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20/20 hindsight

Started by Megan., September 27, 2017, 04:10:51 PM

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zirconia

Quote from: Allie24 on October 09, 2017, 07:07:10 PM"Blatant," as I understand it, means "obvious."

Yes, obvious as in completely lacking in subtlety, obtrusive to the eye, or open and unashamed. An older usage is "offensive to the ear."
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Allie24

Quote from: zirconia on October 10, 2017, 07:46:08 AM
Yes, obvious as in completely lacking in subtlety, obtrusive to the eye, or open and unashamed. An older usage is "offensive to the ear."

Right, so to say something is "blatantly male behavior" implies that it is behavior that is obviously attributable to a male person, which I find to be an incorrect statement for several reasons. The proper term would have been "stereotypical male behavior."

I apologize to you, Roll, if my response came across as an attack. I think that we, as trans women, should not be so harsh towards those who share our birth sex, as every negative thing we say about them for the sex they were born as can be thrown right back at us because we were born with the same body parts.

Plus, I know a lot of gay cis women who drool over female celebrities' bodies and say nothing of their clothing lol
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Roll

I don't want to get into an argument about grammar and hijack the thread, but it is really over analysis of a very common phrasing that has no ill intent. :D

I do stand by the word choice as not sexist towards men and accurate in my usage. I referenced what is certainly considered a stereotypical male behavior in regards to a group of teenage boys, and one that is not an unjust stereotype (even if many do it just to fit in themselves as teenagers, they still do it). That is just how the majority of teenage boys are, and "blatantly male" is certainly synonymous with "stereotypically male" in this context. I never made the statement it applied to all men, simply that it is an obviously (to use that word as well) male behavior towards women. Which again, is not a statement that it applies to all men or precludes women from engaging in the same behavior towards men. Word choice does matter, I agree, but I don't believe this qualified as something that needed caveats and disclaimers in the middle of a thread about hindsight (ie: this wasn't a discussion explicitly about male or female behavior, but rather the disconnect with the world around us growing up, in such a thread I would have mentioned caveats galore).

(That last post was as I was typing this, so doesn't flow quite right,  but I have to finish getting ready so can't really go back and look over this to make sure it works. :D)
~ Ellie
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I ALWAYS WELCOME PMs!
(I made the s lowercase so it didn't look as much like PMS... ;D)

An Open Letter to anyone suffering from anxiety, particularly those afraid to make your first post or continue posting!

8/30/17 - First Therapy! The road begins in earnest.
10/20/17 - First coming out (to my father)!
12/16/17 - BEGAN HRT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
5/21/18 - FIRST DAY OUT AS ME!!!!!!!!!
6/08/18 - 2,250 Hair Grafts
6/23/18 - FIRST PRIDE!
8/06/18 - 100%, completely out!
9/08/18 - I'M IN LOVE!!!!
2/27/19 - Name Change!

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Allie24

Quote from: Roll on October 10, 2017, 09:00:45 AM
I don't want to get into an argument about grammar and hijack the thread, but it is really over analysis of a very common phrasing that has no ill intent. :D

I do stand by the word choice as not sexist towards men and accurate in my usage. I referenced what is certainly considered a stereotypical male behavior in regards to a group of teenage boys, and one that is not an unjust stereotype (even if many do it just to fit in themselves as teenagers, they still do it). That is just how the majority of teenage boys are, and "blatantly male" is certainly synonymous with "stereotypically male" in this context. I never made the statement it applied to all men, simply that it is an obviously (to use that word as well) male behavior towards women. Which again, is not a statement that it applies to all men or precludes women from engaging in the same behavior towards men. Word choice does matter, I agree, but I don't believe this qualified as something that needed caveats and disclaimers in the middle of a thread about hindsight (ie: this wasn't a discussion explicitly about male or female behavior, but rather the disconnect with the world around us growing up, in such a thread I would have mentioned caveats galore).

(That last post was as I was typing this, so doesn't flow quite right,  but I have to finish getting ready so can't really go back and look over this to make sure it works. :D)

I'll agree to disagree in regards to the word's use.

So as to continue the theme of this thread, I'll make a contribution:

At the age of 13 there was a time in which my breasts swelled and I had the hope that I would grow into a woman and my parents would have to change my name and buy me new clothes... didn't happen lol at least not then.
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Bari Jo

Okay, let's get back on topic:)

Maybe a bit too graphic and on the nose, but I wanted this thread to get back on topic since it was one of my favoritess.  I remember fooling around with a boy when I was really young about 9.  We didn't know what we were doing and it was really dry humping simulating what we saw on TV.  I was always the girl and on the bottom in these simulations.  Of course then we were caught and he wasn't allowed to play with me any more, since well, I'm deviant. The repressing probably started after this, not sure.
you know how far the universe extends outward? i think i go inside just as deep.

10/11/18 - out to the whole world.  100% friends and family support.
11/6/17 - came out to sister, best day of my life
9/5/17 - formal diagnosis and stopping DIY in favor if prescribed HRT
6/18/17 - decided to stop fighting the trans beast, back on DIY.
Too many ups and downs, DIY, purges of self inbetween dates.
Age 10 - suppression and denial began
Age 8 - knew I was different
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Megan.

Amongst my many 'masculine' childhood hobbies of ballet,  singing in the choir and figure skating. I did enjoy the choir as I got to wear my outfit including a cassock,  which was basically a dress,  with an nice frilly ruff around my neck.

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LizK

Quote from: meganjames2 on October 11, 2017, 02:16:39 PM
Amongst my many 'masculine' childhood hobbies of ballet,  singing in the choir and figure skating. I did enjoy the choir as I got to wear my outfit including a cassock,  which was basically a dress,  with an nice frilly ruff around my neck.

Sent from my MI 5s using Tapatalk

I was an "altar boy" for many years and received quite a hard time for being as old as I was and wanting to still partake. I loved being able to "Frock Up" with all he white lace and the long cassock which to me was just a dress. I think it might have helped relieve my GD in some small way as I always enjoyed the dressing up more than the actual job....getting caught "twirling my skirts" wasn't the best for my "masculine" image but it was a priest and he just looked at me oddly and never said another word but then I did play the violin, tennis and sing in the choir as hobbies ...Megan I can relate   ;D
Transition Begun 25 September 2015
HRT since 17 May 2016,
Fulltime from 8 March 2017,
GCS 4 December 2018
Voice Surgery 01 February 2019
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Megan.

Quote from: ElizabethK on October 12, 2017, 04:36:52 AM
I was an "altar boy" for many years and received quite a hard time for being as old as I was and wanting to still partake. I loved being able to "Frock Up" with all he white lace and the long cassock which to me was just a dress. I think it might have helped relieve my GD in some small way as I always enjoyed the dressing up more than the actual job....getting caught "twirling my skirts" wasn't the best for my "masculine" image but it was a priest and he just looked at me oddly and never said another word but then I did play the violin, tennis and sing in the choir as hobbies ...Megan I can relate   ;D
Although like the rest of my puberty,  it came late,  when my voice finally broke,  it really upset me.

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Bari Jo

I remember my voice breaking and crying about it.  I used to sing soprano in the glee club.  You haven't heard the lead chorus of Lion sleeps tonight correctly, till you hear it in a chipmunk high pitched voice.

I have a new one and this one surprised me about ten years ago.  I started collecting masks in college.  I originally bought one for a girl I was dating but she broke it off before I gave it to her since, well, me.  I decided I liked it and mounted it on the wall.  One became two, became ten, etc.  I noticed about ten years ago that I liked masks because I related to them, being me and hiding behind a constructed persona.  I wonder if my family realized this.  Half of them were gifts from them.

Bari Jo
you know how far the universe extends outward? i think i go inside just as deep.

10/11/18 - out to the whole world.  100% friends and family support.
11/6/17 - came out to sister, best day of my life
9/5/17 - formal diagnosis and stopping DIY in favor if prescribed HRT
6/18/17 - decided to stop fighting the trans beast, back on DIY.
Too many ups and downs, DIY, purges of self inbetween dates.
Age 10 - suppression and denial began
Age 8 - knew I was different
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big kim

Plenty signs but it took me til shortly after my 21st birthday to put them together. I hated boys haircuts, lucky it was the late 60s/early 70s so I grew it out. Wondering why all the other boys were terrified of playing a girl in the school play. Getting girls books from my Grandmother,getting picked on  by bullies until I fought back at 13, not much interest in sport.Many years later I found out one of my nicknames at school was Emily though by then no one would have dared say it!
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Geeker

#70
At the age of 10 I received a lacy white dress for Christmas by mistake and was disappointed when it was taken from me and given to my, at the time, stepsister. I started wishing I'd wake up as a girl around 10 1/2 years old. Later on, sometime around 12-13 years old I started crossdressing out of curiosity and found that I rather enjoyed how the clothes made me feel (though not necessarily how they made me look, they were way too big on me  :laugh:). When I was about to turn 16, I asked if I could have a "sweet 16" party, and was devastated when I was told by my mother that those are only for girls and that no, I couldn't have one.

One of my ex girlfriends from high school wore the same size as me and thought nothing of me wearing her clothes and vice versa, though she did like to constantly tell me I walk like a woman.

That's just off the top of my head. Of course, all that said, I'm neither on hrt nor out.
I'm not out, I'm not on E, unless things change I doubt I ever will be.
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Dani2118

I'm one of the shirt on girls. When I was 5or6 me, my friend Greg and my sister were in my back yard on a hot summer day. He says 'Let's take off our shirts, it hot'. My sister had hers off in a flash, I was real slow about it, and he said to her 'You cant do that because your a girl!' Well, that stopped me in my tracks! I'd never thought about it before, I finally took my shirt off, but put it back on as quick as I could! Since that day my shirt stays on and I cant sleep with out one either. I thought I was weird until I noticed that most women undress from the bottom up. I just played with my sister all the time, playing house [of course arguing over who was going to be mom, didn't everybody do that?], Barbies, putting makeup on[ drove Mom nuts, we weren't very good at it] until the shirt incident. Then that same summer there were some boys I was running around with, when one of them called another boy a 'Sissy Boy'. I didn't see what he did, but he got ragged on for 3 days and I thought 'if they knew what I was thinking they would never leave me alone'. That was when I learned to hide my 'girl inside'. It hurts to type that because it's taken 50yrs. to overcome those 3 days.
I finally get to be me, and I don't want today to be my last! That's a very nice feeling.  ;D ;D ;D
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Megan.

Quote from: Dani2118 on October 13, 2017, 10:53:08 PM
I'm one of the shirt on girls. When I was 5or6 me, my friend Greg and my sister were in my back yard on a hot summer day. He says 'Let's take off our shirts, it hot'. My sister had hers off in a flash, I was real slow about it, and he said to her 'You cant do that because your a girl!' Well, that stopped me in my tracks! I'd never thought about it before, I finally took my shirt off, but put it back on as quick as I could! Since that day my shirt stays on and I cant sleep with out one either. I thought I was weird until I noticed that most women undress from the bottom up. I just played with my sister all the time, playing house [of course arguing over who was going to be mom, didn't everybody do that?], Barbies, putting makeup on[ drove Mom nuts, we weren't very good at it] until the shirt incident. Then that same summer there were some boys I was running around with, when one of them called another boy a 'Sissy Boy'. I didn't see what he did, but he got ragged on for 3 days and I thought 'if they knew what I was thinking they would never leave me alone'. That was when I learned to hide my 'girl inside'. It hurts to type that because it's taken 50yrs. to overcome those 3 days.
Dani,  sorry for your pain,  and thank you for sharing.  X

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Lady Lisandra

I relate to most of what you say.

-I remember being very young, probably before primary school, and wishing I had been born a girl. With no apparent reason at all. I associated that feeling later with curiosity. I wanted to believe every person was curious about the other gender and wanted to "try it out". I remember the phrase "With all those X spermatozoons, why did a Y had to get into the ovule?"

-I allways got on better with the girls that with the boys. Boy games bored me. The rest of the boys seemed to be unable to socialize with girls... At seconday school my group of female friends just saw me as "another girl of the group", and would say and do things that they usually hide from men, like talking about menstruation. I was told a few times they sometimes forgot I was a boy. That was nice I think.

-I hated taking my shirt off, or being naked. Probably the reason why Itried to avoid swimming classes. I have a horrible tanning mark from going to the beach and keeping my shirt on all the time.

-I related to female fictional characters, and if I had the chance, I would pick female characters in video games. When I started with RPGs, I would create both male and female characters so I had a male one to play with when someone was around. I didn't want them to see me play as a girl. Of course, the ones with higher level were mostly female.

-I hated that men's cloting options were so limited, while girls had a lot to choose from.

-I also hated that men weren't allowed to be beautiful like girls. I wanted to epilate, put on makeup, have my nails done and have fabulous hair. I noticed that famous musicians were allowed to do all of them, so becaming a rockstar was an option.

-The first time I met face to face with a vagina, I was more curious than aroused. I was like "How does this thing work? What happens if I touch this? This definitely looks better than what I got. Why are my genitals so boring?"

- Lis -
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The Flying Lemur

Funny about the shirt thing!  As a kid, I used to like to have mine off.  I was very unhappy when my mother told me that I was too old to go running around shirtless, and I had to at least wear a halter top. 

I remember just lighting up inside whenever anyone confused me for a boy, and how disappointing it was when they learned the truth.  And OMG, I just remembered this . . . at 3 or 4, I had this weird skort thing with a flap in front.  I used to tuck it into the waistband so that it looked like I had something between my legs.  Then I'd take my shirt off and run around telling everyone my name was Robin (As in Batman and) and that I was a boy.  My cousins took this up and pretended with me. 

Nearly all my "lets pretend" personas were male.  As far as I can recall, all my Halloween costumes were of male or neutral characters. 

My family and friends, bless them, never gave me crap for any of this.  It's one of those unfair things that feminine boys are shamed and ostracized, but masculine girls aren't.  The first time I encountered real rejection was in adolescence, when all the boys looked at me as one of their guy friends and wouldn't date me.  I understood that they wanted girls who wore makeup and perfume and took time to dress prettily, and I wished I could be one of those girls, but I couldn't.  It was so much effort to try, and it felt so weird when I did it. 

I spent high school clomping around in combat boots and a men's bowling shirt with "Bob" sewn on the pocket, and I wondered why I couldn't get a boyfriend.  :p     
The privilege of a lifetime is being who you are. --Joseph Campbell
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Izzy Grace

Okay so... I so desperately needed Lisa Frank binders and they wouldn't let me have them. Those two dolphins in the classic LF tones suspended mid air? It was beautiful! I wanted them all.

I got them to let me collect stickers. Right there, in that little space, I got to be so girly. I had all the best and prettiest stickers. Holograms. Glitter. Kitties. Puffy Stickers. All the best 80s phrases, like "Way Cool" and "Radical". I miss that collection.

I also never took my shirt off. Not ever.
Starting Weight Oct 17: 234#  ♦  Current Weight 190#  ♦  Goal Weight: 155#  ♦  To Go: 35#



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Julia1996

Quote from: katiekatt on October 14, 2017, 11:13:13 AM
Okay so... I so desperately needed Lisa Frank binders and they wouldn't let me have them. Those two dolphins in the classic LF tones suspended mid air? It was beautiful! I wanted them all.

I got them to let me collect stickers. Right there, in that little space, I got to be so girly. I had all the best and prettiest stickers. Holograms. Glitter. Kitties. Puffy Stickers. All the best 80s phrases, like "Way Cool" and "Radical". I miss that collection.

I also never took my shirt off. Not ever.

What is a Lisa Frank binder??? You're MtF  so what did you need a binder for ?
Julia


Born 1998
Started hrt 2015
SRS done 5/21/2018
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Izzy Grace

Haha! Omg I'm SO old, lol. What a kick!

So in the 80's in grade school we all had three-ring binders. The biggest thing at that point was this company, Lisa Frank, that specialized in these super 80s hot colored images for girls. Only, there's no way you want one if you're a boy, and if you did... like me, you lie about it.  They had the pencil cases, the binders, stickers, everything.



Starting Weight Oct 17: 234#  ♦  Current Weight 190#  ♦  Goal Weight: 155#  ♦  To Go: 35#



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Megan.

Quote from: Julia1996 on October 14, 2017, 11:59:10 AM
What is a Lisa Frank binder??? You're MtF  so what did you need a binder for ?
I think it's for collecting stickers,  not flattening chests [emoji16].

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Julia1996

Quote from: katiekatt on October 14, 2017, 12:07:00 PM
Haha! Omg I'm SO old, lol. What a kick!

So in the 80's in grade school we all had three-ring binders. The biggest thing at that point was this company, Lisa Frank, that specialized in these super 80s hot colored images for girls. Only, there's no way you want one if you're a boy, and if you did... like me, you lie about it.  They had the pencil cases, the binders, stickers, everything.





Oh ok. You're talking about a notebook. Lol.  Those are pretty. No wonder you wanted one.
Julia


Born 1998
Started hrt 2015
SRS done 5/21/2018
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