I am not trans but people think I am-looking for advice to appear female!

[sakura1]

Hello, I am new here. I am coming to this forum asking for help. I have no issues with trans people in any way, and I support you all. I grew up in the San Francisco Bay area and open to people of all walks of life. About myself, I am a natural born female and have always been a bit awkward. I was single two years ago and was putting myself on dating sites in order to meet someone. On those dating sites it was brought to my attention I appear trans. I understand I have prominent/strong facial features, but I always thought I was a female with strong features. It was to the point where men would message me and ask, "Are you trans? You look like you are".

I would like to know what features stand out as male and what surgeries are available to have so my gender will not be questioned in this way? It is very hurtful. I have had jaw shaving and vline in the past, but it seems my jawline is still prominent? I have deep dimples in which I plan to put fillers in, because they carve out my jaw a bit too much. Perhaps my chin is too wide? I have been told my prominent cheekbones add to my masculine look, but that is actually due to my heritage (black/japanese). I am hesitant to alter my cheekbones even though in Asian culture less prominent cheeks is attractive.

Please help me, and please be kind. I am not here to attack and I would appreciate not being attacked. There are five photos in the album. One photo is without me covering my eyes so you will see what I really look like while smiling. I have a very prominent smile and my chin and jaw look harsher. I have two prominent muscles by my mouth that I cannot do anything about. I was told I can inject botox into my chin to soften it, but I was warned trying to narrow it may not be effective due to the thickness of my skin.

http://s345.photobucket.com/user/sakura12347/slideshow/

[Michelle_P]

@sakura1, unfortunately there are more and more people in the general population who are aware that there are transgender people around them, and who have convinced themselves that they can spot a trans person.  They will generally see any variation from the Northern European white female appearance as a 'trigger' that they are looking at a person 'not like them', and rationalize strong features to be trans features.

You don't have the browline or from what I can see, orbital ridges and nose bridge produced by testosterone exposure in puberty.  Upper lip height and the triangle of the eyes, nose, and mouth look like they are female normal.  You look like another pretty cisgender woman, honestly.

We have a number of different forums here, some of which may help you in getting better responses for your posts.

* We'd like to get to know you!  Try posting a little bit about yourself in a new topic just for yourself, over in our Introductions forum. 


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[Dena]

Welcome to Susan's Place. I am not very good at making FFS recommendations but looking at the single image I could see, they might be coming to that conclusion because of your hairline. Instead of the rounded corners on either side that the stereotype feminine hair line would have, your hairline is more square on the side. Women can have a hairline much like your's however living in San Francisco means that people are more sensitive to differences and might pick on something that would never be noticed elsewhere in the country. You could try wearing your hair down on the sides to mask this and see how it works. It's such a minor thing that it would be over kill to go for hair transplants to change the hair line.

Also, should you have any problems on this site, use the report button on the right of a post or PM. We don't allow anybody to be mistreated on this site and if we are aware of the problem, we will take action against the member committing the violation.

[Lady Skylar]

Hello, I am new here. I am coming to this forum asking for help. I have no issues with trans people in any way, and I support you all. I grew up in the San Francisco Bay area and open to people of all walks of life. About myself, I am a natural born female and have always been a bit awkward. I was single two years ago and was putting myself on dating sites in order to meet someone. On those dating sites it was brought to my attention I appear trans. I understand I have prominent/strong facial features, but I always thought I was a female with strong features. It was to the point where men would message me and ask, "Are you trans? You look like you are".

I would like to know what features stand out as male and what surgeries are available to have so my gender will not be questioned in this way? It is very hurtful. I have had jaw shaving and vline in the past, but it seems my jawline is still prominent? I have deep dimples in which I plan to put fillers in, because they carve out my jaw a bit too much. Perhaps my chin is too wide? I have been told my prominent cheekbones add to my masculine look, but that is actually due to my heritage (black/japanese). I am hesitant to alter my cheekbones even though in Asian culture less prominent cheeks is attractive.

Please help me, and please be kind. I am not here to attack and I would appreciate not being attacked. There are four photos in the album.
http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p394/sakura12347/14352449_1075959832520177_1106238790464334473_o_zpsm3wbi16w.jpg

I think you look totally like a cis woman and I myself wouldn't even remotely think you are in anyway possible a trans woman. I would love to look as great, and as womanly as you do. But at this point in my transition, which is pre hrt, I would expect those questions. Because I am a trans woman.  I know for you getting asked if you're trans is a real PITA, but for me if I looked as womanly as you do, it would actually be pretty much a compliment to me that people would have to question me if I were a trans woman or not. Skylar

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[gracefulhat]

Hello, I am new here. I am coming to this forum asking for help. I have no issues with trans people in any way, and I support you all. I grew up in the San Francisco Bay area and open to people of all walks of life. About myself, I am a natural born female and have always been a bit awkward. I was single two years ago and was putting myself on dating sites in order to meet someone. On those dating sites it was brought to my attention I appear trans. I understand I have prominent/strong facial features, but I always thought I was a female with strong features. It was to the point where men would message me and ask, "Are you trans? You look like you are".

I would like to know what features stand out as male and what surgeries are available to have so my gender will not be questioned in this way? It is very hurtful. I have had jaw shaving and vline in the past, but it seems my jawline is still prominent? I have deep dimples in which I plan to put fillers in, because they carve out my jaw a bit too much. Perhaps my chin is too wide? I have been told my prominent cheekbones add to my masculine look, but that is actually due to my heritage (black/japanese). I am hesitant to alter my cheekbones even though in Asian culture less prominent cheeks is attractive.

Please help me, and please be kind. I am not here to attack and I would appreciate not being attacked. There are four photos in the album.
http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p394/sakura12347/14352449_1075959832520177_1106238790464334473_o_zpsm3wbi16w.jpg

Girl you look good!

[sakura1]

Welcome to Susan's Place. I am not very good at making FFS recommendations but looking at the single image I could see, they might be coming to that conclusion because of your hairline. Instead of the rounded corners on either side that the stereotype feminine hair line would have, your hairline is more square on the side. Women can have a hairline much like your's however living in San Francisco means that people are more sensitive to differences and might pick on something that would never be noticed elsewhere in the country. You could try wearing your hair down on the sides to mask this and see how it works. It's such a minor thing that it would be over kill to go for hair transplants to change the hair line.

Also, should you have any problems on this site, use the report button on the right of a post or PM. We don't allow anybody to be mistreated on this site and if we are aware of the problem, we will take action against the member committing the violation.

I truly appreciate your response. The photo you seen was a bit cut off at the top, so all of my hairline was not showing. I now realize that it looks square in that particular photo. The person that pointed out that I looked trans did it in a terrible way. It was on a dating site and there was a chatroom where members can have conversation. I jumped in and said "Hello", to everyone and someone said "OMG, what the hell is that?" I did not realize he was speaking to me. He then said, "Are you a ->-bleeped-<-, because you look like one. But, Stacie here, she looks so hot." And Stacie was a woman probably 20-25 years older than myself, and I just found his comment to be hurtful and strange. But he did that publicly. Other times I was messaged on other dating sites just asking if I was trans. I would be surprised if it was just a square hairline triggering these people but I guess I don't know.

[Dena]

The problem is there are so many things that can be a problem. In my case, I am 6'2" and I started out with a really deep voice. Speech patterns can also be a problem and if you speak in a monotone instead of a more feminine speech pattern. Assuming this was a text chat room, none of the above would apply to you. Probably the best approach would be sort of a counter attack with a good comeback. When other CIS women have this happen to them, they often just laugh it off.

As I am older than the hills, this never used to be a problem. It's only in the last few years that it's become a game to read somebody. Because it's common for women to have some masculine features, often these features are misinterpreted. The truth is these features often make women different and more attractive. If you look at some of the top models you will see that many of them have some masculine features in their face and they are not transgender.

I know it's difficult but for many of us who don't pass all the time, the best solution is being confident in ourself and not to care what somebody thinks about us. I know what I am and other peoples opinion don't matter to me if I know they are wrong. Life becomes much better when your no longer a slave to another persons opinion.

[Allison S]

Honestly, I think it could have been your surgeries. I'm not too sure though because we can't see your eyes, so the rest of your features will stand out more to us. It could also be the photo? I've had guys never question it with one photo and then another photo they'll say I'm a man...

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

[sakura1]

The problem is there are so many things that can be a problem. In my case, I am 6'2" and I started out with a really deep voice. Speech patterns can also be a problem and if you speak in a monotone instead of a more feminine speech pattern. Assuming this was a text chat room, none of the above would apply to you. Probably the best approach would be sort of a counter attack with a good comeback. When other CIS women have this happen to them, they often just laugh it off.

As I am older than the hills, this never used to be a problem. It's only in the last few years that it's become a game to read somebody. Because it's common for women to have some masculine features, often these features are misinterpreted. The truth is these features often make women different and more attractive. If you look at some of the top models you will see that many of them have some masculine features in their face and they are not transgender.

I know it's difficult but for many of us who don't pass all the time, the best solution is being confident in ourself and not to care what somebody thinks about us. I know what I am and other peoples opinion don't matter to me if I know they are wrong. Life becomes much better when your no longer a slave to another persons opinion.

I appreciate it. I am at the point where I am going to need to just work through it instead of getting surgery so I will not get harassed. Surgeries are incredibly costly and painful. Everyone I know thinks people suspecting I am trans to be absurd, but it has happened often enough where I was concerned that perhaps I look bad? I find it pretty hurtful because I was always been self-conscious about my appearance. I appear tall in photos, but I am only 5'5. My fiance who is 6'0 feels like a giant standing next to me. I also have a very small voice which I personally do not mind. You are right, being a slave to everyone else's opinion is not healthy. I am glad that I came here and asked those that I feel are experts on these topics. Many are ignorant about this subject and approach from a standpoint of fear.

[sakura1]

@sakura1, unfortunately there are more and more people in the general population who are aware that there are transgender people around them, and who have convinced themselves that they can spot a trans person.  They will generally see any variation from the Northern European white female appearance as a 'trigger' that they are looking at a person 'not like them', and rationalize strong features to be trans features.

You don't have the browline or from what I can see, orbital ridges and nose bridge produced by testosterone exposure in puberty.  Upper lip height and the triangle of the eyes, nose, and mouth look like they are female normal.  You look like another pretty cisgender woman, honestly.

We have a number of different forums here, some of which may help you in getting better responses for your posts.

* We'd like to get to know you!  Try posting a little bit about yourself in a new topic just for yourself, over in our Introductions forum. 


A Cautionary Note:
This is a public forum so please remember when posting that The Internet Never Forgets, and the various web crawlers and archival sites out there may retain information that you post.

We cannot ensure that any information you share on the site will be protected from public view and/or copying or reproduction. This warning is also listed in the Terms of Service listed below.

If you give out personal information on Susan's you are responsible for any consequence.


I also want to share some links with you. They include helpful information and the rules that govern the site.  It is important for your enjoyment of the site to take a moment to go through them

Things that you should read

Site Terms of Service & Rules to Live By	Standard Terms & Definitions	Post Ranks (including when you can upload an avatar)
Reputation rules	News posting & quoting guidelines	Photo, avatars, & signature images policy

Thank you for your input. I felt your response was very thoughtful. I am keeping in mind that people at times shun what is different. It is really unfortunate.

[sakura1]

Honestly, I think it could have been your surgeries. I'm not too sure though because we can't see your eyes, so the rest of your features will stand out more to us. It could also be the photo? I've had guys never question it with one photo and then another photo they'll say I'm a man...

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

My gender was questionable to some long before the jaw surgeries. When I have asked people what makes me look male they tell me my heavy jaw and large cheekbones. I have had surgery because I was convinced I looked trans since it kept coming up. I actually looked at old photos the other night and realized I did not look male (but my jawline was longer and wider).

I hope you understand why I covered my eyes, since this is a public forum I was not sure who would see my photos. I had people on dating sites google my photos and look for my Facebook and other accounts. I did add a photo with my eyes uncovered.

[MeTony]

I can't see your pics. I guess you removed them. But I just want to say people look different. You can do a lot with makeup and how you wear your hair.

This is a pic of me 8 years ago when I tried so hard to be a woman I am not.
https://imgur.com/a/yxzaL

I look like a woman but felt like a drag queen. I was at a studio getting makeup and taking photos. I have never done makeup myself.

This is what buzzing your head and no makeup does. I'm pre hormones. Pic is a couple of months old.

https://imgur.com/a/Bnqiw

You see, try wearing your hair in a different way. Try subtle makeup, or strong makeup. Try different variations in between. Ask your friends for advice if you trust them. Take a lot of selfies to see how you look. Pics are not the same as the mirror.

I am AFAB. That means if I was not transgender I'd be a cis woman.

Be that confident girl you feel you are. Don't listen to trolls on internet who try to push you down.

I have very little trust for dating apps and sites. Lots of trolls and predators. Be careful who you decide to date.


Tony

Edit: accidentally put the wrong link in the text.

[Janes Groove]

You look 100% cis.  I really don't see any traces of masculinity.
And pretty. And young.
God. I better stop. I'm getting jealous.

[reborn]

Well, let me be honest. Your "heavy" cheekbones and your jaw are in the female range. The only problem I see i your face is that you are very beautiful. It even looks unreal that somebody can have such perfect nose, such perfect forehead such beautiful eyes. You really look like a doll and people may assume that you have had a nose job to have such a perfect nose, or other cosmetic surgeries. I think being perfect makes people think you are result of cosmetic surgeries therefore you may be trans. Also people are very rude and they say things to offend you in order to feel better about themselves. I think that is a very possible scenario. I don't see how somebody would think that you are a trans. Don't believe in everything you are told.

[josie76]

I'm sorry you have had to deal with transphobia.
Honestly I see nothing in your face that makes you look masculine in any way. Your face and skull traits are pretty textbook female. You have a slightly squarish jaw (mandible) but that same trait is often found on women deemed to be the most attractive by society. Nothing looks male at all.

I can only suspect that dating site had attracted a group of transphobic guys who have no respect for women in general at all. Seems there is a group of grown men that never grow up beyond seeing women as sex objects and they feel personally offended by the very existence of trans people.

Again I'm very sorry you had to deal with that. It is something we all expect to some measure going into transition but it's a shame that in today's world there are people who so openly show their hatred of others that it spills over to people who aren't even part of the group of "others" that they hate.

[KathyLauren]

The problem is more in the other people than in your face.  It seems there is a sport on dating sites to "spot the tr***y".  I don't hang out on dating sites, but I have seen discussions elsewhere among guys who share tips for spotting trans people. 

Some of them are ludicrous: one guy said that small boobs are a sure sign that the person is cisgender.  Which would be good news for me if he ever judged me (I'm a small A cup), but it gives an idea how stupid those people can be. 

The point is that, whatever clues they are using might not even be real.  From the picture I saw, you are a normal, beautiful woman.

[Paige]

Hi Sakura,

I see no male traits in your photos.  As others have said I think the problem is with the person on the site making these comments.  I suspect with all these sites there are a small population of trolls that enjoy taunting people.  People are quite vulnerable putting themselves out there for others to see.  Unfortunately it's the perfect place for nasty people to get their kicks bringing others down.

Unless you've seen this in the real world, I would put this down as another idiotic internet thing.

All the best,
Paige

[Northern Star Girl]

In my opinion, in appearing female, most certainly facial appearance has a lot to do with it but there is so many more things that have to do with appearing female and passing successfully.

How you walk, how you sit, how you move, how you eat, how you are groomed, how you talk, your voice pitch, etc, etc.
Just go to a mall or a busy street or restaurant and watch the differences in the things I mentioned and also between how females and males interact with each other.
Danielle

[sakura1]

Thank you to everyone for your responses. I suppose this will be something that I will have to ignore. I do not want to keep getting facial surgeries just to not get harassed. There is so much transphobia now that any feature that is deemed masculine causes men to question. I will remove my photos now.

[Harley Quinn]

Yea, I don't see anything really.  You look quite feminine from all 5 pictures I saw.  The sunglass filters threw me a bit until the last photo, but I didn't see anything to give them that impression.  I'm sorry that I couldn't be any help.  The only thing I can think is to "pose" more for the pictures with the crazy angles like every other girl online.  Apparently men who do online dating, have forgotten what actual women look like from normal angles and without snapchat filters...