regulating hormone has its normal effect on them. In a normal scenerio the testes tissues have been formed by the 7th week. The ovarian tissues wait a bit longer but are formed by the 12th week of pregnancy. The regulating hormones are active much earlier than this to differentiate the cells into the proper tissues.

External Genitalia Formation:
Before sexual differentation occurs the outside tissues are the same for all babies. These are called the genital turbicle, labrioscrotal folds, and gental folds.
With the effect of the hormone DHT (dihyrotestosterone)
Genital turbicle forms glands and shaft of the penis
Labrioscrotal folds for the scrotum
Genital folds fuse and form the penile urethra. 
Without the effect of the hormone DHT
Genital turbicle forms clitoris
Labrioscrotal folds form the labia majora
Genital folds for the labia minor and vaginal end

What can happen:
The hormone DHT is the masculizing derivitive of testosterone. However its formation requires the enzyme alpha5-reductase. Each molecule of DHT requires one molecule of alpha5-reductase and one free testosterone molecule to be formed.
Mutations in the gene producing this enzyme will feminize the exterior genital appearance. Degree of feminization / masculinzation depends on enzyme activity in producing DHT.
Secondly, any of the mutations to the AR gene will effect the degree of effect DHT has on the forming tissues.

Brain Formation:

The human brain develops in specific stages. Each region of the brain is associated with different functions of life, senses, body functions, instinctual drive, emotions, thought processes. Specific segments are influenced by the presence of the hormone DHT during their development. DHT has a direct impact on the volume of these regions, the count of neural cells, and the developed neural structure patterns. These differences create the different instincts, thought processes, and emotional handling of the male and female brain. There is a specific limited time for a segment to be in a state that can be affected by DHT. Once this stage is past that region is "hard wired" for life. The neural structures cannot be changed.

Regions known effected by androgen exposure:
Hypothalamus INH2 = 2x larger male brain, assoc sexual attraction/sexual preference/orientation in all mammals, 3rd trimester
Hypothalamus INH3 = 2.8x larger male brain, neuron count and structure differences, assoc maternal instincts in female brain, volume, neural structures found specific to the gender of the brain, 2nd trimester
Hypothalamus BSTc = = gender specific volume, number cells, number neurons
Hypothalamus preopticanterior region = gender specific volume, number cells, neuron structures
Massa Intermedia = 53% larger female brain
Anterior Commissure = 12% larger female brain
Corpus Callosum = size difference based on brain gender seen. 1 claim of being a clinical diagnostic location for gender of the brain, the corpus callosum interconnects the left and right hemispheres of the brain and many subsections.
Corpus Callosum, Splenium = shape is gender brain specific, this is the posterior part
Left Angular Gyrus = functions auditory, visual, language inputs
Left Inferior Parietal Lobe = section contains the Left Angular Gyrus, submarginal gyrus
Cortical Thickness = Cortical layer is thicker in female gender brain.
Left hemisphere: frontal, orbitao-frontal lobe, central sulcus, perisylvian region, paracental cortex
Right hemisphere: pre/post central gyrus, parietal cortex, temporal cortex, precuneus, fusiform gyrus, lingual gyrus, orbito-frontal gyrus

What can happen:

All of these regions require androgen hormones to be present during the specific development period. If the level of androgen is low the region will wire its neural structures in a female manner. It's also possible to be partially viralized by low amounts of androgen hormone creating a structure partly between the "normal" male and female neural structures.
AIS can result in low virilization as the cells are less able to be effected by androgen hormones.

Outside chemicals in the mother can effect this as well. One well known drug called DES (diethylstilbestrol) is a synthetic estrogen like chemical that was thought to help prevent miscarriage. In the late a960's it became associated with female children developing a rare vaginal cancer. In 1971 the US FDA counter-indicated it for miscarriage prevention as a direct treatment. This means miscarriage was no longer a "labeled" use of the drug. There is a good deal of evidence that pharma companies continued added lower does of DES to prescription prenatal vitamins. It was also not uncommon for doctors to continue to prescribe it directly. The FDA banned it in the year 2000 for human uses. In the decades before DES was tied to a higher than normal number of children born with ambiguous genitalia. There was also a large number of otherwise male looking babies with undecended testicles and other genital development issues. At the time no one considered it would have any effect on the brain, as phycologists were quite firm in assuring everyone that only by raising children did any gender differences result in their behavior. DES was found to fully activate all estrogen receptors and block the androgen receptor actively by 75% with a blood concentration of 1um (1micromolar).











Terms:

TDF = testes determining factor, a protein signal produced by a normal SRY gene that signals the undifferentiated gonad cells to form testes.
AMH = Anti-Mullerian Hormone, chemical signal that causes testes to form Leydig cells which will produce Testosterone hormone. Also causes the stop to growth in the Mullerian Ducts and eventual absorbtion.
Androgen = name for the group of testosterone like hormones.
Testosterone = the base hormone produced by combining enzymes and cholesterol.
DHT = dihydrotestosterone, the primary superactive masculinizing hormone. Required for sexual differentation of genitalia.
5a-reductase = alpha5-reductase, an enzyme which is needed to produce DHT from testosterone.
Aromatase = an enzyme which is needed to produce estradiol hormone from testosterone in the ovary.
Estradiol = the primary superactive estrogen.
SRY gene = gene which produces the TDF protein located on the Y chromosome.
AR gene = gene which controls the androgen receptor molecular structure in all cells.
SOX-9 gene = gene activated by the TDF protein.
DAX-1 gene = gene active with no/low TDF protein, surpresses SOX-9 gene activity.
04/26/2018 bi-lateral orchiectomy

A lifetime of depression and repressed emotions is nothing more than existence. I for one want to live now not just exist!

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Deborah

I think it's an admirable idea but ultimately a waste of time.  The people you want to reach think in terms of dogma; they do not think in terms of facts.  So presenting facts will have no impact.


Conform and be dull. —James Frank Dobie, The Voice of the Coyote
Love is not obedience, conformity, or submission. It is a counterfeit love that is contingent upon authority, punishment, or reward. True love is respect and admiration, compassion and kindness, freely given by a healthy, unafraid human being....  - Dan Barker

U.S. Army Retired
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zirconia

Hi, Josie

I found this intriguing and worthwhile. It must have taken quite some time and effort to compile it. If I may make one suggestion, I'd love it if you could also include references to the sources. It might make the article more persuasive to people who base their own opinions on what they've learnt elsewhere. (I know at least one person to whom anything published is more trustworthy than something he hears directly, even if the one he hears it from is an authority in the field...)
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KathyLauren

The people you are arguing with don't want the facts.  When they don't like your facts, they just make up their own.  It's a losing battle.
2015-07-04 Awakening; 2015-11-15 Out to self; 2016-06-22 Out to wife; 2016-10-27 First time presenting in public; 2017-01-20 Started HRT!!; 2017-04-20 Out publicly; 2017-07-10 Legal name change; 2019-02-15 Approval for GRS; 2019-08-02 Official gender change; 2020-03-11 GRS; 2020-09-17 New birth certificate
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josie76

zirconia, I can list the brain studies since I did keep a record of them specifically. I did not keep a record of every medical paper I read but much of the information is identically posted on the wikiopedia site.

Kathy and Deborah, I know many are simply angered by anyone giving them facts that don't fit with their personal belief system. Fear of that which a person does not understand is commonplace. I suppose my thought is that the "undecided" populace might come to an understanding that these are REAL issues faced by REAL people. Otherwise they get caught up in the making fun of "sport" that trans bashing seems to be.




As far as the studies listed

Gorski, Gordon, Shrayne, Southham 1978
   Medial proptic nucleas (MPON)

Allen, Hines, Shrayne, Gorski 1989
   Hypothalamus regions
      INAH3       2.8 times larger  in men
      INAH2       2 times larger in men
      Regions known to influence:
         gonotropin secretion,
maternal behavior in females,
sexual behavior in mammals

Allen 1989:    associated area with sexual functions
LeVay 1991:   associated area with sexual orientation

Allen, Gorski 1991
   Shape of splenium of corpus callosum
   Massa intermedia    53% larger in women
   Anterior commissure    12% larger in women

Hoffman, Swaab
   Preoptic anterior region of hypothalamus different between male and female volume, number cells, neural structure

Garcia, Falgueras, Swaab 2008      hypothalamus
   Region INAH3 volume and number of neurons in trans person matches the identified gender.

Zhou, Hoffman, Gooren, Swaab 1995   hypothalamus
   Region BSTc  volume and number cells in trans person matches the identified gender

Kruijver 2000            hypothalamus
   Region BSTc number neurons in trans person matches the identified gender

Yokota, Kawamura, Kameya 2005
   Corpus callosum: claim to be able to make clinical diagnosis based on size

Rametti, Carrillo, Gomez-Gil, Junque 2011
   White Matter microstructures in transwomen similar to cis women

Simon, Kozak, Simon 2013
   Grey Matter cerebellum, left angular gyrus, left inferior parietal lobe match identified gender

Zubiarre, Elorza 2013
   Transwomen: feminization regions of right hemisphere
   Transmen: substantial subcortal masculinization

Luders 2012
   Cortical thickness of transwomen similar to ciswomen and greater than cismen.
   Left hemisphere: frontal, orbitao-frontal lobe, central sulcus, perisylvian region, paracental cortex
   Right hemisphere: pre/post central gyrus, parietal cortex, temporal cortex, precuneus, fusiform
      Lingual, orbito-frontal gyrus

Behavioral Studies:

Bao, Swaab 2011
   Showed rearing could not override inborn gender identity

Mathews, Fane, Conway, Brook, Hines 2009
Nordenstrm, Servin, Bohlin, Larsson, Wedell 2002

   Both studies found prenatal androgen levels significantly effects play behavior and personality characteristics

Other studies:

Govier, Diamond, Wolowiec, Slade 2010
   Hearing response to particular sounds, trans people reacted similar to identified gender

Berglund, Lindstrom, Dheine-Helmy, Savic 2008
   Smell: response to a particular scent, trans people reacted similar to identified gender (active brain scan)

Autoszewski, Zadzinski, Foczpanski 2009
   Teeth: transgender tooth pattern difference (has something to do with the front teeth but one study of dentists could only identify male, female teeth accurately 50% of the time. The other 50% of the samples were ambiguous and no correct ID trend was found)
04/26/2018 bi-lateral orchiectomy

A lifetime of depression and repressed emotions is nothing more than existence. I for one want to live now not just exist!

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Lady Sarah

At best, they may declare your facts to be "fake news". It has more to do with the mindsets of people, and less with what is understandable. It may be more conducive to argue with a wall.
started HRT: July 13, 1991
orchi: December 23, 1994
trach shave: November, 1998
married: August 16, 2015
Back surgery: October 20, 2016
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HappyMoni

Josie,
    We do live in a soundbite world these days. I don't see  people having a very long attention span. I suspect you will have a bigger impact when you come out and people see you, a 'normal' person are trans. It is much harder for people to hate a group when they know and like someone in that group. I would not discourage your work if you think it might help.
Moni
If I ever offend you, let me know. It's not what I am about.
"Never let the dark kill your light!"  (SailorMars)

HRT June 11, 2015. (new birthday) - FFS in late June 2016. (Dr. _____=Ugh!) - Full time June 18, 2016 (Yeah! finally) - GCS June 27, 2017. (McGinn=Yeah!) - Under Eye repair from FFS 8/17/17 - Nose surgery-November 20, 2017 (Dr. Papel=Yeah) - Hair Transplant on June 21, 2018 (Dr. Cooley-yeah) - Breast Augmentation on July 10, 2018 (Dr. Basner in Baltimore) - Removed bad scarring from FFS surgery near ears and hairline in August, 2018 (Dr. Papel) -Sept. 2018, starting a skin regiment on face with Retin A  April 2019 -repairing neck scar from FFS

]
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zirconia

Hi, Josie

Thanks! Even the distribution of the studies by year alone would seem significant. More studies appear to be made recently than in the past—partly due to greater awareness, I'm sure, but as parts of a jigsaw puzzle click together it also becomes easier to locate and position remaining pieces. I tend to think that once the puzzle is complete, it will be harder for people to debate or deny the existence of a picture.

If you also kept the names and issues of the publications referenced—e.g. LeVay S (1991) A difference in hypothalamic structure between heterosexual and homosexual men. Science 253:1034 –1037.—I believe that including those as well would be well worthwhile.
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laurenb

Thanks Josie. This is such a great summary of the biology. If most people were as scientifically literate as you, this wouldn't even be a conversation. But yet many Americans think dinosaurs and humans were contemporaneous. I had a similar experience and looked at it from yet a different biological angle. I found that the evidence of gender variance and/or the existence of multiple genders in both high and low level species is pretty overwhelming. So in that sense, trans individuals are all over the evolutionary tree. Being an avid amatuer horticulturist I always loved that there are plants that spontaneously change gender, are both genders, are separate genders in different parts of the same individual or are single genders....like why wouldn't there be. Evolution thrives on variance.

Moreover, if one takes that mountain of modern biological observational and laboratory research and add to it the large historical and anthropological record of the existence of transgender folks in cultures all over the world across recorded history, you just come to the conclusion that denying our existence has everything to do with belief systems and nothing at all to do with fact.
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Paige

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Dan

Quote from: Deborah on June 20, 2017, 08:03:17 AM
I think it's an admirable idea but ultimately a waste of time.  The people you want to reach think in terms of dogma; they do not think in terms of facts.  So presenting facts will have no impact.


Conform and be dull. —James Frank Dobie, The Voice of the Coyote

True, and in the same vein as global warming deniers. There is no point in providing them with facts. However, the facts are fascinating and do remind me of my embryology class at uni too many years ago. Thanks for your efforts, it's a neat summary of a complex subject area.
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natalie.ashlyne

Very good job you did your home work. My doctors assistant basically broke it down the same way I am very impressed to me it makes total scents once again great work   
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RobynTx

What's Facebook?

I quit Facebook about six months ago and have been happier ever since. Plus my blood pressure is better.


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kelly_aus

Whilst this is certainly interesting and well laid out, it's not going to work for a whole bunch of people, mostly those with a fundamentalist bent. Others won't believe it because, well, stupidity is common - 7% of the US population thinks chocolate milk comes from brown cows..
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Devlyn

I thought we got chocolate milk when the milker reached too far back....

<running away>
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AnneK

Quote from: kelly_aus on June 23, 2017, 05:53:56 PM
7% of the US population thinks chocolate milk comes from brown cows..

I did too, way back when I was a pre-schooler.  However, it didn't take me long to grow out of that notion.
I'm a 65 year old male who has been thinking about SRS for many years.  I also was a  full cross dresser for a few years.  I wear a bra, pantyhose and nail polish daily because it just feels right.

Started HRT April 17, 2019.
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Miss Clara

Thanks, Josie.  Good post.  Facts are facts and deserve to be called out often.  Many will resist, but a seed will be planted.  Some of those seeds will germinate, grow, and bear fruit.  Others will not.  Ultimately, science will win out even if fossilized brains can't adapt.  Keep it up.
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Deborah

Quote from: kelly_aus on June 23, 2017, 05:53:56 PM
7% of the US population thinks chocolate milk comes from brown cows..
According to a recent Gallup Poll more than 40% of people in the US think that the earth and humans were created in their present form less than 10,000 years ago.

We are hopeless :-(



Conform and be dull. —James Frank Dobie, The Voice of the Coyote
Love is not obedience, conformity, or submission. It is a counterfeit love that is contingent upon authority, punishment, or reward. True love is respect and admiration, compassion and kindness, freely given by a healthy, unafraid human being....  - Dan Barker

U.S. Army Retired
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natalie.ashlyne

Quote from: kelly_aus on June 23, 2017, 05:53:56 PM
- 7% of the US population thinks chocolate milk comes from brown cows..

what do you mean chocolate milk does not come from brown cows next you will be telling us strawberry milk does not come from pink cows either  :icon_confused:
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SleepyJess

Hi Josie  :), I don't post much here. But thanks for the awesome post. I'll make use of it in the future (not the post itself but the info). I've noticed transphobes tend to spam the infamous 2015 brain study in attempts to delegitimize me. I do tend to explain the genetic stuff to people and they tend to run off by that point. I know there is over 20 years of publications but haven't seen them all accumulated like you have. so Thx for that.  :)
I deleted everyone off facebook and my account a long while ago.
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