Using public restrooms.

[barbie]

I get that totally. I'm in a similar situation, even if I have to present as a man(which is quite andro look these days) it is very awkward for me to go to the men's restroom as it's confusing people who don't know me. There were quite a few instances when a man entered, saw me, apologized for entering the wrong restroom and went back to check the sign

I would never enter the men's restroom while presenting as a female, it's awkward enough as it is. When I'm presenting as a female I always go to the women's restroom and it was never a problem. I tend to pass so that helps but I don't feel that I don't belong there just because I'm not yet legally female, or because I'm not on HRT, didn't have GRS or VFS.

If we call it 'type I' error, then there  'type II' error.

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php?topic=211971.0

A similar case happened here (Daegu, South Korea) this year. An aged woman at 58  forcefully touched the breasts of a young lady at 20 to check her sex at a restaurant restroom, suspecting that the lady might be a crossdresser. The court imposed a fine and ordered the woman to take a 24 hour course for preventing sexual violence.

barbie~~

[IAmM]

Well, I am feeling encouraged now.

That's one "out there" roommate you have/had.

Oh, the hand washing? Don't worry about that IAmM, I always wash them. Seeing men who do not is so gross, so much so, that I am one of those who always figures out how to open the door without touching it on the way out because I know many grubby unwashed hands have touched it before me.

If washing hands in the Ladies is a requirement for fitting in, I'll be right at home.

~Dee.

Yes, she is way out there and so much fun. She is one of the worlds premier gossips but my life has always been better with her in it. She was actually the first person other than myself that touched my breasts. Kind of odd because I don't think she is bi or interested in women, but she is obsessed with boobs, likes to look at them and likes to touch them. We were at a giant fear fest place with haunted houses, chainsaw massacre hay rides and things like that. We were in one house and she is behind me with her hands around my waist and alternating between looking over my shoulder and burying her face in my back and a zombie grabs me out of nowhere. When I can breathe again she has one of my boobs in each hand and giving them a good grope. When we got out of the house she says,'I so felt you up in there.' Yep, I was there. 'You don't mind?' No I have been waiting for you to take your chance for months now. I usually don't mind going along with her insanity, she is one of the gems in my life.

Just playing with the washing your hands thing.    Still ( please wa.... ) 

I am glad you feel better about using the bathroom. It is scary but it can be done, hopefully you will see after that is not so bad.

Sorry everyone for my one post. I feel that gaining acceptance has to come from people repeatedly seeing us as just trying to be a girl. We have been used as a way to push agendas and people don't really like having things pushed on them. Most will more than generously give us the chance to be ourselves, I see this as an opportunity to let them accept us and not put ourselves in opposition.

I have been thinking about conversation in the restroom. It is not common unless it is with a friend but it does happen.

Besides the Ren Fair. Let's see.
Stopped at a rest stop late at night and in the middle of nowhere. No one was there, a maybe 60-65 year old woman comes in as I am washing my hands. She sees all of the cow that I am and sighs in relief. Then asked if I could wait until she was done so we could go to our cars together. Of course I did and we talked as she went to the bathroom all the way until we got back to our cars. I couldn't tell you what we talked about, we were just happy having someone else there with us.
Gettysburg tour our bus stoped at McDonald's so we could get something to eat and go to the bathroom. A woman about my age from another tour bus came into the restroom with me. We talked about what we had seen and how her husband and my boyfriend were having so much fun and constantly comparing what they know (aka showing off how much they know) with the tour guide. Less than five minutes but my best laugh all day.
Maybe two months ago at the horse races. I wore a dark summer dress with tights to keep warm. I did carry my sweater but was too warm to wear it. Every race I go in to make my $5 bet there is a couple by the door and the woman is staring at me. Went to the restroom before we left and she is there. She asked me if I was cold, I rarely get cold and don't know why. She said how amazing I looked and she wished she was young enough to make a dress like that look good. I told her that I am 48 and not exactly young. No way, really? Anyway we talked about dresses and horses until she sat back down with her husband and my boyfriend and I headed to the car.

Not much after all but it does happen.

Sorry for the stories.

[dee82]

I have found the stories and comments here supportive and thoughful.

It so important having a place where discussions like this can occur.

Hugs to everyone.

~Dee.

[Arianna Valentine]

If we call it 'type I' error, then there  'type II' error.

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php?topic=211971.0

A similar case happened here (Daegu, South Korea) this year. An aged woman at 58  forcefully touched the breasts of a young lady at 20 to check her sex at a restaurant restroom, suspecting that the lady might be a crossdresser. The court imposed a fine and ordered the woman to take a 24 hour course for preventing sexual violence.

barbie~~

And hopefully stories like this one managed to get out into the General Public so they can understand that we have rights too

If you can't accept yourself,  how can you expect others to accept you?

[NatalieRene]

Kathy, this is the second time, people here have said you actually may need to talk in the restrooms.

Not having used the Ladies yet, I am left wondering how common that is, and what sort of small talk goes on?

I want to be prepared.

~Dee.

It happens in my office fairly often. Mostly when touching up makeup at the sink, but sometimes it carries on if one decides to use the facilities before exiting the rest room.

[NatalieRene]

Okay. As someone who has never spoken to a stranger in the Men's room it sounds daunting.

The reason for that, and maybe it relates to the current "TERF" discussion, is that if I can go in and out and not talk, in my current state I may actually pass. But if I need to talk, my confidence evaporates, as my voice draws attention to my transness. (Which is something I like to avoid.)

I find the whole restroom question tricky. I can see both sides. You shouldn't have to pass. But once there is the at least make an effort criteria it starts to get confusing where do you draw the line. I dunno know what to think on this one.

As someone quite anxious about what my first time will be like, thinking about these questions, doesn't help with the anxiety.

~Dee.

It's my theory that men don't talk in the bathroom because they don't want to acknowledge that they are aware any other men are in the stall. My guess fear of thinking they are gay or trying to steal glances at the mans equipment in the urinal next to them. I guess in short it's machoism.

Regarding your voice there are excellent voice trainers out there that can help. I have roughly a range of 165Hz to 255Hz speaking voice. Don't worry most men can be trained to be able to sound feminine so even though you where raised male and have a deeper voice with proper training it isn't an issue.

That said if you are using the rest room out in public you could always pop on headphones and people will pretty much leave you out of the conversation. It's not rude, sometimes people just are not feeling like talking.

[stephaniec]

kids

[Beverly Anne]

The hard part is living in a state that is unfriendly toward trans people. NC had the big HB2 battle. HB2 created a lot of media attention. All this attention created a bit of hostile environment for transgender people in NC.

Lisa

I'm in NC and have always gone to the ladies' restroom. I did get a lot more relaxed about it once my gender marker was changed to 'F' on my driver's license.

[ChrissyRyan]

I'm in NC and have always gone to the ladies' restroom. I did get a lot more relaxed about it once my gender marker was changed to 'F' on my driver's license.

Some people seem to have telephone conversations in the stall.  They flush sometimes when on the call.  I would wait to have calls, not anywhere in the bathrooms.  Not even if I was in a bathroom at my place.

Chrissy

[Lisa89125]

I'm in NC and have always gone to the ladies' restroom. I did get a lot more relaxed about it once my gender marker was changed to 'F' on my driver's license.

It probably has to due more with location within the state. I live in a republican conservative portion of the state in Eastern NC.

If I lived in the capital or over in Charlotte I'd be less paranoid. I here those areas are more trans friendly.

Lisa

[ChrissyRyan]

Besides unisex one stall public restrooms, disabled persons equipped single stall public restrooms, and the family publc restrooms, has anyone seen public restrooms in the USA that truly are "all gender" and have multiple stalls and possibly urinals?

Chrissy

[IAmM]

There is an lgbt club in Minneapolis called Lush that has fully a fully integrated restroom.

[Rachel]

When I went to NC for hair transplants twice I carried my birth certificate, passport and of coarse drivers license. I had no issues. One thing I found interesting is the guy at the Hotel addressed me as sir the first time I went there. The second time I went was about 6 or 9 months later and the same guy addressed me as female.

I was very paranoid at the airport but had no issue. I had no issues at restaurants either.

I wonder if there was an issue and I have every federal and state document stating my name and gender on them then what would they do?

[IAmM]

Grr! In a hurry never really works for me.

It is the only restroom that they have as far as I know. I think that there urinals, I was having too much fun to even think about it.

Okay, last edit I need sleep. My friend says that she is pretty sure that there are urinals in another room just past the sink and stalls.

[Beverly Anne]

It probably has to due more with location within the state. I live in a republican conservative portion of the state in Eastern NC.

If I lived in the capital or over in Charlotte I'd be less paranoid. I here those areas are more trans friendly.

Lisa

True. I'm in Charlotte, and it's really progressive. In fact, Charlotte's local trans-friendly ordinance is the reason the state legislature did HB2, which has since been modified. More rural community legislators wanted to override Charlotte's trans-supportive law. Rural areas cause equity issues all over the nation.

[Linde]

I had a power shopping day today (I have to keep up with Barbie), and went to the restroom a TJ Max, Bealls, Marshalls and Culverts.  I did not see a single woman talk with another one, and I did not see either what would make those restrooms to become a sanctuary.  They seem to be identical to the male rooms, sans the urinals.
i don't feel funny or anything, i just go in and do my business, wash my hands, and leave.  I also used the ladies changing rooms in the three clothing stores, again, I do not engage in conversation.  My voice is pretty high, I just make the mistake to slip into male talking patterns once in awhile.  Because of this I use only very short sentences or single words when I talk with cashiers, etc.
But I do not see any reason that I, a woman, who still has male plumbing, have to go into a male restroom or changing room.  It is all a matter of confidence, just go in and show that this is the facility that is the right one for you.  There were at least three women I saw today, that had very male facial features, but a rather high pitch voice.  I wonder whether those females think it over each time if they pass or not? and if they can go to the restroom for females?

[Arianna Valentine]

I had a power shopping day today (I have to keep up with Barbie), and went to the restroom a TJ Max, Bealls, Marshalls and Culverts.  I did not see a single woman talk with another one, and I did not see either what would make those restrooms to become a sanctuary.  They seem to be identical to the male rooms, sans the urinals.
i don't feel funny or anything, i just go in and do my business, wash my hands, and leave.  I also used the ladies changing rooms in the three clothing stores, again, I do not engage in conversation.  My voice is pretty high, I just make the mistake to slip into male talking patterns once in awhile.  Because of this I use only very short sentences or single words when I talk with cashiers, etc.
But I do not see any reason that I, a woman, who still has male plumbing, have to go into a male restroom or changing room.  It is all a matter of confidence, just go in and show that this is the facility that is the right one for you.  There were at least three women I saw today, that had very male facial features, but a rather high pitch voice.  I wonder whether those females think it over each time if they pass or not? and if they can go to the restroom for females?

I have to say I did notice that the ladies room does smell better in the men's room most of the time

If you can't accept yourself,  how can you expect others to accept you?

[Zoey421]

I want to thank Dee for pointing me to this thread. I came out TG 5 weeks and still live with my wife and kids (15 and 20), so I don't dress girly often unless I travel out of my small town to downtown Vancouver (BC). I generally look for disabled or family rooms so I'm in a private area. I appreciate the tips to take a cis-woman friend with me the first few times, to walk in without hesitation and "own it", so to speak, to be social as much as someone should be, and to ensure I am presenting female. It's still a daunting experience on the horizon.

I really appreciate the discussion and learning about other TGs experiences as I go through my own process.

Hugs Zoey

[KimOct]

Zoey I specifically came to this thread because I saw you posted.  It sounds like you gained some valuable insight from reading this topic.  The reason I am chiming in is to let you know it is scary at first - but you can do it.  There are going to be times during your early transition that are challenging but you will get through them.  We all did.

You will be surprised it will almost for sure be a non issue, 99.999%.  In my opinion just make sure that it is visible that you identify as female and it will be fine.

[Jessica]

I will preface this comment with the fact I haven't read all the replies on this thread.

I feel entirely comfortable using the women's restroom...... as long as I'm presenting female.  But often enough it's just androgynous and could cause second looks, prompting me to consider my choices.
When I am using the women's room, I am conscious of the fact that women pee differently than men.  Whereas when men pee, they at the end 'squirt' out the last bit, women pee continuously through gravity.  So I have to make sure I redirect the last pulse towards the side, creating no sound at that point.  I don't have a clue if that last bit of interrupted sound would be noticed, but I prefer not to take the chance.