Anti-gay remarks blasted

[Shana A]

 Anti-gay remarks blasted

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080314_1_A1_hrpWa63056

By SHANNON MUCHMORE World Staff Writer
3/14/2008

Community leaders on Thursday denounced state Rep. Sally Kern's recent comments about homosexuality and asked legislators to respond by passing hate crimes legislation that encompasses sexual orientation and gender identity.

Nancy McDonald, the president of the Tulsa Chapter of Parents, Families and Friends of Lesbians and Gays also called on Kern, R-Oklahoma City, to make a public apology for saying she thinks homosexuality is "the biggest threat that our nation has, even more so than terrorism or Islam."

[cindianna_jones]

I've heard of this threat.  But I would sincerely like to hear why these people feel this way.  What could happen from this "threat"?  How could GLBT people bring the government down?  Where are the details in this hate speech?  I really want to know what they think. 

I believe that if they could further delineate their line of thinking, it would generate a lot less hate.  For their hate would more easily be seen as illogical and unreasonable.

Cindi

[Hazumu]

Nah, Cindi;

Let's just annoy the hell out of the Jeebus People by asking 'Why?' five times for each pronouncement -- or, at least trying to before they have a hissy fit and commend us to hell...

Karen

[cindianna_jones]

hell? .... Hell?.... HELL?  Show me the way.  I think that it's going to be a lot more fun if all my friends will be there.  Who wants to sit around on a cloud for eternity with a harp?  What will they be doing in heaven if the party is down stairs?  They'll still be condemning us I suspect.  Good for them.  Better for us!

Cindi

[Sheila]

Heaven and Hell are in the minds of the beholder. It is a belief and there is no proof that it exists. Name one person who has come back to tell.

[cindianna_jones]

What Sheila?  Haven't you ever watched Ghost Hunters?  Isn't that proof?  There are so many people that watch it.  It must be true! <wink>

It really doesn't matter from my perspective. There may very well be a God. Who am I to say.  But... if a God did create us. He would certainly have enough love for his children to not punish them for eternity for a biological mistake.

I hear of the atonement and redemption from the Christian side, and I would suggest that if it were true, then God the Father, would find a way to forgive all in some way or another.  I find the references to Hell in the written scripture to not be literal.  Rather it is figurative making me think that indeed it would be a mental thing rather than physical.  But that's just my perspective.

Even though I think that life ends when you die, it would be nice though to see those who are monsters in this life trying to make up for what they have done in the life to come in some way.   I can not imagine that they would be burning for eternity however.  Maybe we could make them plumbers... you know, unplugging the toilets in heaven.

Cindi

[Sheila]

Cindi,
  I do believe in a higher being, God or whatever their name would be. I just don't believe in heaven or hell. I do believe in spirits that live within us and maybe there are some ghosts who knows. I did have a strong feeling of my Grandmother after she passed. She had a strong presence in my growing up that it might have been all in my mind. Don't go into my mind, it will put you over the line. Yes, I have watched Ghost Hunters, scared me. <wink>
Sheila

[Lisbeth]

I've heard of this threat.  But I would sincerely like to hear why these people feel this way.  What could happen from this "threat"?  How could GLBT people bring the government down?  Where are the details in this hate speech?  I really want to know what they think. 

I believe that if they could further delineate their line of thinking, it would generate a lot less hate.  For their hate would more easily be seen as illogical and unreasonable.

Cindi

The line of reasoning is as follows:

By promoting the "gay agenda" homosexuals cause more and more Americans to sin, either by becoming homosexuals themselves or approving of others who are homosexual.  This will piss god off to the point that he will destroy the United States.  Therefore the "gay agenda" will be the cause of America being destroyed.  Q.E.D.

[Hazumu]

...God's gonna use Quantum ElectroDynamics to do it

> >

<ducks>

=K

[Shana A]

The line of reasoning is as follows:

By promoting the "gay agenda" homosexuals cause more and more Americans to sin, either by becoming homosexuals themselves or approving of others who are homosexual.  This will piss god off to the point that he will destroy the United States.  Therefore the "gay agenda" will be the cause of America being destroyed.  Q.E.D.

I think we're doing a fine job of destroying the US without g-d's help.  A couple more republican administrations combined w/ citizen apathy should finish it up nicely 

Z

[tekla]

Funny, I thought g-d was using the Bush family to do it.  Damn fine job of it too.

[Hazumu]

I think we're doing a fine job of destroying the US without g-d's help.  A couple more republican administrations combined w/ citizen apathy should finish it up nicely 

Z

Destroying the US that was has been hugely successful so far... =K

Bush Is Not Incompetent

by George Lakoff, Marc Ettlinger, Sam Ferguson

Rockridge Institute

"Progressives have fallen into a trap. Emboldened by President Bush's plummeting approval ratings, progressives increasingly point to Bush's "failures" and label him and his administration as incompetent. For example, Nancy Pelosi said "The situation in Iraq and the reckless economic policies in the United States speak to one issue for me, and that is the competence of our leader." Self-satisfying as this criticism may be, it misses the bigger point. Bush's disasters — Katrina, the Iraq War, the budget deficit — are not so much a testament to his incompetence or a failure of execution. Rather, they are the natural, even inevitable result of his conservative governing philosophy. It is conservatism itself, carried out according to plan, that is at fault. Bush will not be running again, but other conservatives will. His governing philosophy is theirs as well. We should be putting the onus where it belongs, on all conservative office holders and candidates who would lead us off the same cliff."

[tekla]

Only because pointing to his "successes" is pretty much the null set.

[Shana A]

Bush Is Not Incompetent

by George Lakoff, Marc Ettlinger, Sam Ferguson

Everyone should read Lakoff's books, preferably before the next election... His analysis regarding the ways that the right wing frame their beliefs to get people who are being screwed by their policies to vote for them is right on.

Z

[cindianna_jones]

I think that Bush's policies have been stunning successes..... for him, his family, friends, and cronies.  Government by the corporation and for the corporation.  We believe that every corporation has unalienable rights.....  That used to be defined as fascism.  We've somehow modified its definition to be synonymous to Hitler's despotism for the barons' benefit... you know...  so that we don't make the obvious connections to its disasters in the 20th century.

Did you know for example that corporations have been given the same rights as a person?  Wouldn't it be nice for them to extend those rights to US?

Cindi

[tekla]

Silly me, I thought we elected them to - ahh ->-bleeped-<-, I see my error now.

[Hazumu]

I've been rereading the book "Interface", by Neal Stephenson and George Jewsbury.

In the way that Catch-22 explained the military and The Right Stuff explained the culture of military pilots, I find that Interface explains the messy world of presidential elections.

The book was written in 1994, and the key plot-point at the beginning was that 'the president' had run the country into the ground and rung up a National Debt of the unimaginable amount of Three Trillion Dollars! -- hey, wait!  holy life-imitating-art Batman!!!

The sitting president proposes 'debt forgiveness'...

Naturally, the corporation network that bought that debt moves to protect their investment by buying the presidency.

I highly recommend reading it, both for the entertainment and so that you may see this election with eyes somewhat less clouded...

Karen

[tekla]

Did you know for example that corporations have been given the same rights as a person?

In one of the Supreme Courts more idiot moments, they did grant just that.  Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad Company, 118 U.S. 394 (1886) in case you want to look it up.  Thom Hartmann's  Unequal Protection: The Rise of Corporate Dominance and the Theft of Human Rights (2002) looks at the ruling and the fall out.

Do note that this is not a recent decision.