HRT thread with a difference

[Sylvia]

I'm so happy for you, Sylvia! I'm glad that you're seeing positive things. I hope, of course, that you'll come to believe that there are more positives than negatives, because we as a group need a cause for hope. But more, I hope that you and your spouse find peace with whatever outcome you ultimately reach.

The spy who came in from the cold in the War Between the Sexes.

Thanks Dee. I find it hard to believe there will ever be more positives than negatives from my point of view, but a few months ago I saw NO positives at all, so I guess that's heading in the right direction.

[SadieBlake]

Honestly Sylvia I'm sad to say my partner continues to be unable to acknowledge nto anyone but our mutual friends that she's practically speaking lesbian now. We are but she clearly doesn't want to broach either thing to her work or family.

[Donna]

6 week update - and well, there really isn't anything much to say. Nothing else has changed. He had another few days of being HORRIBLE and grumpy and irritated with everything, shouting at me and the kids about the slightest little thing - this was exactly a month since the last time - could it be a version of PMT? Other than that, he is still pretty well the person he's always been. No great transformation...

Other than that, we're good. Just having a nice family summer, as usual. He looks the same as usual to the outside world and he seems pretty happy with that. We know we need to talk through things again soon, but neither of us wants to put any sort of downer on what is our 'happy time'. Not sure if I've mentioned before, but from August to May, he works away a lot and we have a very disjointed time as a couple and a family, so June and July is our annual 'normal' family time, and we are making the most of it. There are still things which are upsetting me a lot, and I still cry most days, but less so recently.

Sexually, we are still doing ok, thank heavens. I just wish his breasts and nipples weren't such a massively important part of our lovemaking. While I like making him happy and knowing how to turn him on, there are times when I find the breasts a real turn off too.

A question for those of you whose wives are with you. Do they now identify as lesbians? Are they happy having lesbian sex? This is still something I'm having a hard time getting my head round. I'm getting there, but I just can't think of myself as a lesbian. But I guess while he's still presenting male, I probably don't need to as I mostly think of him as a man still. Except in the bedroom....

Being asexual now we haven't had sex in almost 7!years and neither of us miss it. My wife hates the thought of someone thinking she is a lesbian and I can understand that. If she where to get asked she just tells people that don't know us we are cousins. My transition is a total turn off to her so sex wouldn't matter now anyways. We have discussed sex in the future and she is free to have a boyfriend if she needs it, she has said the same is good for me it I might end up with a boy friend. Myself right now I don't imagine that happening

[Sylvia]

Oh gosh, the idea of having other partners fills me with horror! I chose this person to be be my life partner, my lover, my everything, and no one else. I'm no prude - I've been in an 'open marriage' before and have been quite a sexual adventurer in my time, but not now. Also, the idea of living as roommates or best friends is not what either of us wants. Is that the only way this will work? That's terrifying.

[SadieBlake]

Sylvia, you sound a lot like my partner in that you and she both recognize and fell for the feminine person inside. Sure, she likes to see the occasional fwb to scratch the itch of being with someone male but that's been a part of our relationship from the start. In our case, I'm the one who's actively dating since transition (I always wanted to before but never had the confidence).

And most of the time what I'm doing is socializing. Again, I was never confident enough before transition to do that and it's been good for me to be developing a nertwork of female friends.

[Sylvia]

Sylvia, you sound a lot like my partner in that you and she both recognize and fell for the feminine person inside.

I would agree with that. It was his more sensitive, emotional, vulnerable hidden qualities that I saw and fell in love with. I do feel they were the more feminine aspects. Not many other people (as in probably NO other people!) see that part. His lack of confidence and lack of social skills is seen by many people as arrogance.

While I love the feminine person inside, I'm struggling with that person becoming feminine on the outside.

[Dee Marshall]

Oh gosh, the idea of having other partners fills me with horror! I chose this person to be be my life partner, my lover, my everything, and no one else. I'm no prude - I've been in an 'open marriage' before and have been quite a sexual adventurer in my time, but not now. Also, the idea of living as roommates or best friends is not what either of us wants. Is that the only way this will work? That's terrifying.

Goodness no, Sylvia! This is like any other marriage, give and take. The way it will work is the way you both let it work. If you don't let yourselves be in love, if you don't show affection or accept it, then friends is the best you can hope for.

Just keep hold of the soul you fell in love with and let the body be what it has to.

Stay wonderful, both of you!

The spy who came in from the cold in the War Between the Sexes.

[Sylvia]

8 weeks today. We are both quite surprised at how quick the boob growth has been. They are quite obvious now, especially as he's skinny. Maybe it's only me who notices. He loves them. Doesn't feel weirded out by them, thinks they feel natural. I am still very ambivalent. At times they really repulse me. At other times, I just see them as part of him, and I love every part of him. They are a major part of our sex life too. I've never had the kind of turn on from my boobs as he gets with his. Is this a normal thing? To get SO aroused from having your boobs fondled? It's quite an alien thing for me.....to me boobs are just for feeding babies, lol!
Maybe because of this our sex life is still happening. He is still getting erections when needed, still managing PIV.
We have had a couple of good chats. One where I told him to ask ME questions, rather than the other way round. It worked well. In all this, it has always been me who does all the talking, questioning, trying to get things out of him. He really wouldn't talk about transitioning at all if I didn't make him!
We are still being very close, very affectionate, and I think I have had a record-breaker - over a week without crying...

So far, the hormones haven't made him want to go any further at all. In fact he hasn't put on any make up or nail polish for about a month. He is still 100% sure of no surgery, and 95% sure of never coming out. Still happy with male pronouns and no interest in a femme name. Maybe that is the only thing that is keeping me from cracking up. He is still he. A bit feminised, but still the same person, the same identity, the same name.

He says he mostly feels calmer. That is really the only mental effect. There are days when he really doesn't want to be female at all, and feels much more comfortable being a man. But with boobs. Maybe the boobs really are the only things that matter, who knows.

Oh well, on we go.
Thanks to anyone who is following, and hope some of this can help some of you.

[LexieDragon]

Glad that its going well for you. I hope it continues to go in a positive direction.

[Sylvia]

Just want to add, one thing that makes me feel happier is that there seems to be no huge personality change. On another forum I'm on, many of the wives there are going through hell, as their trans partners have changed so much. Kind, loving husbands have turned into bitch-cats from hell, seemingly overnight. Many of these women say they wouldn't have the woman their husbands have turned into as a friend, never mind as a spouse. I'm appalled at the selfish behaviour of some of the transwomen - and transmen in some cases - I've read about, they show absolutely no concern or respect for their partners, as they embrace their new lifestyles full steam ahead.
I suppose I'm grateful, that the female parts of my partner - the parts I think I've always seen - are nice things. And the fact that he's not pursuing things at any speed, and maybe never will go any further.

[SadieBlake]

Sylvia, so glad to hear it and I know for me this has been a blessing that came from taking on the social / interpersonal part of my transition quite slowly.

Trans women generally start with one or another flavor of male socialization. Many of us (I'd say nearly all to some degree) swing from there in our excitement to sometimes odd ideas of what it is to be female. And of course that comes along with it takes time to actually let go of that male socialization.

[Sylvia]

Trans women generally start with one or another flavor of male socialization. Many of us (I'd say nearly all to some degree) swing from there in our excitement to sometimes odd ideas of what it is to be female. And of course that comes along with it takes time to actually let go of that male socialization.

Not entirely sure what you mean there, Sadie. You mean a combination of male socialization and wrong ideas of women cause these transwomen to behave so badly?

[SadieBlake]

Yeah Sylvia, the combination of learned male privilege & socialization with acting out essentially a caricature of female behavior can (imx) be difficult.

[Sylvia]

Two months today. I'm beginning to crumble again. We're coming to the end of our summer, the time when he is home all the time, as he goes back to work next week, so 10 months of only seeing him a few days a month. 10 months of wondering what he is doing, what he is buying, who he is talking to. I know it's ridiculous as it's mostly 10 months of him working or travelling to work between 4 am and midnight. But I do prefer it when I can be with him all the time
The boobs have grown again. He is working out how to hide them now. Either tight sports bras or big baggy t-shirts I think. He does love them though. I don't. Mentally, he says he feels better about himself than ever has. He is still very much 'in the middle' in terms of female or male. Estrogen hasn't really changed him or made him want to be any more female. So far. He is due a counselling session with GenderGP at the end of the month, and he said he will mention that. I don't trust GenderGP - I think they are far too biased and too ready to dish out hormones. He also worries that if he mentions gender-fluid, they may not let him have more hormones. Which is rubbish, I know.
He's also said if he had to live the rest of his life as a man, he could. Which in turn makes me question why is he doing all this? Being male doesn't cause him distress, it never has. Nothing more than just discomfort. He doesn't really have dysphoria as such. Is this all just one big experiment? A huge gamble with our lives and our relationship? Just for a pair of tits?
I think I need to go back to my therapist
Sorry, I'm being a bit negative, and I DO understand why he's doing this, really I do. I just question it sometimes.

[Donna]

Sorry your getting hit so hard.
His ideas and attitudes sound very familiar to me. They where me
These are just my observations based  on me and may not even be close, I'm going to venture a guess the estrogen may be starting to affect him him more than either of you may know. As my girls started to develop and grow I really fell in love with them. That was all it took and when my wife ask I just admitted I love them. In December I wrote a three page letter explaining my thoughts and ideas and future outlook and the plans of staying a feminized male. That all went out the window in January when I felt I could be androgynous and spent the month being male in female cloths. In February the face hair came off and the cloths went full female and I swore I could walk both sides of the line. March came around and all the male cloths were gone. Make up and a wig ruled and I came out to the world. For me once the estrogen hit there was no stoping the changes and direction of my life. Maybe this will be him maybe not but it's such an unknown. I wish you both the best and hopefully you two are able to FaceTime or what ever frequently. You seem to be very supportive and caring and this separating may be harder than the whole transition.
Love to you both

[MikeP]

Sylvia, thanks for sharing all of this with us.  In many ways I could see myself being in the same spot as your husband and my wife going through the same.  I have a love hate relationship with a lot of my feelings and body issues.  I am seeing a theripist and thinking seriously about taking E and see if it changes how I feel.  I love how my breast feel when touched like him and can relate. 

All in all I want to be sure I dont take away from our relationship and do anything that would cause my wife to be unhappy.  It is a big issue and I am taking time.  Sounds like the physical effects of breast are about the only real thing that has changed so far.  Would your husband be up for a PM?  Thanks

[Sylvia]

Long overdue update. Nearly 4 months in. Not much has changed really. I'm still up and down. But still here, so I guess that's good He still has no desire to go any further, in fact the desire to present female is much less than it's ever been (bearing in mind his clothes are pretty well all female/andro, and has long wavy hair - think Robert Plant). I think he's in a pretty good place, in himself. He still worries about me.
Counseling yesterday for him, was ok. Gender fluid seems to still be the 'label' and they understood that he doesn't want to use a female name, so changed that on his details. He has feeling male days, and feeling female days. But he looks the same, maybe a touch of make up on the female days. He still says he never feels more than 70% female. He likes his maleness and doesn't want to let go of that. I'm still not sure if that's just fear, or if it's his genuine feeling. Personality wise, nothing has changed really. He still slobs semi-horizontally on the sofa like your average beer-swilling alpha male (which I tease him about).
He had his blood tests which showed raised bilirubin, which has worried him a bit, so he's going for another test next week. The liver function tests were omitted in his first tests, so we have nothing to compare with. I hope this is just a blip and not a sign of anything underlying. We are both a bit anxious about that. As for levels, well T is down, E is up, neither massively. The clinic want to up his dose, but neither of us want to. If he's happy with the way things are, and I'm hanging in there, why rock the boat?
Any other changes? Not much really. I still think his face looks a bit 'softer'. He is still getting erections, but not so easily. He is finding it hard to carry the heavy shopping these days 

That's it really.

Mike, re above, he doesn't use this forum - or any forums - so not up for any PMs or anything.

[Moonflower]

Syl, this is a great thread! Thanks for starting it. I am preparing for when my SO begins HRT, and greatly appreciate all of the leaders whom I have met here at Susan's. You all make this challenging experience so much easier as we discuss the teensy baby steps to take, and in what sequence.

Wishing you all of the best...

[Sylvia]

Another update. A bad couple of weeks. Had some bad family news so dashed back to the UK to be there for a few days.

We seem to have lost our way somehow. Not sure what's happened but he's been very down for the last couple of weeks. Back to how he used to get a few years ago. I don't really know why, he says he doesn't know either but I'm not sure if he just doesn't want to talk about it. He's also back to travelling to and fro, so we don't see each other as often as we need. So we haven't really been able to talk, and haven't even attempted sex for over a month.

I cried a lot yesterday. I just miss his maleness. Sounds silly, I know, but I miss the parts of him that I liked. I miss his hairy arms, his snake hips, his lovely buttocks, his stubble. Yes, shallow I know. But it's how I feel. When he's hugged me I've tried not to feel his boobs. I miss feeling lustful about him. I miss FANCYING him, I just miss that feeling. That doesn't mean I don't want to make love with him - I do, because I love him, but it's out of love not lust. This feeling worries me. I want some good old fashioned 'phwoar' factor back. He still finds me attractive (I think!), but that has now been stolen from me. Why should he still have that feeling if I can't? It doesn't seem fair.

On the plus side, the liver tests came back fine, no further tests needed.

Sorry if I sound selfish and shallow.

[gallinarosa]

<3