First steps towards myself

[Seshatneferw]

I did not mean to set off a debate, sorry about that.

No, I'm sorry that we managed to hijack this thread for a silly flame skirmish (not yet an out-and-out war, luckily).

As for the hair, I discovered the effect only works if I am clean shaven, once the sideburn stubble shows the effect is completely ruined. Which is a bummer since I grow a beard fast. It does reduce the masculinity in my face which is nice, I really like the way it looks. Too bad I am lazy and hate shaving every day.

Well, yes, that's part of the reason I tried an epilator for a while. Unfortunately, it needs a good grip on the hair so I had to stop shaving for weekends. That didn't seem a good trade-off, so in the end I reverted to just plain daily shaving. Also, while epilating includes a weekly adrenaline high, it's not for people with a low pain threshold ('Why are you hitting your head with a hammer?' 'Because it feels so wonderful when I stop.'). Waxing might be a somewhat better solution, if you don't want (or afford) to get rid of the hair permanently (yet).

  Nfr

[Simone Louise]

I also hated shaving; that was one of several reasons why I grew a beard. I also have long hair which I wear in a ponytail because it minimizes fights with my wife and daughter, and because I really don't know what to do with long hair. And I gather the ponytail low on the back rather that atop the head. Alas, that seems to be what most men with ponytails do.

I asked some questions about the meaning of an appearance that is neither masculine nor feminine, not to participate in any fight. The definition just caught me be surprise, because I had a different impression of the people participating in this forum. If the beard offends, I can leave and wrestle with these gender questions on my own again. I've fought for the right to let both plots of hair grow, and I am not yet willing to cut one or the other just to abide by someone's rules for dealing with the knowledge that I am not of the male gender. Someday, I may drastically alter my appearance to reflect my inner being, but I don't know how or when.

Simone

[Veetje]

Well I hope you will come to a point where you can be more in-to-touch with yourself physicially Simone...personally I would always be open to familiy and friends about what I will be doing

But I guess its easier for me since I dont have a spouse and am rather young at 23

Its something I am quite happy with and I always tell potential partners of my T issues beforehand

[sd]

because I really don't know what to do with long hair. And I gather the ponytail low on the back rather that atop the head. Alas, that seems to be what most men with ponytails do.

I asked some questions about the meaning of an appearance that is neither masculine nor feminine, not to participate in any fight. The definition just caught me be surprise, because I had a different impression of the people participating in this forum.

I do the same with my ponytail, partly for the same reason.
I am not bothered by the questions, we are all in this together. Personally, the more we share the more we can learn.

have you thought about laser on your beard area the effect of that is quite amazing and the other plus side is you dont need to shave anymore well not as much anyway

Absolutely.
My neck is becoming rather sensitive to shaving, though it could be that my shaver is just getting old and dull.

The cost is what is holding me back from laser or I would be all over it. There are some home (D.I.Y.) ones out now, but the results are a bit on the poor side and they take a while (could partly be user error on much of it). They cost much less than a single treatment so I am looking to find a decent one, if it exists. I am not holding my breath on that though.

I may bite the bullet and get one treatment though, it would thin it out some or thin the hairs which are quite course. All of which would be an improvement.

Posted on: February 07, 2008, 11:53:26 AM

Well I hope you will come to a point where you can be more in-to-touch with yourself physicially Simone...personally I would always be open to familiy and friends about what I will be doing

But I guess its easier for me since I dont have a spouse and am rather young at 23

Its something I am quite happy with and I always tell potential partners of my T issues beforehand

I don't have a spouse luckily (?), but I am older and run my own business which requires me to travel to various businesses constantly. I don't have to just deal with my customers, but theirs a well. I have to be careful and not upset that. I already stand out going into a place being as big as I am and having such long hair, I apparently leave an impression. And with what I charge, I probably should try to blend a bit better into the environment or look more "professional" than I do now.

You are lucky you have figured this out at a the age you have. You are a bit more free to experiment, people will just chalk it up to you being young, and most likely you do not have as much worry regarding your job, I didn't at that age. Your generation is much more open as well. I see what some kids are doing in high school and college these days and cannot imagine just how many beatings they would have taken at the schools I went to.

[Simone Louise]

This morning, one of my colleagues at UPS grabbed my ponytail in one hand and a box knife in the other and threatened to cut off the ponytail. It was in jest, but since it is the subject of almost daily jests, it ceases to be only a joke (I am one of the shortest and certainly the oldest working at the warehouse, so I stand out anyway). The incident probably colored my morning posting, sorry.

The social environment was different when I was 23. It had taken me 5 years and 2 summer sessions to get a BA (probably due to the ADD that a counselor diagnosed when I was 60), and then 6 months to get the first full-time permanent job. My father died that year, too. Gender was way down on the priority list, and, even so, I wouldn't have known the first thing about how to deal with it (no internet then). Of course, I did know I was different from a very early age.

Simone

[sd]

This morning, one of my colleagues at UPS grabbed my ponytail in one hand and a box knife in the other and threatened to cut off the ponytail. It was in jest, but since it is the subject of almost daily jests, it ceases to be only a joke (I am one of the shortest and certainly the oldest working at the warehouse, so I stand out anyway). The incident probably colored my morning posting, sorry.

Simone

Gee, that never happens to me... 
People are so damn predictable sometimes.
I think this is worse than just horseplay to us, my hair is like part of my identity anymore. May as well try to cut an ear off.


Society sucks, lets all pitch in and buy our own island, even if it means living in a hut.
Would still need internet access though. A hut with a satellite dish, I could live with that.

[Jaimey]

you know what's funny?  it's seems like all the male bodied androgynes have or want long hair and I just keep hacking mine off! (I'm female bodied, if you didn't know or hadn't guessed...it's long now, but that's just because I'm lazy...we'll be taking care of that next weekend, hopefully...)

and as a simple request, please, for the love of everything holy and androgyne, let's not debate the definition of androgyne AGAIN.  Seriously. 

And sd, it's not your fault at all.  We like to argue. 

[sd]

And sd, it's not your fault at all.  We like to argue. 

No, we don't. (someone had to say it, though once again, I agree).

I too noticed the hair trend and it makes sense in terms of hiding what our bodies betray.

I was not sure, but your writing style does occasionally have a feminine twist to it (more honest emotion), almost poetic. Which to be quite honest, I love, I strive for that. Mine is typically male... bland. I struggle to inject any sense of emotion which in turn comes off sounding cheap.

[Pica Pica]

I plan to be sheared soon.

[Nero]

I plan to be sheared soon.

I certainly hope not.

[Seshatneferw]

you know what's funny?  it's seems like all the male bodied androgynes have or want long hair and I just keep hacking mine off!

Not all. I've never had long hair, I just don't want to get rid of it completely. Wouldn't be very androgynous, you see.

Although I do have my Samson moments. There was this one incident during my military days involving four drunken sergeants, myself (with almost as much alcohol in me as the four of them combined), and one of those electric shear gadgets. As a proof of my fighting spirit, the next morning my hair was still about as long as the regulations allowed.

  Nfr

[Simone Louise]

you know what's funny?  it's seems like all the male bodied androgynes have or want long hair and I just keep hacking mine off! (I'm female bodied, if you didn't know or hadn't guessed...it's long now, but that's just because I'm lazy...we'll be taking care of that next weekend, hopefully...)

Is this an extension of youthful rebellion? My mother would threaten to put a bow in my hair if I didn't have it cut immediately. I was often told to shave in the evening when I had shaved that morning. "A gentleman always keeps a tie in the glove compartment of his car--in case he needs one." On the other hand, I was never forced to wear a dress, as some female bodied androgynes have complained. Oh,and I, too, am lazy.

Simone

[Jaimey]

I was not sure, but your writing style does occasionally have a feminine twist to it (more honest emotion), almost poetic. Which to be quite honest, I love, I strive for that. Mine is typically male... bland. I struggle to inject any sense of emotion which in turn comes off sounding cheap.

That's interesting...I've always wondered how I speak (er, write).  I think my writing is more like that than my speech.  I have a hard time being honest and emotional when I speak...I'm too concerned with being polite and not making people uncomfortable.  I'm working on it though.  I feel like any emotion I say outloud to my friends/family sounds cheap too...everyone looks at me like I'm nuts.  But then again, I know that I sound really detached when I talk to people that I'm not comfortable being emotional around.  It just couldn't be easy, could it?  (Thank goodness for places like this where we can actually be ourselves!!!!)

That was a pretty awesome compliment...I feel special!   I would like to be a writer, so it's always nice to get some feedback. 

Is this an extension of youthful rebellion? My mother would threaten to put a bow in my hair if I didn't have it cut immediately. I was often told to shave in the evening when I had shaved that morning. "A gentleman always keeps a tie in the glove compartment of his car--in case he needs one." On the other hand, I was never forced to wear a dress, as some female bodied androgynes have complained. Oh,and I, too, am lazy.

Simone

You know what's really weird?  As much of a tomboy as I was (in many ways) forced to be, my dad especially was all idealistic about girls having long hair.  I had dresses and really boyish clothes, but I was so confused that I didn't have any ideas about what I wanted to be wearing...it took me long time to come into my own...i'm still not there completely. 

[sd]

That's interesting...I've always wondered how I speak (er, write).  I think my writing is more like that than my speech.  I have a hard time being honest and emotional when I speak...I'm too concerned with being polite and not making people uncomfortable.  I'm working on it though.  I feel like any emotion I say outloud to my friends/family sounds cheap too...everyone looks at me like I'm nuts.  But then again, I know that I sound really detached when I talk to people that I'm not comfortable being emotional around.  It just couldn't be easy, could it?  (Thank goodness for places like this where we can actually be ourselves!!!!)

That was a pretty awesome compliment...I feel special!   I would like to be a writer, so it's always nice to get some feedback. 

Glad I could brighten your day.


As for becoming a writer, just start writing.
I am working on an autobiography, and while I consider much of my life normal, it is more exciting than some I have read about. Of course, I keep getting about 20 pages in and then junking it, but I am trying. Don't worry about proper English or anything, a great teacher once told me that great writers know when to break the rules. Just get started on it you will do fine. Just relax and try not to write when you are excited. 

[Jaimey]

Glad I could brighten your day.

You did indeed. 

As for becoming a writer, just start writing.
I am working on an autobiography, and while I consider much of my life normal, it is more exciting than some I have read about. Of course, I keep getting about 20 pages in and then junking it, but I am trying. Don't worry about proper English or anything, a great teacher once told me that great writers know when to break the rules. Just get started on it you will do fine. Just relax and try not to write when you are excited. 

I write a lot.  I can't help but use (mostly) proper English.    I'm a big fan of the sentence fragment.  Have you ever read "Now is the Hour" by Tom Spanbauer?  He has a really interesting style.  He made me realize how awesome incomplete sentences are.  Plus, it works much better with my thought process.    I write fiction.  I can't write form personal experience. 

I've junked so many stories...heh.  It would be nice if I could finish a book too...but it's SO HARD to get it right!   

[sd]

Have you ever read "Now is the Hour" by Tom Spanbauer? 

Never heard of him, but I am not up on authors.
I go into book stores and I get lost (silly isn't it?). One of the last books I read was "The Zombie Survival Guide: Complete Protection from the Living Dead" so you can tell where my literary tastes lay... The gutter.






In my defense, I have taken the time to read some classics, Moby Dick, Orsen Wells and such, so I am not as bad as it seems.

[Jaimey]

Have you ever read "Now is the Hour" by Tom Spanbauer? 

Never heard of him, but I am not up on authors.
I go into book stores and I get lost (silly isn't it?). One of the last books I read was "The Zombie Survival Guide: Complete Protection from the Living Dead" so you can tell where my literary tastes lay... The gutter.

It's easy to get lost in bookstores!  I love bookstores!  Spanbauer taught the (what's it called...hmm...I don't remember exactly) master class that Chuck Palahnuik took before he wrote Fight Club...if that means anything to you...I've never read Palahnuik.  It's good though.  It's about Rigby John, a gay teen growing up in Idaho in the 50s/60s...it's awesome.

I once read a book called "Nymphos of Rocky Flats"...my tastes often lay in the gutter as well...

[sd]

Have you ever read "Now is the Hour" by Tom Spanbauer? 

Never heard of him, but I am not up on authors.
I go into book stores and I get lost (silly isn't it?). One of the last books I read was "The Zombie Survival Guide: Complete Protection from the Living Dead" so you can tell where my literary tastes lay... The gutter.

It's easy to get lost in bookstores!  I love bookstores!  Spanbauer taught the (what's it called...hmm...I don't remember exactly) master class that Chuck Palahnuik took before he wrote Fight Club...if that means anything to you...I've never read Palahnuik.  It's good though.  It's about Rigby John, a gay teen growing up in Idaho in the 50s/60s...it's awesome.

I once read a book called "Nymphos of Rocky Flats"...my tastes often lay in the gutter as well...

Ha ha
I loved Fight Club. I would say total head trip, but I figured it out half way in. Other peoples experience with it is fun to watch though.

[Pica Pica]

I'm a big fan of the sentence fragment.  Have you ever read "Now is the Hour" by Tom Spanbauer?  He has a really interesting style.  He made me realize how awesome incomplete sentences are.  Plus, it works much better with my thought process.    I write fiction.  I can't write form personal experience. 

I'm fond of the fragment, it portrays speech really well with all the unsaid things, and also represents what it feels like to be bombarded by images.

[Jaimey]

I'm fond of the fragment, it portrays speech really well with all the unsaid things, and also represents what it feels like to be bombarded by images.

Exactly!  Things make more sense in fragments sometimes.  I think in fragments...sometimes I have to put forth effort to speak in complete sentences.

I never did see Fight Club, but I know what you're talking about.  I should probably read some Palahnuik sometime...all my friends at Borders liked his stuff...hmm.  Now I want to see Fight Club...