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Does any of you guys do physical sports with cis guys?

Started by AquaWhatever, March 15, 2018, 03:21:42 PM

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AquaWhatever

So Saturday I'm training with a guy I work with. He's a boxer, and he doesn't know I'm trans.
(And I don't want him to know  ::))
(That stealth life)

We're not sparing but eventually we will.
Does anyone here play any kind of contact sport with cis guys?
Do you think it's a good idea?

I've heard from my trans guys it was a bad idea.
They still do physical sports with females (they're still pre t so I get it even though I wouldn't)
What do you bros think?
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Dex

I don't see why you couldn't or shouldn't play contact sports with a cis-guy.

Outside of concerns if you're going or hoping to go professional in a sport (where your use of testosterone may need to be explained) or concerns about him accidentally feeling your junk area (which can be mitigated by wearing a cup or a packer), there is absolutely no reason you shouldn't partake in friendly competition with a cis-guy. 

Traditional reasons people don't or wouldn't are more related to rules (see news of the ftm high school wrestler in Texas that is forced to compete against women), concerns about size (especially if they are pre-t and have not developed a more male physique) but outside of that - I don't know why you wouldn't. I've been in martial arts since pre-t and have sparred and grappled with plenty of cis-men (as well as cis-women) and it's never been an issue.
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AquaWhatever

Quote from: Dex on March 15, 2018, 03:27:15 PM
I don't see why you couldn't or shouldn't play contact sports with a cis-guy.

Outside of concerns if you're going or hoping to go professional in a sport (where your use of testosterone may need to be explained) or concerns about him accidentally feeling your junk area (which can be mitigated by wearing a cup or a packer), there is absolutely no reason you shouldn't partake in friendly competition with a cis-guy. 

Traditional reasons people don't or wouldn't are more related to rules (see news of the ftm high school wrestler in Texas that is forced to compete against women), concerns about size (especially if they are pre-t and have not developed a more male physique) but outside of that - I don't know why you wouldn't. I've been in martial arts since pre-t and have sparred and grappled with plenty of cis-men (as well as cis-women) and it's never been an issue.

I did martial arts a little ago. Like three months on T and she wiped the floor with me lol
I don't see why a cis guy would be different at this point XD
I don't care about him feeling my junk cause I pack.
And I also don't plan on going professionally. It's really a hobby and it's therapeutic.

My main concern was if I would've been evenly matched.
The trans guys told me because they are bio and bigger skeletons, hands feet etc.
So that was my main concern. I don't want him to kick my ribs and I'm coughing up bones.

But I take your word my friend lol
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Dex

How long have you been on T?

Honestly, and I don't mean this as any slight, but the amount of pounding you take will be more due to skill than genetic sex, lol. I mean that light-heartedly.

There isn't anything about a cis-man skeleton wise that is going to mean he demolishes you automatically. If you've been on T for any duration and you're relatively fit, your muscularity will be very similar to a cis-guy anyway.

That being said, if you're 5'1" and the person (male or female) you're up against is 6'3", you're going to be at a disadvantage. Same if you're 100 lbs and they're 300 lbs of solid muscle. But that is not due to cis or trans, that's just a mismatch of body size that transcends gender.

I honestly think you'll be just fine unless you miss a block, but then you're going to get a jingle no matter what the gender of your opponent.
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Kylo

I used to do martial arts, but the objective there isn't to take a pounding. I've always avoided the boxing and those aspects of MA that involve boxing since I'm aware of the limitations of my size and skeleton. I don't have the best wrist bones after a few injuries which means if I was going contact someone in a fight or in defense it would be with the knees/elbows, preferably, and without warning. Boxing is something I might have done if I'd got into it, but obv you need someone matched to your size and weight in it, in which case I'd be sparring with teens.

Less problem in that dept. with other martial arts, since the objective is different and size matters less.

I don't have much opinion on whether it's a good idea or not... I mean boxing in itself carries risk, having a less robust skeleton carries risk, whether you want to do it or not is up to you.

In terms of the issue of trans people in cis sports.... yeah that could be a problem. I mean you could have a trans man wipe the floor with some cis females potentially if put into the female category, or a cis-male proportioned transwoman doing the same if put into a female sport... it's not entirely fair, is it. Or a bio female playing among cis men in a rough contact sport is probably going to be at more risk of injury and a physical disadvantage. Just common sense really... but that does put us into a difficult category, doesn't it. Would it mean to be properly fair we should compete in trans men and women categories only? I just don't know. If everyone's fairly evenly matched in terms of size and strength, then gender is a bit less relevant, but even then there's physiological advantages and disadvantages based on body shape - different center of gravity between men and women for example, that is going to apply to transitioned/post op trans individuals...
"If the freedom of speech is taken away, then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter."
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SeptagonScars

I have, but it was a very long time ago. When I was age 13 through 15 (I'm 28 now) I practiced karate with both men and women as it wasn't gender segregated/separated or even by age, or anything. As it is (or was there at least) a male dominated sport, I did practice close up combat with mostly cis guys, ages ranging from 13 to I don't know... 60-ish, and any in between, as well as all kinds of size people as well.

However I was not out as trans back then, nor had I even figured out that I'm trans yet at that age. But I quickly did learn at practice that gender wasn't important there and men/women were treated pretty much equally. It didn't matter whether it was a cis girl my own age I was paired with on a much bigger and stronger cis guy.

But then of course, karate is not the same as boxing, even though they both count as martial arts and there are some elements that are similar. Also, I didn't continue with it long enough to get a whole lot of knowledge or experience with it, even though I learned quickly there. And my memory fails me a lot... darn that was a long time ago...
Mar. 2009 - came out as ftm
Nov. 2009 - changed my name to John
Mar. 2010 - diagnosed with GID
Aug. 2010 - started T, then stopped after 1 year
Aug. 2013 - started T again, kept taking it since
Mar. 2014 - top surgery
Dec. 2014 - legal gender marker changed to male
*
Jul. 2018 - came out as cis woman and began detransition
Sep. 2018 - stopped taking T and changed my name to Laura
Oct. 2018 - got new ID-card

Medical Detransition plans: breast reconstruction surgery, change legal gender back to female.
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Kylo

People seriously wonder why men fight? or rather - why they are competitive at all?

Probably because for men to "get" somewhere in life, i.e. to end up being desirable enough to someone to want to be with him and have kids with him - the natural imperative for most people - they have to acquire a job, some money, some stability, nobody gives you any of it on a silver platter. You have to compete with other people for it. Traditionally men were up against other men in the world for that, who won't stop to consider if you're going to be "okay" while they are pursuing their own success, now they're up against men and women too in the world of work.

A non-competitive man might breeze through life on the bottom of the pile if he's satisfied with that, but how many people are gonna just give him what he wants? How many women want a dude who's homeless and has no job? How many people would respect him for that matter? How many people will employ him if he's not "playing the game"?

It amazes me how people (especially females) think competition is this strange thing men do purely out of insanity, that has no bearing whatsoever on anything. The entire natural world is built on competition between species and within species and within the sexes, but males especially are made to compete harder since they are the biologically expendable ones. Since they don't invest much in the way off carrying offspring in most life forms, instead males are "sorted" by competition with others. Not a very nice fate for the male of any species, but what are you gonna do. Females traditionally expected men to acquire resources and then share them with their female partners when they raise children. Females weren't expected to go out into the world and get good jobs to satisfy the husband's financial needs, were they. It was men who were - and still are for the most part - supposed and expected to do that. Even in today's world, women like a man with a job - they often want a man who earns equal to them at least, or else view a jobless or poor man as a burden. Not a criteria females are usually required by men to fulfil before getting a look-in. 

So blame biology for the competitiveness and desire to acquire status and resources in males that can be found reflected in men's desire to compete, engage in sports, and assert their status through violence and ruthlessness sometimes. Because it's having those resources and that status that means that man has a better shot at raising offspring with a woman. Obviously not every guy understands the mechanism behind the power play, not everyone is necessarily playing that game consciously, but the wiring in the back of our minds is the way it is because fundamentally we know we get nothing by being noncompetitive in life. I'm not looking to have kids, but I know being generally noncompetitive does me no favors in bettering my life. There's also the psychological importance of having goals in life and the assertion of self, which are aspects of competitiveness.

If I had to comment personally on competitiveness (and aggression), I'd say controlled competition (i.e. sport) is a healthy outlet for men. There is nervous energy and frustration wired in there which if not turned to the business of good can be easily turned to the bad. "Young men with nothing to do" has been known as a problem for millennia. It's wired in there for most and having something to divert it toward a sense of achievement, discipline etc. is the best thing to do. Hell knows I know what it's like to be without that and for it to find outlets in criminal activity or general destructiveness (or self-destruction). And I don't think dosing people up with drugs is the answer either. Competition is fine, there's actually nothing wrong with it - though we currently live in a situation in which social attitudes toward competitiveness is one of horror toward the idea and one that despises masculinity, failing to recognize the positive and constructive traits of controlled competition and aggression when channeled properly.     
"If the freedom of speech is taken away, then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter."
  •  

1234

I have a trans friend who plays soccer in a team with cis guys. They don't know my friend is trans.


  •  

BT04

I don't do team or contact sports with other cismen, though I'm an avid outdoorsman and many of the solo sports that fall under that umbrella.
- Seth

Ex-nonbinary trans man, married to a straight guy, still in love. Pre-T, pre-op.
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AquaWhatever

Quote from: BT04 on March 22, 2018, 11:12:27 AM
I don't do team or contact sports with other cismen, though I'm an avid outdoorsman and many of the solo sports that fall under that umbrella.

Out of curiosity, is it a reason you don't do contact sports with cis guys or is contact sports just not your thing?
  •  

AquaWhatever

Quote from: Dex on March 15, 2018, 03:51:19 PM
How long have you been on T?

Honestly, and I don't mean this as any slight, but the amount of pounding you take will be more due to skill than genetic sex, lol. I mean that light-heartedly.

There isn't anything about a cis-man skeleton wise that is going to mean he demolishes you automatically. If you've been on T for any duration and you're relatively fit, your muscularity will be very similar to a cis-guy anyway.

That being said, if you're 5'1" and the person (male or female) you're up against is 6'3", you're going to be at a disadvantage. Same if you're 100 lbs and they're 300 lbs of solid muscle. But that is not due to cis or trans, that's just a mismatch of body size that transcends gender.

I honestly think you'll be just fine unless you miss a block, but then you're going to get a jingle no matter what the gender of your opponent.

Me and the guy are pretty much the same height but he's more buff than I.
I been on for 6 months.

I'm 5'8ish and he's probably a little bit shorter than I but we're both generally skinny compared to other dudes.
  •  

AquaWhatever

Quote from: Kylo on March 15, 2018, 06:04:48 PM
I used to do martial arts, but the objective there isn't to take a pounding. I've always avoided the boxing and those aspects of MA that involve boxing since I'm aware of the limitations of my size and skeleton. I don't have the best wrist bones after a few injuries which means if I was going contact someone in a fight or in defense it would be with the knees/elbows, preferably, and without warning. Boxing is something I might have done if I'd got into it, but obv you need someone matched to your size and weight in it, in which case I'd be sparring with teens.

Less problem in that dept. with other martial arts, since the objective is different and size matters less.

I don't have much opinion on whether it's a good idea or not... I mean boxing in itself carries risk, having a less robust skeleton carries risk, whether you want to do it or not is up to you.

In terms of the issue of trans people in cis sports.... yeah that could be a problem. I mean you could have a trans man wipe the floor with some cis females potentially if put into the female category, or a cis-male proportioned transwoman doing the same if put into a female sport... it's not entirely fair, is it. Or a bio female playing among cis men in a rough contact sport is probably going to be at more risk of injury and a physical disadvantage. Just common sense really... but that does put us into a difficult category, doesn't it. Would it mean to be properly fair we should compete in trans men and women categories only? I just don't know. If everyone's fairly evenly matched in terms of size and strength, then gender is a bit less relevant, but even then there's physiological advantages and disadvantages based on body shape - different center of gravity between men and women for example, that is going to apply to transitioned/post op trans individuals...

That's pretty much what I was wondering.
After seeing Fallon Fox and Mack beggs the question pondered in my mind if it would be fair
or if I would be evenly matched with a cis guy given my build but being that I am biologically female it makes me wonder if I have a chance.
The guy I am sparing with is my height (in fact I'm a little taller) but he's definitely stronger.
He's also faster but I can keep up.

I've always been athletic, in fact I was kicked off my communities girls soccer league because they said I "played like a boy". In other words I was intense and very competitive.
I was put on the boys team and basically like now, it's a lot more work but I keep up.

You pretty much answered my question though lol.
  •  

Deborah

Not entirely to the point of the OP but I had a required class in boxing in college.  Boxing sucks really bad no matter what unless you just enjoy the pain of your nose getting smashed.


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Love is not obedience, conformity, or submission. It is a counterfeit love that is contingent upon authority, punishment, or reward. True love is respect and admiration, compassion and kindness, freely given by a healthy, unafraid human being....  - Dan Barker

U.S. Army Retired
  •  

BT04

Quote from: AquaWhatever on March 22, 2018, 09:38:44 PM
Out of curiosity, is it a reason you don't do contact sports with cis guys or is contact sports just not your thing?

Yeah, competitive/contact/team sports were just never my thing. I like challenging myself first and foremost, and the zen aspect of stuff like kayaking or hiking I really dig. That's not to say that I'm not super competitive - I am, I just get my fix in other ways LOL.
- Seth

Ex-nonbinary trans man, married to a straight guy, still in love. Pre-T, pre-op.
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DawnOday

I grew up with Jerry, Mike and Linda Quarry. They were actually from Norwalk not Bellflower. Jerry's Dad owned the bar where two planes collided over Norwalk and crashed next door. I sat next to Linda in my 8th grade music class. She was stink-e. Mike used to get picked on by Johnny Regan and Johnny Hubbard the junior high school nerds. He got significantly better with time. My Dad was boxing champion in the Navy so he taught us lots of things to defend ourselves.
Dawn Oday

It just feels right   :icon_hug: :icon_hug: :icon_kiss: :icon_kiss: :icon_kiss:

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First indication I was different- 1956 kindergarten
First crossdress - Asked mother to dress me in sisters costumes  Age 7
First revelation - 1982 to my present wife
First time telling the truth in therapy June 15, 2016
Start HRT Aug 2016
First public appearance 5/15/17



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