Does it hurt us to be in stealth?

[Shana A]

* Rachael issues all androgyne's with macs.

R >

Rachael, it took me a minute to realize that a "mac" is a raincoat LOL... luckily I listened to the Beatles when I was a kid, so I understand some British expressions  I was about to tell you that I already use a Mac (computer) 

y2g

[Rachael]

what is it with ->-bleeped-<-s and computers!!!!
R >

[Shana A]

what is it with ->-bleeped-<-s and computers!!!!
R >

How else would we visit the forum?

y2g <walking along side of the internet highway with hir thumb stuck out, trying to flag a ride>

[NicholeW.]

Yes, Rachael, I find that I'm constantly tortured by the deadly torment of people knowing I am a natal female. It really is excruciating.

N~

[Rachael]

Yes, Rachael, I find that I'm constantly tortured by the deadly torment of people knowing I am a natal female. It really is excruciating.

N~

Arnt you just!
doesnt it make you just wanna scream to the world ' Im a ->-bleeped-<-! accept me as i come! Wig, high heels and all!





then again, no
R >

[NicholeW.]

I always am walking about feeling that I need a sign-board that says "TRANSSEXUAL, please discriminate against!"  

BTW -- no wig. no heels, normally. Once in a blue moon I will wear heels. Limit, about four hours. Have to keep time in heels down. I don't bind my feet or experience clitordectomies either!!

N~

[cindybc]

"Hey, hey." I have no problems nor do I have any pain. I am me, and if someone wishes to expresses their dislike to me, I am quite prepared to respond to them, "hey man!"  go pee pee up a rope. I have been living as who I am, Cindy for the last 7 years, Ok I may not be a natal GG as much as I wish I was, but shhhhhhh don't tell anyone ok?

As I mentioned in a previous post that even if I don't pass 100% nor am doing any stealth, but I  will continue to be me. I haven't even given a thought about being Transsexual for past 7 years, well, at least not until I came back here. Yes my roots are Transsexual, but to tell the truth I feel honored and humbled to be who I am, and I do my part to be there for my newly adopted transsexual bro/Sis.

On the other side of the coin, If one was to address me as to who I present I will smile some, but if someone was to address me as anything else but the proper gender well!!!!! as long as they don't call me late for supper. "Hee, hee!" Na all kidding aside, I know I don't pass completely and does it really matter? After all  I am just an old bat. There are still a lot of wonderful loving folks out there, so our world is not completely populated by A-holes

Cindy

[Hypatia]

I used to read about stealth and think it was an impossible dream because at first my appearance was a total failure.

Nowadays my appearance is a success. Stealth (or something approximating it, assuming no one does a background check*) is within my reach. That means I need to arrive at my own opinion on the subject now. I like Dennis's solution. I just be the woman I am and don't need go around advertising how I got to be a woman. But if anyone knows, it isn't a big deal. I'm showing by how I live my life that it isn't a big deal, and hopefully others will take their cue from that. I can shrug off being clocked, as long as people are respectful about it... and get the pronouns right.

I also go to the legislature to lobby for LGBT equal rights. I actually participate in LGBT politics not because I'm trans but because I'm bisexual (with strongly lesbian tendencies), and I believe that gay & lesbian liberation is just the right thing to do. When I go to LGBT gatherings, I wind up hanging with the lesbians and bi women. There is often a trans event as a sideshow to the larger LGBT event, but I tend to miss those because I feel I fit in better with the women. To me "transgender" is meaningless as an identity. I'm a woman. I identify as a woman, and I hang with women's groups.

*However, it seems all the jobs around Washington DC these days require a security clearance or at least an official background investigation. So I cheerfully inform them of my previous name and everything, and let them draw their own conclusions if they like. Apparently my female presentation is so good that the last security officer I talked to, after she read my application, still had no clue I used to live as male. Even though I had just handed her a tacit admission of it. Now that's stealth, LOL -- hiding in plain sight!

[Rachael]

bingo... Its why i prefer stealth, i dont have any compusion to hang around transpeople...
although i am in the uni lgbt as trans rep, something i want to drop... even if i am doing it in an incognito aproach...
R >

[NicholeW.]

... move on to do the other things in life that interest me.

Perhaps the best point of all. When one has interests other than her pain she is often able to move right on along to other things that interest her much more.

N~

[Steph]

This whole debate on being stealth or not is really quite pointless.  Who really gives a monkey's if I'm stealth.  Why should it matter if I'm out and proud (to borrow a phrase from the Queer movement) or living stealth.  There are many, many TS who have no choice on being out.  For example those who transition in the workplace and remain in the workplace have no hope of being stealth no matter how hard they try.  I find it hard to believe that there are TS out there who endure the torture of transition just to be out and proud, as given the choice I believe everyone would want to be stealth.  Those who choose to be out and proud should be applauded along with those who choose not to.  It hurts no one except the person who may have to live their life being out and not wanting it that way.  ME.

I transitioned at work and thanks to a disgruntled ex-employee who outed me to everyone she met I am now un-stealth.  Yes I have a choice... I could run away and move to some other location, but you know something there isn't anyone one big enough to run this girl out of town, so I fight, I fight for my rights, and you know something, I'm winning.

I live, work, and socialize just like any other woman, wether being naked in the shower with other women, having great sex like other women.  I try and live my life as stealth as possible, but lets face it we all run the risk of being discovered, then what.  For me as I live in a relatively small city where I transitioned I'll out myself when it comes time to have sex with a guy it's just the way I am, I would hate him to find out weeks later into a relationship that in his eye's I had deceived him.  But that's just me.

Steph

[Rachael]

the non stealth attack the stealth for being stealth
the stealthdont seem to give a crap, apart from thier right to choose...

i think its time to accept that some want to be out, and some dont, its a personal choice, and affects your life only.
DEAL WITH IT.
R >

[cindybc]

Hi Hypatia, Congratulations. and you go girl. I will pray that you get the job.

Cindy

[Hypatia]

Hi Hypatia, Congratulations. and you go girl. I will pray that you get the job.

Cindy

Thanks, honey


Posted on: January 30, 2008, 12:26:04 AM

I find it hard to believe that there are TS out there who endure the torture of transition just to be out and proud, as given the choice I believe everyone would want to be stealth.  Those who choose to be out and proud should be applauded along with those who choose not to.

I liked the job I had and wanted to keep it. So I transitioned in place. I was fine with that. A few individuals tried to cause problems for me, but I responded to HR appropriately and management supported me. On the whole I was quite happy there. But I lost my job, for a reason I just found out, it was basically just for being trans-- they trumped up some unjustified anti-trans propaganda against me-- it was rather blatant that they were using my out and proud transsexualism to justify getting rid of me! So that aspect of it was not cool at all.

[Berliegh]

the non stealth attack the stealth for being stealth
the stealthdont seem to give a crap, apart from thier right to choose...

i think its time to accept that some want to be out, and some dont, its a personal choice, and affects your life only.
DEAL WITH IT.
R >

I agree......whatever glove fits...

[Sarah]

  I find it hard to believe that there are TS out there who endure the torture of transition just to be out and proud, as given the choice I believe everyone would want to be stealth. 

Transition isn't torture for me Steph.
For some I don't think it ends up that way.
I am young though, I go to college -an art collage at that.
If I had 30 years invested in a life or family or profession that suddenly dicided I was not worth knowing simply because I was not the gender I had portrayed myself to be all the years, I would probably be very tortured.
It would be most difficult.
That can be said for any major life change that late in life, it's more difficult when you have most of your life invested in it and you are already middle aged.
Midlife crisis all over again.

For me though, I don't have to go through that.
My school is accepting of me, so I don't have to worry about switching schools or majors.
I have support of parents even though they don't completely understand, and my town is very liberal. Especialy torwards Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, and Transgender issues.

Now, it is woth a note that I chose some of this.
I chose to live here for a reason.
I chose art school for a reason. (With some help of my father)
My parrents not being total bigots was a blessing,(and they have thier own issues too as some who have read some of my posts might know) but the rest of it I could have done without.

I suppose I would have picked my battles regardless of where I lived and how I was born.

If I had been born in Kentucky or Mississippi, I would move out of there rather than try to transition there and deal with it there.
That would be misreble. People would have big issues with it.
So I don't do that.
I mean, why should I make things difficult for myself?
Things can be difficult without that.

For some of us, I think transitioning is fun and pleasant.
Imagine what it would be like if you were in our shoes.
I don't think it has to be misreble by the very nature of the thing.
I think it can be quite fun for some.
Sara

[cindybc]

Hi Sara, I do love your thoughts and feelings and I can identify with much of what you said about coming out in your home town, so have I, and way to my surprise the people turned out to be supportive. Yes quit a liberal little town it was. Hon, I am one of those late comers, but I am a very grateful person that I didn't miss the bus all together. As to who I became, it was very much an asset in the work I was doing at the time. So I just don't sweat it anymore, I go where I want, anywhere I want without any fear. Today I embrace who I am and I am at peace with the one that resides within. I wish I would have started the journey sooner, but what the heck, enjoy the crap out of what's left of it like there was not tomorrow is the way I look at it.

Cindy

[Sarah]

Hi Sara, I do love your thoughts and feelings and I can identify with much of what you said about coming out in your home town, so have I, and way to my surprise the people turned out to be supportive. Yes quit a liberal little town it was. Hon, I am one of those late comers, but I am a very grateful person that I didn't miss the bus all together. As to who I became, it was very much an asset in the work I was doing at the time. So I just don't sweat it anymore, I go where I want, anywhere I want without any fear. Today I embrace who I am and I am at peace with the one that resides within. I wish I would have started the journey sooner, but what the heck, enjoy the crap out of what's left of it like there was not tomorrow is the way I look at it.

Cindy

YAy!

[Melissa]

Since I have had the luxury of being able to do so, I pretty much live in stealth, unless I choose to be out with somebody.  Most of my friends have no idea I'm TS.  When coming out to people, one thing I've noticed is that when I tell somebody and they accept me for who I am anyways, it takes a lot of pressure off.  However, if I tell somebody and they blow me off, although you can reason that they weren't worth it anyways, it still hurts.  It's a real toss-up whether to tell somebody or not, and being stealth is a nice way to avoid having to confront it.  However, I highly doubt I would ever do deep stealth, since that brings about an entirely new level of stress that I doubt I could deal with.  I've been with 2 guys so far that knew I was TS, knew I was pre-op, were definitely straight and didn't have any problem with me because they still saw me as 100% female.  I don't see deep stealth as being a necessity for anything.  One of my problems with stealth is that I hate lying to people.  I usually just carefully choose my wording and let them interpret it how they want.  However, it can get be tricky.  For instance, I was with this girl and I had told her I had only been with women sexually.  Then later, I ended up telling her I had kids.  Both statements are true, but she got very confused and couldn't fit the pieces together until I revealed I wasn't exactly born with a female body (my favorite way of phrasing it).

One major reason I chose to be stealth (besides obviously not wanting to have to pull aside every single person I come into contact with and letting them know what I have in my pants) is because I wanted to get the genuine experience of being known and treated as a GG, which I would have been if I were born correctly.  Believe me, there IS a difference between how a GG and a known TS are treated.  You have much more freedom being seen as GG, but you also lose the freedom of not having your past become an obstacle course.  I think what it really comes down to is which type of freedom is important to you?

[Suzy]

If I had 30 years invested in a life or family or profession that suddenly dicided I was not worth knowing simply because I was not the gender I had portrayed myself to be all the years, I would probably be very tortured.
It would be most difficult.
That can be said for any major life change that late in life, it's more difficult when you have most of your life invested in it and you are already middle aged.
Midlife crisis all over again.

You are so very right about that, Sara.  I am glad you recognize that.  So many younger girls here just don't get that.

For some of us, I think transitioning is fun and pleasant.
Imagine what it would be like if you were in our shoes.
I don't think it has to be misreble by the very nature of the thing.
I think it can be quite fun for some.
Sara

This is the attitude we should all have.  There is more than enough miserable stuff to go around.  I just want to enjoy the parts of this I can, live in the moment,  and have fun in all of the marvelous discoveries.  What could be wrong with that?  If it's just all total grief, maybe we should rethink why we're doing this and who we are.

Kristi